Template talk:European Union Labelled Map (blue)
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[edit] Font size too small
In the current version[1], font size is too small for "Member states", "Candidates", and "Croatia". In mac browsers, the text degenerates. —Tokek 13:54, 2 February 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Abbreviations
The style for text is not applicable to images, where space and design considerations need to be taken care of. Take a look at Template:World Labelled Map and Template:United_States_Labelled_Map, for example, they each use scores of abbreviations. This is a map of the European Union, and your version makes a very small candidate country its most prominent feature. It is absurd, on a clickable map, where everyone can get an explanation of the acronym in a second by just clicking it or hovering over it.
The fact that you are not doing anything about the abbreviation "Lux." on the same map clearly demonstrates that your concern about the style guide is less than sincere. sys < in 21:36, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
- "Lux." is an abbreviation; it's not an acronym. "FYROM" is an acronym, and for most (non-Greek) people an unfamiliar one; it needs to be spelled out. This is fundamentally different from the abbreviations for US states, which are taught to every American from school age onwards. Your own motives in repeatedly opposing this are plainly to do with the rancid ultranationalism that you've persistently demonstrated on pretty much every other article to do with the Republic of Macedonia; it's blatant POV-pushing and it needs to stop, now. -- ChrisO 06:47, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
- [[2]] talks about "Acronyms and abbreviations", so your distinction is purely artificial and highly insincere. And the world map I mentioned before has many acronyms not immediately familiar to everyone. In any case, this is a map of members of the European Union, and your edit looks like a label, turning it into a map of one little country with others around it. sys < in 06:54, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
- I must say Chris has a point here. Lux. is not the same with FYROM. A reader easily understands that Lux. is Luxembourg, but outside Greece readers are unfamiliar with "FYROM". What Chris did was just to explain what FYROM means: he explained the acronyms, and presented the official name of the country, with which it is recognized by the EU ("former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia"). I oppose the initial edits of Chris, when he replaced FYROM with "Macedonia" (because for the EU no state with the name "Macedonia" exists), but I do not understand why it is a bad thing to spell out the acronym "FYROM". After all, this is the official name with which EU (and Greece as well) have recognized this country. And I also agree that an acron. and an abbrev. are not exactly the same thing.--Yannismarou 09:19, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
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- If you hover your cursor over FYROM, or click on it, the explanation will appear in a second or two. As a user interface, this is always much preferable to an asterisk pointing somewhere else in the map. This is the web after all.
- If you look at Template:World Labelled Map, for example, many countries are simply represented as a dot, for similar reasons, while acronyms such as USA are also in use, even obscure ones such as PNG.
- I have no political objection to spelling out "the former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia", I use this form too, (I just did!). If this was a large-scale map where the words could fit without obscuring the entire Balkan peninsula, I'd fully spell them out. Under the constraints of a quarter-screen map, an acronym or abbreviation is highly reasonable.sys < in 10:09, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
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- Most people have a valid point here. How about placing a legend noting something as "for full view, mouse over the acronyms and abbreviations" or similar? After all there's always a possibility that a person would not be familiar with a country (or country’s name) so even an abbreviated form might cause some ambiguity. --10:49, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
- I think that's fine!--Yannismarou 10:55, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
- Every underlined word in Wikipedia is clickable, and, if the user has the appropriate browser & settings, mouse-over enabled. Underlining non-linked words is strongly discouraged. Therefore there is no need to explain this concept on every single page/map. I am not reverting your edit, but I suggest that you do so, as it ruins the presentation of the map, and it is not needed. Regards, sys < in 11:03, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
- I see what you mean. I was referring however to shortened names as "Neth." (for the Netherlands) which, in my opinion, is not exactly a standard abbreviated form by any means. No prob though, I will revert. --11:17, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
- You peeps can always consider it as an option though, even if it feels like an over-kill. --11:23, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
- I see what you mean. I was referring however to shortened names as "Neth." (for the Netherlands) which, in my opinion, is not exactly a standard abbreviated form by any means. No prob though, I will revert. --11:17, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
- Most people have a valid point here. How about placing a legend noting something as "for full view, mouse over the acronyms and abbreviations" or similar? After all there's always a possibility that a person would not be familiar with a country (or country’s name) so even an abbreviated form might cause some ambiguity. --10:49, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
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- I must say Chris has a point here. Lux. is not the same with FYROM. A reader easily understands that Lux. is Luxembourg, but outside Greece readers are unfamiliar with "FYROM". What Chris did was just to explain what FYROM means: he explained the acronyms, and presented the official name of the country, with which it is recognized by the EU ("former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia"). I oppose the initial edits of Chris, when he replaced FYROM with "Macedonia" (because for the EU no state with the name "Macedonia" exists), but I do not understand why it is a bad thing to spell out the acronym "FYROM". After all, this is the official name with which EU (and Greece as well) have recognized this country. And I also agree that an acron. and an abbrev. are not exactly the same thing.--Yannismarou 09:19, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
- [[2]] talks about "Acronyms and abbreviations", so your distinction is purely artificial and highly insincere. And the world map I mentioned before has many acronyms not immediately familiar to everyone. In any case, this is a map of members of the European Union, and your edit looks like a label, turning it into a map of one little country with others around it. sys < in 06:54, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Candidates and presentation
Why aren't the candidate countries shown on this map any more? And why do I seem to see double when I look at the template page? Caveat lector 13:10, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
