Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/By the Way

The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted 16:08, 30 July 2007.

[edit] By the Way

In my opinion the best Chili Peppers album, although highly underrated. It was promoted to GA status in early June after a rewrite. Since then I've added a significant amount of information, and I'm hoping it can follow in Californication's footsteps and be promoted to Featured status. Self-nom. Have at. NSR77 ^T_C 04:44, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

• Support - I cleaned up a bunch of little things, and I think it looks good now. BenB4 14:10, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
• Support - I really like this album, and it's a very nicely written article. However, I have a question about the Singles chart. Why not source the three other thingies (like the UK Top 40, Modern Hits; only one is sourced). Also, what about other country's single's charting? For example, I randomly click on Sweden's info, and By The Way, Can't Stop, and The Zephyr Song all had been on the Swedish charts. Xihix 15:43, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

Reference 43 covers the entire table, other then the new material I added. Two more major country charts are up there now, but I decided not to add more as the table is becoming large as it is. NSR77 ^T_C 16:13, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

• Support as good as the Californication one, detailed and illustrated. igordebraga ≠ 01:52, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
• Oppose - This section in the lead needs a citation: "Guitarist John Frusciante is credited with creating much of the album's melodies, bass lines and guitar progressions, therefore changing the direction of the recording dramatically" It's an extremely in-your-face statement that really stands without verification.
• I'm not sure the "background" section is totally relevant to the article—at least not the first two paragraphs. The background given extends way too far back. If you could just expand on the third paragraph and say something brief about Frusciante's return, that should be enough. This section seems like apropriate background for Californication rather than By the Way.
• This sentence is structured quite awkwardly: "In 'This Is the Place' Kiedis once again references his late friend, as he has done in other songs such as Knock Me Down, and once fellow band mate Hillel Slovak and how drugs forced him to miss the funeral: 'On the day my best friend died/I could not get my copper clean'." ; you might want to remove the "Knock me Down" reference and keep it straightforward. It may need a citation as well.
• Here's a typo: "Other 'experimental' tracks include the trumpet based "On Mercury", a song centered "largegly" on ska."
• The begining of the "release" section features a statement that is totally irrelevant to the article. "...although David Bowie had expressed interest in producing Californication.[19]".
• I'm sorry to be so negative; but I guess during this phase, the positives have to go without saying. Grim-Gym 16:15, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

Don't be sorry at all. The entire purpose of an FAC is to pinpoint any flaws in an article in order to rectify them. Lead sections are not required to be referenced, as they are, essentially, a summary of the article. The statement "Guitarist John Frusciante is credited with creating much of the album's melodies, bass lines and guitar progressions, therefore changing the direction of the recording dramatically" is sourced in, I believe, the first paragraph of the "Writing and composition" section. It is pretty well known that this is, more or less, John's album (expressed by several critics, some listed in the "Critical reception" section). The extensiveness of the Background section, I thought, in my opinion, was appropriate as it showed the reader that the Chili Peppers came back from a dip in success. If you really find it necessary to cut it out, then I'll work with it. I removed the statement about Bowie, and good eye on the "largely" typo! NSR77 ^T_C 21:48, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

• I just noticed that you never introduce Anthony Kiedis by his full name. In Kiedis's first mention, "Frusciante and Kiedis collaborated together at each other's homes for days, discussing guitar progressions and lyrics.", it should say something like "singer" or "singer and lyricist Anthony Kiedis"
• The awkward sentence I listed is still there, so I'll be a little more specific. Be brief; something like: "Kiedis wrote "This is the place" for late Chili Peppers guitarist Hillel Slovak, and describes how his drug use forced him to miss the funereal." would be sufficient.
• The background needs to be more pertinent to how the band prepared for the recording of By the Way, and should focus much more on the aftermath of Californication. The first two paragraphs of the Californication and By the Way articles are essentially the same. If you could start with John's return and go from there, that would be much better. Grim-Gym 23:41, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Done. NSR77 ^T_C 00:37, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
• I tweaked the lead a bit for clarity. You just need to add a tiny bit of info about Frusciante's addiction and the fact that he was a former guitarist returning. Change the beginning of the background into a strong beginning paragraph, rather than the truncated middle paragraph it is, and all my qualms will be satisfied. Grim-Gym 03:46, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Done. I didn't really find it necessary to say Frusciante was once again returning, as it would have been redundant of Californication (album). Otherwise, I fixed the Background's first paragraph to be stronger. NSR77 ^T_C 11:42, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
• Support - All my problems have been fixed. I tweaked the background section a bit, and I'm satisfied now. Nice article. Grim-Gym 21:40, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
• Support - Looked through it, and to me it looks like it meets the critera. Great job! Tooga - BØRK! 22:48, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
• Comment I think the article could use another prose review. Some of the prose could be written more concisely. The fair use picture in "Writing and composition" really serves no purpose, plus you have that free image there; remove it. Who is Piero Scaruffi, and why is his criticism notable? Finally, I believe the track listing section needs to include songwriting credits (although I'm not entirely certain); if the band wrote every song together just insert "All songs written by the Red Hot Chili Peppers" at the top of the section. WesleyDodds 09:10, 28 July 2007 (UTC)
  • If possible, could you outline specific areas of overindulgence? The image has been removed, and, although I disagree with it, this article should be verification. Also, I added the line "All songs written by the Red Hot Chili Peppers" before the track listing. NSR77 ^T_C 14:51, 28 July 2007 (UTC)
    • And please format the refs correctly, per WP:CITE/ES. All sources need a publisher, websources need a last access date, and author and publication date should be listed when available. I'll check back. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 02:48, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
• Support. Detailed and accurate. Axl 06:51, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.