Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Lance Bass/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was not promoted 02:34, 13 December 2007.

[edit] Lance Bass

Self-nomination. This article has gone through extensive editing throughout the past 6 months, and I finally feel like it's up to FA status. It is "well written" in the sense that many pairs of eyes have made style suggestions, most of which were implemented. It is "comprehensive". It is "factually accurate", with over 100 mostly different references, many very high quality: New York Times, CNN, Associated Press, etc. It is neutral and doesn't present any bias... it is "stable", with no major ongoing edits - with the obvious exception of vandalism reverts. It has a summary lead section of the appropriate length covering all major topics in the rest of the article. It has a hierarchical system of headings and table of contents, and contains both free and fair use images. --MgCupcake 02:19, 4 December 2007 (UTC)

  • Oppose Uncomprehensive, needs a copyedit, needless trivia and fancruft. Way too much emphasis on space travel and sexual orientation politics and not enough on 'N Sync. Madcoverboy 06:39, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • "Subsequently, Bass's romantic life became regular blog and tabloid fodder." - POV, uncited, probably unverifiable
Removed. --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • "Bass's great uncle, Julius E. Bass, was a World War II pilot who was a prisoner of war in the German Stalag Luft I camp,[1][14] and a second great uncle, Clizzy Asco Bass, Jr., was a veteran of both World War II and the Korean War." - While interesting, non-notable in the context of a biography
Ouch. Okay, removed it. --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • "Bass joined Justin Timberlake, JC Chasez, Chris Kirkpatrick and Joey Fatone in the boy band 'N Sync, after the original bass singer, Jason Watkins, quit the group. In need of a replacement, the group began searching. Timberlake and his mother called Bass, following a recommendation by their mutual vocal coach, Westbrook." - Didn't I already read this in early life? Yes: "One of Bass's vocal coaches in the Mississippi Show Stoppers was Bob Westbrook, a professional vocal coach who had previously worked with young performers Justin Timberlake and Britney Spears.[12] Westbrook's connection to Timberlake would later play a large role in Bass joining 'N Sync." - Copyedit for repetition, flow
Removed repetition, will try and get it copyedited... --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • "Bass was an outgoing student who frequently hosted parties in his home and was elected vice president of his junior class. Bass has said that he was "extremely popular" among the female contingent of his high school[18] and was sexually active with girls during this time." - Take out the emphasis on the popularity fluff can go.
Removed it. --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • "After flying to Orlando, Florida .... my own innocence" - That's all there is to write about the N'Sync years, one paragraph?
I think if a reader really wanted to learn all about the 'N Sync years, they would read the 'N Sync article, wouldn't they? I'll work on adding 'N Sync stuff that directly affected Bass.--MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
Information regarding the band's early success and legal battles has been added. --MgCupcake (talk) 00:20, 5 December 2007 (UTC)
  • "In a November 2007 interview with GQ magazine, Bass revealed that the last time he ever spoke to Pearlman was in court." - Trivia. It's enough to say they're estranged and provide a cite.
Done. --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • The whole flying around, sexual experimentation section is unencyclopedic trivia.
Removed. --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • "...recording Celebrity, their last album before hiatus," - it's been 6 years, can we call it a break up? Or at least most recent album?
While Bass himself has said the band is broken up, he's the only member who has said that. The band never released an official statement. Does the term "permanent hiatus" work better? --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • "Bass branched out into acting, and received"
Done. --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • "who were seen only in the end credits" - fancruft
Removed.--MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • "Miramax marketed the film heavily towards 'N Sync's teen fans, and The film's soundtrack featured songs by fellow teen pop sensations Mandy Moore and BB Mak, along with previously unreleased tracks by 'N Sync and Britney Spears." -> "Although Miramax marketed the film heavily towards 'N Sync's teen fans, the film was a box-office flop, and grossed only $4.2 million domestically compared to its production budget of $10 million.
Done. --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • "Despite criticisms on his acting, ... the pre-teen crowd." -> "Critics had mixed reviews on Bass's acting."
Done. --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • "has gone on to make several other film appearances, with cameos" - redundant
Done. --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • In general, the film, telvision, theater, producing sections all need to be stripped of trivia & cruft and copyedited
Yikes. Working on this... --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • The spaceflight plans goes overboard describing the training. First and third paragraphs could be combined.
Done. --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • The coming out section is vastly bloated and overwrought
Working on this. Do you have any suggestions on what to cut out of it? --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Religious faith section should be condensed, split and/or collapsed into early life and coming out. Same for section on personal life.
I've condensed both. --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
Thank you for commenting. --MgCupcake 07:50, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Continue to oppose The article has improved markedly, but I remain concerned with the style of the article and continued presence of fancruft. The quotes interspersed throughout the article come across as journalistic or biographic instead of encyclopedic.
    • he feels 'N Sync is "definitely broken up.
    • he felt "completely betrayed"
    • "That was it - our film was finished... once the country went to war, there was no way our film was going to be on anyone's top-priority list."
    • "I’ve always wanted to do Broadway. I think every entertainer’s dream is to eventually do some kind of theater in New York."
    • "Lance is a very happy person and I'm sure he's got more in his life than this trip, so I'd be very surprised if he got that upset about it all."
    • "It was heartbreaking; there is no other word for it."
    • and so on...
  • Also, the pictures of Bass are all dated 2007 (exceptions being space & movie poster) which likewise seems unencyclopedic in coverage.
  • All of the press coverage and micro-drama surrounding who-knew-what-when and what he said in what magazine in response is borderline not-notable - it shouldn't be in a FA. Likewise the LGBT reaction to his comments could be pared down as well as his response to the criticism could also be condensed - something to the effect of "Bass asserted in the People interview that he still acted straight which drew criticism from LGBT groups about reinforcing stereotypes of effiminate gays. Bass later said his statements were misunderstood. He received a Human Rights Campaign visibility award on..."
  • I still see lots of fancruft about who he did or didn't date or have sex with, didn't marry, went to prom with, or so on spread throughout. You wouldn't see this in an article on Richard Feynman or Winston Churchill, so it shouldn't be here either. Madcoverboy (talk) 06:27, 11 December 2007 (UTC)
Fair enough. I don't see how we can do anything about the pictures being from 2007 - those are the only free images available at Commons. It's either that or no pictures at all. As for his romantic involvements being "fancruft", I beg to differ, seeing as other FA articles about pop singers, such as Mandy Moore, include a lot of information about the subject's romantic involvements. If it's talked about in the press, there's no reason it should be considered fancruft. But thanks. --MgCupcake (talk) 07:03, 11 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Comment: Autobiography does not fit in where you have put it, given the paragraph almost entirely refers to hs tales of being gay. Either more details about the book should be given (how many copies did it sell, for example?) or it should be added to the Coming Out section. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 11:13, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
Hmm. There's only half of a sentence in the whole paragraph that refers to his being gay. However, the section has been moved. --MgCupcake 18:38, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Comment Reference 12, from the Clarion Ledger, doesn't work. LuciferMorgan (talk) 05:27, 5 December 2007 (UTC)
Replaced it with a working ref. --MgCupcake (talk) 06:38, 5 December 2007 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.