Talk:Dublin City University

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I removed the paragraph referring to the seanad vote after reading this article: http://www.dcu.ie/news/press/2004/p0404c.shtml

Here is the paragraph I removed:

University graduates are currently (2004) not eligible to vote for Ireland's upper chamber, Seanad Éireann, this is under review.


Hi, just to note that the situation is still as per the removed paragraph - the article referenced notes a recommendation for change, but nothing has been implemented and for now only NUI and TCD graduates have a Seanad vote.


Contents

[edit] To do list

  • Check association of European School of Business
  • Fill out Category:Dublin City University (largely done)
  • List more links under "in other languages", currently only Irish, French, Finnish, Italian, Japanese and Norwegian definition links are included. (Isn't that done automatically as soon as somebody writes an article on DCU in a new language?)

- no it isn't, the link has to be included at the bottom of the page.

  • List of Dublin City University people needs to be cleaned up.
  • Remove excess of links, particularily links to research institutions and replace with link to resarch websites
  • Make it read less like a marketing blurb

[edit] Institutional Repository

The service has not been officially launched but it is operational. Resource and preservation metadata is being currently exposed and harvested and attendant resources accessed. The process of service advocacy continues and deposits are being added. Both platform and service are stable releases and not pilots.

The library section needs expansion and flagging the IR service needs to be cited within the overall service context.

Garret McMahon 14:15, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

 ?? This sort of thing reads as incomprehensible to the average visitor and needs to be explained, if it even belongs in a general encyclopedia article. 217.213.169.185 18:13, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

The above is not meant to represent any wiki entry relating to the IR, it merely states the current service status to those who keep editing the entry. To call the service a 'pilot' runs contrary to the advocacy of what is a fully active service. As I stated, the IR should be mentioned within the context of services the library at DCU provides.

Garret McMahon 09:09, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Location

DCU is in Glasnevin NOT Whitehall (see official address)—Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.42.79.216 (talk • contribs)

What offical address when i checked their website their was noting , and an osi map had whitehall printed over the top of DCU (Gnevin 12:55, 22 October 2006 (UTC))
If you check http://address.anpost.ie (registration required) then the addresses of DCU all include Whitehall and none for Glasnevin. Djegan 13:52, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

The old Albert College (Dublin) (which is part of DCU's main campus) has had its address as Glasnevin since 1838, a long time before Ballymun came into existance.

Albert College does not appear in the An Post database, but in any case I think we can take it that the boundaries of places change over time. For instance the boundaries of cities and counties have changed since 1838, see in particular Local Government (Ireland) Act 1898; now if Ballymun, Glasnevin and Whitehall have changed I cannot say for certain, but nor can I say for certain that they have not changed.
But what is true is that the postal service of the state, as by law established, indicates that the correct postal address for the university is "Dublin City University, Collins Avenue Extension, Whitehall, Dublin 9". Djegan 01:12, 23 October 2006 (UTC)
DCU has always seen itself as being in Glasnevin, and as commented above, the area, and the core building, were Glasnevin since way back. And area boundaries change very little, really, albeit new areas are made. This is not the first time I have seen the 1838 Act quoted but that was really an "administrative tidying up" piece of legislation, and had little to say on specific areas.

Then there is the odd claim re. An Post. An Post makes no claim (nor does the Ordnance Survey) to be official arbiter of locations. Postal addresses are based on sorting areas, nothing more, and whether An Post is established by statute or not is irrelevant. So although much of south Dublin is listed as "abc, def Street, Blackrock, Co. Dublin", no one would mistake most of the places in question for all being in the district actually known as Blackrock. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 217.213.169.185 (talk) 18:19, 13 May 2007 (UTC).

[edit] New Acting BA Degree Source:

Source for the three year BA in Acting in conjunction with Dublin City University:

http://www.taoiseach.gov.ie/index.asp?locID=200&docID=2957 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 136.206.11.249 (talk) 18:53, 17 January 2007 (UTC).

The fact that the university grants degrees at a college does not mean that the college is a college of the university. Djegan 22:11, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Rewrite

This article needs to be rewritten as it is somewhat incoherent. We are adding lots of information which makes it somewhat incoherent. It would be invaluable to rewrite it (or sections of it) so that the article forms one coherent narrative. Any takers? Djegan 23:46, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] RE: Controversies section

There is no Controversies section in either the UCC or UCD articles even though the managment and reforms in these two institutions has been far more controversial and newspaper headline-gripping than DCU's problems.

In the recently added controversies section it says that DCU has near-corporate behaviour. As far as the corporate whoreing of universities in ireland is concerned, UCD has far surpassed DCU in that respect years ago since Dr. Hugh R. Brady took the helm as President of UCD.

TCD and UCC at least rival DCU in the university corporate whoreing leagues.


UCC has been far more controversial in the past few years with university president Prof. Gerard T Wrixon getting the University into between 60 and 100 million euro in debt. Lecturers in UCC complain of bullying and unfair employment practices.

These facts are ignored by user 83.147.172.138, yet DCU is singled out to be picked on by a user with London based ip address: 83.147.172.138 who says he's been in DCU for the past 6 years. Maybe he's thinking of another university in London with a name somewhat similar to DCU.


User 83.147.172.138, FYI The digital cafe is upstairs in the main restaurant.


There were signs up all over the main restaurant back in 2003/2004 stating that the starbucks there was the first one in Ireland.

Source for faculty number of 440: http://www.skoool.ie/skoool/parents.asp?id=4263 (21/08/2006)


The controversies section is not verified theirfore if citations are not provided then I will remove the section en masse. Many of the citations that where provided where simply misleading, as they did not back the claims made. Remember that editors wishing to include claims must back them up when requested, per WP:VERIFY. Also I will remove the {{fact}} requests by the editor as these where made in bad faith because I challenged the editor, I think its quite pointless trying to cite these requests. The best option would be to revert the article to before the controversy, the editor was simply a vandal and is currently blocked. Djegan 17:03, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Listcruft

I was tempted to add the {{Listcruft}} template to this article today. The various "lists of societies", "lists of faculties", the (incredibly exhaustative) "lists of research groups", and even the "lists of external links" continue to grow by exponential factors.

My reading of the policy that deals with how Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information (or indeed that WP is not a directory) suggests that these lists constitute "Listcruft", and are beyond the scope of an encyclopedic article.

Maybe a website about everything and anything to do with DCU (like DCU.ie for example) might link every single research group on the campus, but is it really relative to an encyclopedic article that DCU has a "Centre for International Studies", "French Politics and Policy Group" and 150 others? There are other (and perhaps better) ways to impart the scope/breadth/depth of the DCU research groups without listing every single one...

In the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, Harvard, or - even - UL or UCC articles the relevant points remain unobscured by 100 point lists. And are easier to read because of it. (In some cases they are moved to stand-alone lists. In other cases, they just focus on the key research accomplishments).

Does anyone have an alternative view? Is there are purpose/value of these lists (in an encyclopedic context in this article) that I am missing?

Just want to open the floor before (as above) I put in the "Listcruft" template, and (subsequently) summarise/split these lists. Guliolopez 18:55, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Agree. Its excessive, even as a graduate of the university this article needs reduction. Djegan 19:21, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Could the Research Centres, Laboratories and Research Groups list be put into a new page?, this would remove most of the links in the entry and make it look a bit neater. Beta 14:17, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

I have created a List of Dublin City University faculties, schools, research centres and laboratories page. This is loosely based on List of Massachusetts Institute of Technology departments and laboratories. It is linked to in the DCU article under the research heading. Hope it clears up some of the clutter. Beta 20:00, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

Cool. And thanks. (Saved me a lot of effort there :)
I don't think the "cleanup" of this article is complete yet however. The listcruft was the most obvious problem, but there are other areas to address as well.
Commentary
The next thing to do is temper the POV commentary in this article. The below is a good example of where sections of this article breach NPOV guidelines, including loaded terms, speculation and pure point of view:
"Dublin City University uses the term "computer applications" very liberally.... DCU can afford to include the practical side of computer science [...] unlike the majority of Irish universities [...because it can...] cram more subject modules into a smaller time period."
References/links
After the POV cull, a serious review of how this article uses external links is probably in order. In my opinion, it is not following the MOS and other conventions for references and links. Take the two following examples:
  1. where companies/entities/etc are referred to in the article, the related links in this article don't link to the WP article, but to an external source. For example, there is a link for AIB in the text, but it does link to the Allied Irish Banks article on WP - instead, it links to the DCU Allied Irish Bank website. This is not appropriate.
  2. sources and references also don't follow the standard, and instead references are treated as "in line" links. For example, in this article, external references look like this:
"The university also collaborates on research with large multinational corporations and institutions like Google, Microsoft and the US Military."
While (everywhere else on the WP), references follow the convention as:
"The university also collaborates on research with large multinational corporations and institutions[1].
Under this standard, a list of references is managed at the end of the article.
Again, unless there is a specific reason or value in managing references/commentary beyond the convention, I'm going to start cleaning that stuff up. Guliolopez 20:09, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

Their is a lot of content (often added in a piecemeal fashion) and links (some quite unnotable) that could be dropped from this article and it would vastly improve the article, "less is more"! Djegan 13:46, 6 May 2007 (UTC)


Most of the external links are sources for the information contained within the article. It would be better to keep them in some form as sooner or later a source nazi will probably appear and blank most of the article due to the fact that if the sources are removed there will be nothing to corroborate the information in the article.

I'm not sure which information in the article is generally considered notable/unnotable. But I do know that if the information is notable, both it and its sources should be kept.

All I am trying to do is edit the article so it conforms to the standard outlined by Guliolopez above. Articles like the UCD article are just as messy if not more so in terms of linkspam, irrelevant info and piecemeal editing. Beta 15:00, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

As a number have commented, this article is too long, with rather silly long lists a key feature. Nothing encyclopedic about that. And parts, as mentioned in the To Do list above, read as if written by the Marketing Dept., if such exists.

Apologies for not signing the second of my three changes above. 217.213.169.185 18:21, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] What is DCU's campus size including newly acquired lands?

Does DCU own all the lands extending from the O'Reilly Library to Griffith Avenue including Hillside Farm and Elmhurst House?

Dublin City Development Plan 2005-2011, Volume 3 - Record of Protected Structures Page 15, Ref. 487

California State University, Sacramento Study Abroad Program - Study in Ireland at Dublin City University


—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 89.125.22.114 (talk • contribs).

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:DCU Fencing Club.jpg

Image:DCU Fencing Club.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 03:06, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Computer Applications in the history section

While interesting this should not be in this section as it not a suitable location. In fact it probably should not be in the article at all. It is too specific and should probably be an article of its own. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.85.45.226 (talk) 23:04, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] College Linkage Agreements Strengthened

www.ireland.com/newspaper/ireland/2008/0205/1201903494867.html

http://www.spd.dcu.ie/main/news/Linkage_Signing.shtml —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.125.22.112 (talk) 12:44, 5 February 2008 (UTC)