Talk:Distilled beverage

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Contents 1 old 2 Charcoal filtering final product 3 Deletion vote 4 The word "liquor" 5 Etymology 6 Cider and Apfelwine "distilled" !? 7 History and subsections 8 George Liquor redirection 9 Moved out of Vodka

[edit] old

I've edited this entry to change the following. I document it here because there's no room to document it on the main page:

1. The history of distillation is partly given under "Background" and partly under "History". It's confusing.

So why not consolidate instead of eliminate. Rmhermen 01:56, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

2. Sake is absolutely not a distilled beverage. Sake is closest to beer in its ingredients and closest to Riesling or Chardonnay wine in its method of production (using two ferments to create the final product). It is never distilled on its own and true sake has an ABV of about 14%.

The sake article disagrees with you. Rmhermen 01:56, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

3. "Malt" and "grains" are not different items. Malt is derived from grains. Without malting, it's difficult if not impossible to ferment barley and wheat.

4. Many spirits are made from vegetables. Vodka is often made from potatoes.

5. References are not given in Wikipedia form.

6. Many typos, run-on-sentences, unclear phrases, etc. For instance, "universal medical elixir application" makes no sense in any form of English. From reading one of the primary sources, I think the original writer meant that the liquors were likely first designed to be medical elixirs.

7. Saying that corn spirits were distilled by the English in 1400 could be highly misleading for North American readers. "Wheat" is an unambiguous term.

Except that it doesn't mena wheat. It means wheat and rye and barley and oats, etc. Rmhermen 01:56, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

8. If "spirits" is used to refer to distilled beverages only, you can't call beer a "grain spirit" before you distill it.

Huh? Rmhermen 01:56, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

9.I seem to remember reading about a Roman celebration involving some rather strong (perhaps distilled) drink in a bachus festival. It was quite different from the regular wine theme. Ostia seems to ring a bell. Does anyone know of any techniques they may have used to make a spirit(not just a wine) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.179.245.86 (talk) 06:28, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Charcoal filtering final product

What is the purpose in filtering alcohol through charcoal/ashes? Moonshine that isnt filtered through charcoal/ashes is called pop-skull liquor (According to 'The fox fire' book) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 69.168.21.138 (talk • contribs) .

It removes impurities, just like filtering water through a Britta filter. In fact you can filter cheap Vodka through a Britta filter a number of times and greatly improve its quality and taste. -- Stbalbach 19:47, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

Which is inappropriately noted in the Brita article itself. I came here from there to point this out. I added one section of text to point there. See my note at Talk:Brita Hopefully someone will step in and clean this up further. MaxEnt 20:21, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Deletion vote

All liqueur enthusiasts, please vote here: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Qi (spirit). Thank you, Badagnani 07:14, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The word "liquor"

Liquor doesn't need to be a "alcoholic" beverage, right?

See how it is used here:https://www.tea-junction.com/product.aspx?id=459&c=Green%20Tea&cid=585

True, but then this is an encyclopedia not a dictionary, for other meanings see wikt:liquor. -- Stbalbach 15:30, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Etymology

The article says that the use of the term 'liquor' is first recorded in the late 1200s and first used to refer to alcoholic beverages in the 1700s. My reference [1] says early 1200s and 1300s, respectively, a difference of 50 and 400 years. CRGreathouse (t | c) 08:31, 22 December 2006 (UTC)

Checking the OED (it's somewhat difficult as I can't read Middle English well enough to fully appreciate the meaning), but the term has been used in various ways.. a liquid.. a liquid for drinking.. a alcoholic liquid for drinking... there are many others. This looks like the oldest entry in terms of alcohol:

b. With reference to intoxicating effect. disguised with liquor = DISGUISED ppl. a. 6. in liquor: in a state of intoxication. to be (the) worse for liquor: to be overcome by drink.

a1529 SKELTON Bk. 3 Fools Wks. 1843 I. 202 Thou hast wylde lycoure, the whiche maketh all thy stomacke to be on a flambe. 1592 NASHE P. Penilesse (ed. 2) 23a, He is reputed..a boore that will not take his licour profoundly.

-- Stbalbach 17:06, 22 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks, it's good to have real information. CRGreathouse (t | c) 09:17, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cider and Apfelwine "distilled" !?

Help! In that big "box" at the bottom of the page, it lists cider and apfelwine as apple-based "distilled" alcoholic drinks. This is obviously untrue, as both are simply fermented, not distilled. How does one edit that box? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 67.180.4.31 (talk) 01:34, 14 January 2007 (UTC).

[edit] History and subsections

The problem with the sub-sections is they break the section up into a regional history, which it is not. It is a global/world history that discusses the innovations that were new, in a roughly chronological order. They just happen to fall along some regional lines, which I suppose one could "forge" sections out of, but that takes away from the narrative and flow and intention of the section. It's not that long that it needs sectioning. -- Stbalbach 23:55, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

The problem with not having sub-section is that the major breakthroughs are buried among a variety of lesser improvements. This breakthrough is definitely the invention of the alembic still as we know it (perhaps already with cooled collector which may be also a later European invention) by the Arabs in the 8th/9th century. This still spread then to Europe and China, and only THEN only do modern liquid appear. If you feel that there is another way of giving prominence to some facts than with geographic subsections, then please go ahead. Regards Gun Powder Ma 14:43, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

Gun Powder Ma, I wrote it originally back in Jan 2005 and sure enough I did use three sections, but the source I used did not use sections (I really need to footnote it sometime, didn't use footnotes back then). I guess I'll let it go and keep the sections, no big deal either way, I'm kind of leery of sectioning for the sake of sectioning because it distracts and distorts but if you think it helps emphasis thats fine. -- Stbalbach 23:06, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

You wrote that? I found the text verbatim and with the subsections included somewhere in the web. I would still prefer subsections, but I bow to your expertise. ;-) Perhaps you can add your references as footnotes. Regards Gun Powder Ma 23:44, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

I wrote most of it [2]. If you found it on the web it was copied from Wikipedia. -- Stbalbach 22:21, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] George Liquor redirection

George Liquor is a fairly obscure, web-only character that was part of a short-lived project. Basically, I'm trying to say, almost no one knows what that even is..... so why should there be a redirection from Distilled Liquor (a large, broad, and fairly well-sourced article) to an article that's been tagged for over a year for having unreliable sources for a cartoon character?

I mean, if it were a popular cartoon character, I could understand, but this character would only be known to serious fans of an obscure cartoon creator (John Kricfalusi, creator of Ren & Stimpy).

I almost feel like this redirect gives it undeserved, and completely unrelated exposure, and thus leads people away from this article to a really strange article, for something that almost no one knows anything about (beyond the dozen or so 2-minute web cartoons).

Basically, if people even KNOW what George Liquor is and they want more information on it, chances are they're going to search for the character by names ("George Liquor" is not at all a difficult series of English language words to type into the search box.)—Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.0.238.197 (talk • contribs)

It's presumably there because there aren't enough links to warrant a Liquor disambiguation [3] page, and only that page and would warrant linking from it. Seems like a fairly standard otheruses link, placed here when the old disambig page at Liquor was blown away per the disambiguation guidelines that call for at least three links to be present. Note that the only "redirect" involved is the redirection of Liquor here. MrZaius^talk 12:03, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Moved out of Vodka

The following pieced is moved out of "Vodka" (unreferenced there). Please incorporate it here, whatever makes sense. `'Míkka>t 01:16, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

An early description of a distilling apparatus comes from the 13th century. The device was later described by a university professor in his treatise about wine. To produce beverages containing 60% alcohol with the device, the distillation process had to be repeated several times. The general knowledge about distillation was being slowly developed until 1800, when Edward Adam invented the process of rectification which removed its "bad taste". Further changes were made in 1817 by Johannes Pistorius, a German brewer, who built the first machine that could produce a beverage containing 85% alcohol in just one distillation. In Ireland in 1830 an apparatus was designed that could work continuously and allowed for production of beverage containing almost 90% alcohol. A similar rectification machine, but working periodically, was for the first time used in 1852 in a brewery in Saint Denis by Pierre Savalle. The present-day distillation-rectification machines, designed in the 19th and 20th centuries, are essentially modernized versions of those devices. Currently, such machines can work continuously and produce beverages containing 95.6% alcohol without any contaminating tastes or smells.

The process of distillation with still was widely promoted throughout Europe by Dutch traders. In the 17th century they also played a great role in exchanging the various types of alcohols such as mead, wine, beer, and also the stronger ones such as rum, cognac, whisky and vodka, between the countries of their origin.