Talk:Epsilonism (conspiracy theory)
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[edit] A lot of the criticisms addressed
I believe the entry can now reasonably be expected to not carry an NPOV-sign. Criticism has been moved to its own space, and last time I checked, the lexicographical definition of "racism" was a theory that claims superiority for one race over the others. 193.92.80.43 14:43, 16 April 2006 (UTC)
--- Additional information: Indeed, context information can be found in the Epsilon Team entry. It's the part that's titled "possible reasons behind the legend".
This article was designed to present a term used in Greece to describe the whole Epsilon Team theory. I don't find it hostile; in fact, I don't know if someone can be hostile enough to racist theories. I've added some more information that ought to make it more useful, although we must keep in mind its purpose is not to describe or define the Epsilon Team, but explain this term, which is quite widely-used in Greece. On another note, the usage of this term is always derisive towards epsilonists, whose attitude does not differ much from that of a religious/nationalist fundamentalist. Regarding the context, now, again, one should see the Epsilon Team entry, which (I believe) explains a little bit about the social background of this whole deal.
Though I don't support Epsilonism in any way, I don't think this article holds a neutral view.
[edit] NPOV and does not provide context
For starters, the article is very biased. It's clear that someone is attacking the concept of the Epsilon Team. While I neither agree (nor care) about Epsilonism, the fact that this article is very hostile is something that should not be on Wiki.
Which ties into my second point: lack of context. I had to go digging around to find out what this article is related to. That should not be necessary; the article should give the very basics of what the concept is about - including the related concepts.
I was considering this for VFD, had it not had some merit. As it is, it needs a lot of work.--Mitsukai 04:34, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Editing this to conform to a neutral point of view and clean up the language
Just because the "Epsilonists" are frauds, does not mean we have to hit readers on the head _with a bludgeon_ to make a point!
Simply describing their theories of the "Greek extra-terrestrial race" is more than enough -- no need to add "sic" and your own characterisms into the mix.. After all, Wiki is supposed to conform to encyclopedic standards of writing.
I'm also deleting the reference to Pagans being supposedly at odds with Epsilonists for reasons x_y_z, until I see some documentation for this (especially considering experience that tends to show otherwise)..
The ending statement that these frauds are the subject of unanimous ridicule is, for better or worse, not true. In fact, their books are selling enough copies for them to continue funding appearances on television, so I am revising the article to reflect that sad reality.
- well, we need evidence that anyone takes this at all seriously; sure, I can see that the thing has apparently some notability in Greece as a joke. Thus, it should be portrayed as a joke, an urban legend or what have you; unless we can show that anyone defends this stuff, I don't think we need to treat it as a 'controversy' at all, just as a Greek media meme. dab (ᛏ) 13:45, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
- Of the Supreme Council of Ethnikoi Hellenes, one of its most prominent members has repeatedly written articles in the council's official magazine called "Diipetes" - and there is an article in the external link with this exact topic - against epsilonism. Removing references with this particular reasoning for removing them (especially when said references outright bash epsilonism) could be considered as an attempt to make "pagans" look like they identify themselves with Liako & Co - this would be akin to putting German polytheists in the same basket with Nazis. Elp gr 16:16, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Move it to Hellenocentrism ?
Isnt Hellenocentrism the right title?--GrWikiMan 20:53, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
- No. Hellenocentrism was a cultural movement, spearheaded by poets and scholars; it was not a telemarketing campaign for unfounded racist theories. Elp gr 16:17, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
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- I moved it to Epsilonism (conspiracy theory). Throughout the article, we're talking about the Epsilon Team, the whole conspiracy theory built around the Epsilon Team. Since we're not talking about Hellenocentrism - i.e. the cultural movement, it's time to put an end to this confusion; even if this might enrage some ultra-religious circles in Greece who keep longing for a return of the medieval times.Elp gr 21:09, 21 October 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Merger "Dispute"
It seems that this so-called "merger dispute" has been in a state of limbo for quite a while. I think it would be best to end it now so that we can all move forward. To be perfectly honest, there is no need to merge the articles. Yes, it is understandable why someone would want the articles to be merged since Epsilonism has a paragraph discussing the Epsilon Team. However, Epsilonism and the Epsilon Team should remain separate. Epsilonism is mainly a discussion of the tenets of a very strange ideology that generally lists those individuals/organizations who support them. The Epsilon Team article mainly discusses the history, ideological dynamics, membership hierarchy, and activities of the organization itself. Deucalionite 19:48, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
[edit] The content of this article is not about Hellenocentrism
Hellenocentrism is a generic term applying to ideologies centering on Greece and Greeks, and should not be conflated with the Epsilon Team. See Ελληνοκεντρισμός ReinesLicht 10:16, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
- This article is not about the Epsilon Team, but about the general fad and movement, of which the Epsilon Team is only a part. It is called Hellenocentrism or Archeolatry by critics (proponents don't identify themselves with any name or affiliation). I propose a rename. 87.203.180.85 (talk) 12:19, 13 December 2007 (UTC)
