Talk:Emperor's Royal Guard

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Contents 1 Force-sensitivity 2 Guards aren't necessary! 3 Blue Guards In EPS1 4 New Image 5 The EU 6 In the movies 7 Rewrite

[edit] Force-sensitivity

The article states that all guards are force sensitive. This simply cannot be true because the original guards would have been clones of Jango which would have little connection to the force whatsoever let alone be able to harness its power, even minutely. --70.105.106.147 02:57, 18 September 2005 (UTC)

Why would the original guards have been stormtrooper clones? I do not believe the article states that, and indeed, it says they are derived from Senate Guards (in fact, I know this. I wrote the relevant sections.) so your point would be moot. --Maru (talk) 03:08, 18 September 2005 (UTC)

If they weren't clones then how were the force sensitives found without Jedi knowledge? 70.105.106.147 21:49, 18 September 2005 (UTC)

The Inquisitors? The device discovered in The Young Jedi Knights which mechanically determines Force-sensitivity? Dark-siders in the employ of the Emperor? The Prophets of the Dark Side? Former Jedi who were converted to the Dark side? The possibilities are endless... --Maru (talk) 23:05, 18 September 2005 (UTC)

Guards are taken from the ranks of normal stormies after they've proven themselves in combat. Surly if they were force sensitive they would have been separated at the time they were recruited. 70.105.106.147 22:44, 19 September 2005 (UTC)

Because they are warriors first and foremost. Not Sith or Dark Jedi. If they were selected at induction, (disregarding the logistical problems) then you would have a naive Imperial wanna-be who has no idea what the Force is, rather than a deadly battle-hardened warrior to enhance with Force talents. --Maru (talk) 03:16, 20 September 2005 (UTC)

They go under intensive training AFTER being "discovered" that would either prepare or kill any "naive imperial wanna-be." Not to mention having made it through training on Carida before hand. (assuming they're not clones) 70.105.106.147 22:32, 22 September 2005 (UTC)

OH OH! Argue with this ha HA. (though i haven't totally finished) The books Specter of the Past and Vision of the future feature Major Tierce,formerly of the Imperial Royal Guard. Never (in what I've read so far) does it even so much as mention the possibility of him being force sensitive. --70.105.106.147 22:37, 22 September 2005 (UTC)

For starters, Grodin Tierce was a clone. This has unknown effects on Force-sensitivity. If the original is alive, there is interference, as the Thrawn Crisis trilogy makes clear; but when the original is dead, it is unknown. Also, Tierce may well have been sensitive- he was very lucky and good at what he did, all correlated with sensitivity; but he was not flash-implanted with the original's memories/training, nor was he trained himself. Thrawn would only have trained for strategy and politics. So even if Tierce was sensitive, and there is nothing to rule this out (see Argument from silence), he would not have been able to use to any noticeable degree since he lacked any training. And keep in mind that Tierce was only a Royal Guard, not an Imperial Sovereign, so it would have been weak sensitivity to boot. And finally, I must note as per Force-sensitive, you don't actually need any amount of Force-talent to manipulate the Force, so the entire section dealing with criteria and levels of Force-talents in the Royal Guard may well be erroneous; we don't know for sure. --Maru (talk) 05:09, 23 September 2005 (UTC)

I thought it was proven that cloning weakened force sensitivity. Anyway there is nothing to prove that he WAS force sensitive in the first place. Furthermore how can you say that you don't have to have talent to manipulate the force. Granted you don't have to be trained to use it but you do have to have "the talent". 70.106.164.92 01:45, 25 September 2005 (UTC)

We could argue this till the cows come home and we're never going to get anywhere because there is simply not enough proof to conclusively support either theory.(although mine does have the most proof. That being that nothing says that ALL guardsmen were force sensitive)It can/should be stated in the article that guardsmen were force sensitive(some were) but it should also be pointed out that NOWHERE does it say that ALL were. 70.106.164.92 01:45, 25 September 2005 (UTC)

 p.s. your not going to law school are you cause you're really good at arguing. I salute you.

Thanks.... I think. But no, I don't go to law school. I have some ethics; sheesh! I shall confine myself to two last remarks; first off neither ability nor training is necessary for using the Force. The Jedi Exile was stripped completely of the Force, and Jorj Car'das (you'll find his case listed in the Force-sensitive article) had no training, so to speak. And what made you think clones had worse Force-sensitivity? I ask out of honest curiosity since that sounds like it would come from prequels materials, my knowledge of which is woefully lacking. I'm a bit of a "classical" Star Wars expert :) After thinking about this, I've amended the article a bit. --Maru (talk) 02:07, 25 September 2005 (UTC)

The Dark Side Sourcebook states that all members of the Imperial Royal Guard are Force-sensitive. This makes sense, considering that Kir Kanos essentially destroyed an entire army all by himself, and that Carnor Jax, despite his obvious strength in the Force, didn't become a Sovereign Protector until, I think, Lumiya recommended him for the position. Jon Hart 19:56, 25 September 2005 (UTC)

Hmm. Does that work, chronologically? I mean, Lumiya was a secret until after Endor, and so would she ever have been in a position to "Recommend" Jax for sovereign protector? I had thought he was a protector before Endor. --Maru (talk) 21:18, 25 September 2005 (UTC)

I don't really remember where i heard that clones are weaker.I just know i did. By the way did anyone think to check the Databank on this topic? --70.106.164.92 00:19, 28 September 2005 (UTC)

I did. It is singularly useless; in fact, I do not think I've ever seen a Databank article more useless. It is extraordinary, marvelously useless, a veritable titan of obtuse lack of information. --Maru (talk) 01:19, 28 September 2005 (UTC)

Who ever said clones were weaker in the Force? I have never heard such a thing from any official source. On the contrary, Luuke Skywalker (Luke's clone) had, if anything, a greater mastery of the Force than Luke himself. And Joruus C'Baoth, who could mind-control thousands of people simultaneously, was a clone, too. As were Palpatine's clones, who were also a force to be reckoned with. Or are they all just exceptions?

I think that first anonymous user said it. --maru (talk) contribs 00:25, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Guards aren't necessary!

If the emperor is so badassly powerful he doesn't need these guys!

Its too emphasize his power

[edit] Blue Guards In EPS1

Twords the end of TPM Palpatine gets out of a craft with 2 lines of blue guards that have no face covering. Dudtz 2/16/06 6:51 PM EST

The "Red Guard" was formed sometime between Episodes I and II. Naturally, he could not have been guarded by an at that point non-existent organisation.

[edit] New Image

I found this new image, however, the articles being a nob and wont let me put it where i want, pls help Ahadland 21:06, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The EU

I think the article should be split into a brief section describing their roles and appearances in the films and then a larger section with all this... stuff.

If you don't keep up with the EU or consider it relevant, you'd read this article and say "Where the hell are they getting this from?" That's a huge problem with most SW articles. The authors seem to regard everything from the EU as being canon enough to reference but most "normal" people don't. I believe even Lucas has stated only the films themselves are canon. 66.167.145.218 04:53, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] In the movies

So much training and all that, but did they actually do anything except one of them who fell like a fly to Yoda's finger movement? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 88.153.71.110 (talk) 16:01, 29 April 2007 (UTC).

[edit] Rewrite

I am working on a rewrite of this article at User:EEMIV/Emperor's_Royal_Guard. The idea is to substantially trim down in-universe plot summary and to provide specific citations for the various claims. If anyone would like to help with this page, please feel free to directly edit the rewrite-in-progress. --EEMIV (talk) 03:20, 28 April 2008 (UTC)