Talk:Elimelech of Lizhensk

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

	Judaism Portal Elimelech of Lizhensk is part of WikiProject Judaism, a project to improve all articles related to Judaism. If you would like to help improve this and other articles related to the subject, consider joining the project. All interested editors are welcome. This template adds articles to Category:WikiProject Judaism articles.
Project Judaism To-do: edit purge watch Here are some tasks you can do: Requests: Jewish and Biblical Units of Measurement or some such name, to include material of Ancient Hebrew units of measurement but also Talmudic units and use in Halacha (a la the Hebrew Wikipedia article he:מידות ומשקלות תורניים) Collaboration of the week { Cleanup: Jewish mythology - needs to be rewritten to be inline with our other mythology articles. Expand: Yom Ha'atzmaut - quite short for an article of such importance Wikiversity: School of Jewish Studies. Part of the new open content university, Wikiversity. Stubs: Category:Judaism stubs, Category:Tanakh stubs, Category:Synagogue stubs Update: Portal:Judaism is WikiProject Judaism's frequently updated portal. You can help make this the best portal on Wikipedia. Look at the talk page to see how you can help. Template loop detected: Template:WikiProject Judaism
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the quality scale.
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the importance scale.

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography. For more information, visit the project page.	Biography Portal
Stub	This article has been rated as stub-Class on the project's quality scale. [FAQ]

The name of the place is Leżajsk, not Lezhinsk nor Lizhensk. Shouldn't we move this article to Elimelech of Lezajsk? Halibutt 19:38, 22 Apr 2004 (UTC)

• Halibut: This article is not about the place, it's about a person who has a title that needs to sound the way it is mostly pronounced by those who use the title of the person most often. In any case, he article has a link to the towns current/correct name. The article is about a Jewish rabbi who was known to the Jews of Eastern Europe as Elimelech of Lizhensk, by which name he is still known to almost all Haredi Jews, which then brings us back to what the article is about in the first place: Hasidic rebbes and not pronounciations of little towns in Europe. IZAK 06:06, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Dear Isaak, I know the person's background (I'm of Polish-Jewish descent). Which doesn't change the fact that there is an ongoing controversy how should we treat the names of hassidic rabbis. If we assume that all those toponymical names are simple surnames, then they should be left as they are, that is in the English transcryption of the Yiddish names. However, I believe that they should be treated in the very same way royal dynasties are treated, that is we should translate them to English (if there's an English language name for a place) or translated to local/official name of the town. Just like we have Wladislaus I of Poland and not Władysław I Polski, or something similar.

Also, you use the name Elimelech of Lizhensk. Should this article be moved there? Halibutt 10:29, Apr 7, 2005 (UTC)

• Dear Halibut: Thank you for your reply. The article does actually give a link and both mentions and adds the correct current Polish name. Now, where you come from and what you do is not relevant to this discussion. RABBIS, no matter where they are born and where they live, belong first and foremost to the subject of Judaism (and Category:Rabbis) and they are FIRST part of how their JEWISH names are known to JEWISH people who STILL use that name. Wikipedia is here to "reflect" reality, not "theories" about how rabbis should or could be named by those not familiar with Hasidic Judaism or Haredi Judaism at all. How rabbis and Jews are part of Poland is a secondary consideration to being a Jew and a rabbi which must come first. It is very quaint of you to honor the rabbis by equating them with "Polish kings", but Polish kings are part of Polish history primarily, whereas rabbis are first part of Jewish history and also the Jewish people as they are to be found today! In addition, the Jews in Poland, and most countries, often did not, and cannot be said to, have spoken the kind of modern scholarly academic Polish you may know of. The Jewish pronounciations are often very different, and not just because they were Yiddish speaking. As an example, the Satmar Hasidim of Hungary came from "Sutu Mare", and if anyone would call them by that name it would be both unkown and incomprensible. So it is important to realize that your role should NOT be like a kind of "botanist" who normally gives "labels" to "inanimate subjects" not related to their religions or real lives. These are real rabbis, who had real names by whwich they were and are still known and beloved by within the Jewish people...which is what Wikipedia shoud reflect as an Encyclopedia (and not something that probably never was and is not now.) Best wishes. IZAK 08:47, 8 Apr 2005 (UTC)

As I said, we can go either way here, but IMHO both versions would be equally acceptable. And as to Satmar - you are completely wrong, my friend. That name comes not from the Romanian toponym Satu Mare, but from the contemporary Hungarian name for that place - Satmar. But this is just nit-picking. Halibutt 13:41, Apr 8, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] R' Elimelech's Surname

Wasn't his surname Weissblum? At least according to Meir Wunder it is. I was under the impression that Lipman was his father's second given name. Ratzd'mishukribo 14:57, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

In my genealogical research I have also found his surname to be WEISSBLUM to LIPMAN. Can someone please look into this?