Talk:Emo (slang)/Archive1

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Cheer Up Emo Kid

From what I've experienced, this is not a derisive remark but is merely a friendly jest. It's used within the emo culture to mock posers, not for irony - saying that it's supposed to be "ironic" implies that all emo kids need to cheer up.

Apart from the way this article appears to be dancing around the fact that emo as a culture and emos as individuals are mocked, I keep reading parts of it that look like they were written by someone who was trying to suppress the urge to make direct insults by being "objective". There are all sorts of vague implications, spurious links, and ambiguous suggestions littering the document which make it difficult to get any kind of useful information out of the article.

This whole thing also needs to be reworked to be less offensive to people within the Emo culture, and more accessible to those who just wish to find out WHY they or others they know are mocked. This article makes no attempt to explain this, and as I said earlier, just dances around the fact that emo is on the recieving end of a lot of hatred.

I personally do not know enough about the subject to make the necessary changes, but I ask that the people who do give it their best shot.

--Badharlick 10:50, 16 October 2005 (UTC)


Why "21st Century Emo" not Emo

Main article should be emo. Better to expand the emo article rather than create a new article unless there are distinctive 21st century aspects. Use the template {{Main|Emo}} to reference back to emo. Paul foord 11:34, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

This was originally part of the main emo article, which is where I believe it belongs, but somebody deleted all this stuff, put a very subjective summary under the very subjective heading pop hardcore and so I had to salvage this from an earlier edit of the main emo page. I agree with you completely though. --80.4.224.6 03:40, 21 August 2005 (UTC)

Ω I didn't make the change but I agree with it. Emo has a very specific path that I talk about in the emo discussion and this page has NOTHING to do with emo. Pop hardcore or popcore is an appropriate term. Listen to this modern emo band (www.hxcmp3.com/bands/1710) and try to tell me that Dashboard Confessional is anywhere near them stylistically. Emo stands for "emotional hardcore" not "emotional." Any band that lacks hardcore therefore is not emo. Ω DFelon204409


Yeah I "vandalized" this article, but being that this is a FREE encyclopedia, for anyone to edit, I have a right to change things. No I have a duty to change things IF the content is wrong (not factual) and/or biased. If you have to place a disclaimer at the beginning of an entry, the entry should be removed or edited to remove the questionable content until a non-biased definition is compiled. Until then less is more. This entry was VERY biased and it is a shame that I had to "vandalize" to make it more honest. Look at a real encyclopedia for examples of how to define a term in a NON- BIASED fashion please. Other entries in Wikipedia are quite well done, this one, however, was complete rubbish.

Capitalisation of title

Wikipedia suggests minimal capitalisation. Suggest moving to "Emo in the 21st century"as it scans better than "21st Century Emo" and also puts emphasis on Emo. Paul foord 13:43, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

The "sexist" section

This was in the sexist section:

Examples that have been cited of bitter break-up lyrics that have supposed sexist connotations include:
  • I hope the next boy that you kiss has something terribly contagious on his lips Brand New - Jude Law & A Semester Abroad
  • You can lead a whore to water and you can bet she'll drink and follow orders Glassjaw - Pretty Lush
Females are stereotypically "the root of all evil" in Emo lyrics. For example, the Taking Back Sunday song 'You're So Last Summer' includes the line "the truth is you could slit my throat, and with my one last gasping breath, I'd apologise for bleeding on your shirt".

This is just wrong, even if I like all the above songs/bands and song lyrics. Reasons are:

  • GlassJAw _not_ a "21st Century Emo" band.
  • The quote from You're So Last Summer is a metaphor - it doesn't say she's evil, just that the guy is obsessed with her. In the same song he says "Cause I'm a wishful thinker with the worst intentions" which might make the lyrics clearer.
  • He guy is angry with a specific girl who is going over to England and feels used. I don't think that's particularly sexist. He's not talking about all girls.
  • Not all emo lyrics say females are the root of all evil. They, to some degree, degrade them, but the line that says "I'd apologize for bleeding on your shirt" only says the writer cares for the girl but the feelings aren't returned by her.

I don't thing specific quotes are a good idea, but even if you want some in the article get some better, more appropriate, ones! Halo 15:06, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

This article should be at least rewritten and at worst deleted

The last half of the article is absolutely unacceptable by a number of Wiki rules. Seriously, it would be the equivalent of having half the article about Conservatism demean it, trash it, and call its followers "conservative fags".

"When attacking "Emo," its detractors often refer to wrist-slitting." - What?

Did I miss the giant article called "criticism of goth"? "People say" a lot of the same things about goth kids, too. They don't deserve this kind of treatment, and neither do the people who actively follow emo trends.

Plus, a number of the "facts" included in the article aren't even accurate. The Refused weren't an emo band (they were considered alternative metal), and "New Noise" only received airplay on MTV's 120 Minutes. It was certainly not popular enough to influence an entire trend. (For the record, kids were wearing that haircut in the "emo" scene before the Refused released the video.)

It's fair to include a paragraph mentioning the widespread disparaging of emo, but spending half an article on it, particularly including such clearly derogatory language, is completely unacceptable. -- ChrisB, 21:10 23 August 2005

Emo has attracted a huge amount of criticism however. Compare the instances of vandalism of the main emo page to how often this happens with articles like nu metal or garage rock or other genres with have been popular in recent times. Most people I know who listen to emo use the term as a pejorative anyway, and when it's used self-referentially, it's almost always done as self-depreciating humour. --80.4.224.6 23:32, 23 August 2005 (UTC)
Create article called Anti-Emo maybe? It does seem to have a reality of its own. Paul foord 00:03, 24 August 2005 (UTC)
This article doesn't count as "self-deprecating humor". It's simply insulting, period. "Emo fashion" is basically the "nerd" look from fifteen years ago, before metrosexuality existed. People wore it because they liked it. There is no link between it and "gay culture" save for the association made by people who enjoy making fun of "nerds". Essentially, the article says "nerds are gay" in a slightly intellectual manner. The opinion is inflammatory, derogatory, and does not belong in a Wiki article.
Both the Sexuality and Sexism sections should be deleted. The Sexism section doesn't have a supported argument - it's entirely POV. And the Sexuality section is undeniably homophobic. "Emo boys are more naturally predisposed to kiss other boys who look slightly feminine."? I mean, WHAT THE FUCK? -- ChrisB, 00:10 24 August 2005
I didn't even notice that addition till you brought it up. Your right, that does cross the line into being flat-out insulting and I've removed that bit. The emo fashion section does clearly establish that there are 2 types of fashion that are commonly called emo - the emo nerd look and the fashioncore (for want of a better term) look that you can't really deny is a pretty blatant example of metrosexuality. That doesn't make it bad by any means, but still, that's a major reason for the whole "emo fag" thing, and I think that section actually is quite defensive of emo. The Sexism section's based on the views of a few members of the old 80s L.A. cock rock scene mostly, but I've seen others bring it up online during anti-emo tirades. It's a stereotype more than a truth though, which the section tries to point-out, but I'm not sure how succesfull it is. The jist of it should be that saying emo lyrics are sexist is akin to saying rappers are homophobic or misogynistic or only focused on financial success; these stereotypes aren't true of all rap or all emo but they do have basis in truth. --80.4.224.6 15:40, 24 August 2005 (UTC)
Out of curiosity, what do you think of the article as it is now? --80.4.224.6 16:29, 2 September 2005 (UTC)

POV

What are these supposed to mean?:

  • "These obscenities are often used by 'purest' metal fans who are only into the screaming side of music"
  • "The reason for the hatred aimed at emo and its fans seems to be that many fans, especially newer ones, are perceived as having a limited knowledge of the bands which influenced the genre, while many of the most successful emo bands are seen as tailoring their music and appearance to maximize mainstream appeal."
  • "Another reason is that many "Emo girls" display a strong attraction towards gay or bisexual male activities."

In fact, I will remove them now. For whoever wrote them, please see Wikipedia:Neutral_Point_of_View. Someone42 11:04, 2 November 2005 (UTC)

Introduction Paragraph

"...expresses emotions beyond traditional punks's limited emotional palette of alienation and rage."

POV! I would hardly argue that punk, even traditional punk, is limited in its emotional scope. If anything, I would argue that punk is more emotional than emo, because it is far more passionate than merely limiting its topics to suburban heartbreak...but that would be POV as well, so I will simply alter that line. :) Inanechild 02:51, 12 November 2005 (UTC)


Ok there is more to emo!

look there is emo where u just want to be who u are and not care what others think and the style goes more along with the music ( girl pants tight shirts longer hair a slim converse style shoe) and lots of other things like that and it is pretty much emotional not doing any thing about getting made fun of b/c u dont care and crying alot but not from just deciding to be emo the hard life youve grow up with and that all i have to say