User talk:DHN/2007

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[edit] Your Babel template

Why does your Babel template list English and Vietnamese twice, on different levels? --Tewy 23:55, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

I saw your name on this image, from someone's wikibreak template. --Tewy 02:55, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Vietnamese People

Hey, it seems like you know quite a bit about Vietnamese people. Would you look at the talk page on the "Vietnamese people" page again to correct or challenge anything I've said on the discussion page? Thanks, it's labelled "Response to Leaki" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Vietnamese_people Mojojojoinhawaii 04:13, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Cellophane noodles

Hi, can you fix the diacritics for the Vietnamese names of Cellophane noodles? Also, what are these used for in Vietnam? Are they used for cold or hot spring rolls, or are rice vermicelli used instead? Badagnani 21:58, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Dang or Tram?

Hi, can you please check this edit to see if it was correct? Badagnani 20:05, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, so Dang is the family name? Do you know the Hán Tự for this? Is it 鄧? I'd like to make an article for it. Badagnani 21:11, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, I added wikilinks to the Dang articles, in the templates at the top. However, Dang Thai Son is showing up as family name Dang/usually called Dang. Can you fix that? Badagnani 21:23, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

OK, so this person's name is already rendered in Westernized order. That shouldn't be a problem to fix, then. Just as long as our readers know which is the family name. Badagnani 21:43, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

Wait a minute, I think Dang Thai Son's family name is Dang. Can you clarify the specific example I asked about instead of sending me to other discussion pages? Badagnani 21:44, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

I think the template is fine how you fixed it, except that it should have "his/her" and "he/she" or else it's confusing because it sounds as if the family name is what is referred to as (2). Please check this edit to make sure it's correct. Badagnani 21:54, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Template:Vietnamese name

Hi! Sorry for the confusion about this template; please see this topic for a compromise proposal that should serve both our needs, and take only a few minutes to implement. — SMcCandlish [talk] [contrib] ツ 21:03, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] is this VANDALISM (?) please help

Hi, You are an administrator on the Vietnamese wikipedia right? Today I logged into the "Culture of Vietnam" page and noticed what was to me a very offensive addition by an anonymous user who has been warned for vandalism before. The problem is he even mentions sources in his claims and I'm not sure whether or not I'm just being biased here or if that truly was vandalism.

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Culture_of_Vietnam&diff=112996726&oldid=112943666

^ You can see his addition in the link above, please check it and get back to me? Thank you. I reverted the edit but as I said I'm still not sure what was the right thing to do in that situation. Also, is there something that can be done to warn that user since he has a history of vandalism? Thanks again..sorry for wasting your time. Annamite tonkinese 20:29, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

DHN: Please stop vandalizing the article by removing information backed by good quality references. There is nothing in the Wiki rules to allow you to carry out such disruptive behaviour. This article is about culture, and so it is fair game to include all aspects of the particular culture. If you don't like it, then try changing the culture of these people.

[edit] Meh

That person did it again. To both the pages we reverted. Sorry for bugging you, I know you advised me just to revert it and ignore him but he's obviously the type to continue to revert it back to his version and I don't want to engage in - I guess what they call an edit war. He even has the gall to justify his additions. As if me finding 20 articles about triad activities and pasting that into every Chinese culture-related article would be acceptable??? I'm really debating what to do now.Annamite tonkinese 15:07, 8 March 2007 (UTC)


You are right, you are just bias. The best thing to do is not to vandalize the article by removal. As the article is about culture, all aspects of culture can be included. If, there is no truth in it then nobody would believe it. By removing information, all you are doing is to admit that there are certain aspects of Vietnamese culture that you wish to hide as you are not proud of them. The only way to be proud of such culture is to improve. You can improve perception of Vietnamese culture by encouraging the people not to do crimes. This is particularly important for young, second and subsequent generation overseas Vietnamese and educated Vietnamese, who probably just want to lead a decent life. You wouldn't want to see any more people like that Australian guy who got strung up in Singapore. It would be really good if you would paste 20 articles about triad activities into every Chinese culture related articles. I look forward to reading them.

[edit] Koh Tral

There needs to be some discussion of this issue. I admit I know nothing of the island(s) in general and suggest that discussion take place to ensure that the article is in the correct place. Why is the name Koh Tral not mentioned in Phú Quốc? It would be useful to see verifiable sources that confirm the islands are one and the same. If this is the case, the article about the island (whatever its name) should discuss the different names and the potential territorial claims to the island. But the RfD discussion is now closed. WjBscribe 22:18, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

I am not yet convinced they are the same island. Can you point to a reliable source that confirms this? WjBscribe 22:23, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
OK, that document convinces me (though it isn't exactly current). The redirect should stay for now. I'll suggest to Wikipedia:WikiProject Southeast Asia that they inlcude in Phú Quốc a discussion of alternative names, territorial disputes etc. WjBscribe 22:33, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
I've added a mention of the alternative name to Phú Quốc and tagged that article as {{NPOV}} until the territorial dispute is properly discussed there. Does that seem acceptable? WjBscribe 22:40, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
Fair enough, but if most Cambodians do indeed regard the island as part of Cambodia, that warrants a fairly major mention in the article. And the history of the dispute is also needed before the article can be seen as balanced. Oh, and I'll reopen the RfD and restore your comment (not procedurally ideal but seems better than the other options). WjBscribe 22:54, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Ruou nep

Hi, I'd like to make an article about ruou nep, the fermented, slightly alcoholic rice drink/dessert. I asked you about this earlier (discussion is in your 2006 archive) but haven't been able to collect good information since then. But at least now I know the name, though I don't know the diacritics. Thanks! Badagnani 03:35, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

I see online that rượu nếp shows photos of what looks like vodka. Does that mean that cơm rượu nếp is a more accurate name for the drink I'm describing above? Badagnani 04:20, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Oh no!!! As you'd warned me earlier was the case on vi: Wikipedia, controversy seems to reign. I suppose the commonest name that one would ask for this in a restaurant in VN would be the name we should use. Badagnani 04:31, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

I looked at the photos . These look like red/purple Isan sticky rice from Thailand. That isn't the item I was asking you about. I'm referring to the yeasty-smelling white, milky, thick slightly sweet and slightly alcoholic liquid containing some rice balls, which is eaten with a spoon for dessert. There are rice balls and liquid together. The one I'm describing is the one I want to make an article about. Badagnani 04:34, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

There's not much liquid, but the photo at http://www.nguoivienxu.vietnamnet.vn/vanhoaamthuc/2005/06/450627/ might be it. It has soft looking rice balls. They call it com ruou. Badagnani 04:42, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

OK, so it's cơm rượu. Doesn't that mean "rice wine," though? There's no "nếp" in the name of this dessert? Badagnani 04:48, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

My music teacher is from Saigon. Not sure where your family comes from. There are similar sweet rice drinks in Korea (gamju), China (choujiu), Japan, and maybe some other Asian countries. Badagnani 04:50, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

http://www.nguoivienxu.vietnamnet.vn/vanhoaamthuc/2005/06/450627/ shows com ruou and com ruou nep and they look the same. Is the difference that the latter is made with glutinous rice, while the former is made from normal white rice? There's some discussion about the various styles of food, with mentions of Thailand and Singapore. Is there any further good information there that you could help translate that would be good to put in the article? Badagnani 04:55, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Quang Ngai? Badagnani 04:56, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Thank you, that is very helpful and explains a lot. These two things should have separate articles, don't you think? Because the photos you sent earlier don't resemble the southern thing at all.

Question: You said: "It is made into "rượu nếp". This type is usually used for the liquid (hence the name) instead of the solid." But the photos you sent earlier appear like the Thai sweet sticky purple glutinous rice with coconut flavor, definitely solid and not liquidy. Badagnani 05:15, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

I made a Cơm rượu page. I'm afraid it's not very good but could you check it for accuracy? I can't believe there are no WP articles about Northern Vietnam and Southern Vietnam, because although the country is unified now, these are distinct regions with different dialects, cuisines, etc. Badagnani 02:45, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The Buffalo Boy

Hi, I wonder if you could tell me the literal translation of the Vietnamese language title of this film (which I'm watching now). Badagnani 05:50, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

Great, thanks for this info. This film conjures a watery world I could never have imagined--have you seen it? Why the confusion over "len"--is it a foreign word? There are Khmer characters in the film. Badagnani 07:49, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, you're full of great information. It's a very moving film, quite different than the urban ones like Scent of Green Papaya or Three Seasons (I liked both; Tony Bui's sister is also a filmmaker and made a documentary called I Am Viet Hung which was on PBS a few years ago. I'm not sure I mentioned that I study and play Vietnamese traditional music--but never been to Vietnam yet. Badagnani 08:26, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

Oh, my--that looks like a harrowing story. But one that Americans in particular need to see. I haven't heard of it but will look for it. I also haven't yet seen Green Dragon (though I heard it's not very good) nor Bride of Silence (Hat mua roi bao lau), which is making the film festival rounds. Like the Chinese film directors before them, Vietnamese directors seem to be figuring out what sorts of subjects and themes will attract interest internationally. Badagnani 08:34, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Northern and Southern Vietnam

Perhaps an article for the regions of Northern Vietnam and Southern Vietnam could be made (comparable to the North China article, or a Northern and Southern Vietnam article could be made, similar to the Northern and Southern China article? Badagnani 04:36, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

I gave it a try at Northern and southern Vietnam. Now we need more distinctions and stereotypes (the "typical Northerner" and "typical Southerner" in the Northern and southern China article seem good), and sources in both English and Vietnamese. Badagnani 05:20, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

I'd never heard of the 17th century partition before. Question: is it correct to say that the 1954 partition was done roughtly at the Seventeenth parallel (actually using the Ben Hai River as a border) and the Trịnh-Nguyễn War partition separated Trinh and Nguyen kingdoms at the Gianh River? If so, we need a Gianh River article and it should be explained exactly where this river is located--is it in Quang Tri or Quang Binh, and is it north or south of the Ben Hai River? Badagnani 05:48, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

Any idea why they used a different river for both partitions? And where in relation to the Ben Hai River the Gianh River is? Badagnani 06:14, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

I didn't feel this was explained properly, so I added a paragraph. Would you check it for accuracy? Badagnani 05:51, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Northern/Southern China stereotypes

Oh, someone had just removed that info. Here it is:

[edit] Stereotypes

Neverevertheless, the concepts of North and South continue to play an important role in regional stereotypes.

The stereotypical Northerner:

  • Is taller
  • Has small, slit-like, and/or slanty eyes with single eyelids (i.e. an epicanthal fold)
  • Has a longer rugged face (possibly with considerably more facial hair than southerners)
  • Speaks a northern Mandarin dialect
  • Eats wheat-based food rather than rice-based food
  • Is loud, boisterous, open, and prone to "thunderbolt" displays of emotion, such as anger

The stereotypical Southerner:

  • Is shorter
  • Has large, almond-shaped eyes with double eyelids
  • Has a smooth, round face
  • Speaks a southern dialect such as Wu, Yue (Cantonese), Min
  • Eats rice-based food rather than wheat-based food
  • Is wealthy, clever, calculating, hardworking, and prone to "mincemeat" displays of emotion, such as brooding melancholy

Note that these are very rough stereotypes, and are greatly complicated both by further stereotypes by province (or even county) and by real life. Badagnani 06:04, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Gianh River

Can you check Gianh River? Badagnani 06:45, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

Oh, no--too confusing. If you can find sources about the 17th century partition, it should be easy, then to match that river with the modern one (maybe different names in both periods), or "giang" got corrupted to "gianh" due to dialect differences, or there was a modifier in the name of the river, or whatever. Anyway, I got the name from the Vietnamese WP in the first place. Badagnani 06:52, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

It seems to have been important, historically, for whatever reason (it's not a very big or notable river otherwise?); see this website. This website says that the Giang River's other name is "Ling giang." Badagnani 06:56, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

I'll bet it's an example of alternate pronunciations of Hán Tự. It's a nightmare to work with those at the Vietnamese and English Wiktionaries, as each character can have 5 or more different Vietnamese spellings/pronunciations. Badagnani 06:58, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Mekong Delta

It looks like the Mekong Delta needs the names of the provinces contained in that region. Badagnani 13:17, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Limnophila aromatica

Hi, can you help with tone marks for ngo om and canh chua at the Limnophila aromatica article? Badagnani 03:40, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] image of duy doan le

hi. i've seen you contributed much to the pages involving vietnamese on wikipedia, and that's great. however, i disagree with your decision in removing the picture of Duy-Loan Le from the Vietnamese American page. she is not an irrelevant lady.

she's one of the most prominent vietnamese in the fields of science, and we have no picture of engineers, and of no women on the page. we need such models for vietnamese americans. if you read about her, you would see that she has contributed much for vietnamese americans and for vietnam. Tridungvo 15:46, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

hi. i thought she was relevant because the section informs about the socioeconomic background of the vietnamese and how education is highly valued. it also says some vietnamese americans are engineers in the silicon valley, and that some vietnamese excel in academics. but i see your problem. she may belong more in another section. is it ok, if i post the picture on another section, say social perception and portrayal?

but then again, i see another problem. much of section on economics and social perception and portrayal are about the vietnamese americans culture, maybe we should make an own section about that.? Tridungvo 16:18, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] help with citing sources

Hi, i wanted to write the following to the vietnamese norwegian page: "A 2006 survey showed that Vietnamese had the highest grades in college among the ten largest non-western immigrant groups in Norway. " And then i would like to add the source: "http://www.imdi.no/upload/støren.pdf". I tried to add the source after your model, but it didn't work. tx Tridungvo 15:40, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] adding picture to culture of vietnam

hi, i don't know how to get the copyright, but i consider the picture on this link of ngo mon, to be ideal to the Culture of Vietnam page: http://images.google.no/imgres?imgurl=http://www.viettouch.com/nguyen/nguye0aa.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.viettouch.com/nguyen/nguyen0_1.html&h=288&w=446&sz=41&hl=no&start=1&tbnid=dKF2zxvc3TnHiM:&tbnh=82&tbnw=127&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dngo%2Bmon%26gbv%3D2%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Dno

i also think the picture of the thien mu pagoda, on the culture of vietnam page is rather dull and colorless. Tridungvo 13:05, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Talk:Đ

I've started yet another move proposal at Talk:Đ that you might like to comment on. --Ptcamn 16:25, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Confused

After reading the Van Mieu page, I've been thinking of creating a page for Vietnamese Mandarin officials (quan), especially since I see a lot of westerners who automatically assume upon hearing about "mandarins" in Vietnam that they are Chinese, without realizing the second meaning which refers to a scholar-official. However, I'm confused and frustrated on what title to use, whether something like "Mandarin in Vietnam" (since a Mandarin disambiguation page already exists with a bunch of different options including one for the Chinese mandarins) or something more specific to Vietnamese like "quan" (but then that's not an english title..). I'm not even sure if quan is the most commonly used term for this to begin with?.. What name do you suggest I should use? And in your opinion is this even worthy of an article?Annamite tonkinese 02:58, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

I hope you don't mind my commenting. I think this sounds like a good idea for an article. But I don't think you should assume that every English speaker assumes a "Mandarin" is Chinese. We can also use the term, in English, to refer to a higher-up of whatever ethnic origin--at least I am fairly sure of this. Badagnani 03:03, 5 April 2007 (UTC)
By the way, can we make an article on the Quoc Tu Giam? This seems extremely important as it's older than the University of Bologna, usually claimed as the world's oldest university! Do you guys have access to good sources? Badagnani 03:21, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

About the Quoc Tu Giam...I know!! I've heard people claim this and that university was the oldest in the world but they all fell short of the 700 years of the Quoc Tu Giam. I guess it's not mentioned because its use as a university ceased in the 18th century. Oh! anyways, about the Mandarin thing haha - I thought about modifying the existing article but I saw that the Koreans had their own article for the Yangban class. Also, Vietnamese mandarins had to have a mastery of Vietnamese classics and such as well :P I also noticed in the Vietnamese wikipedia that there was quite an extensive listing of Vietnamese mandarins (although no actual article specifically for the definition of a Mandarin) and was hoping with the creation of an English page for Vietnamese mandarins it would serve as a basis for several quite established/developed Vietnamese wiki articles to be translated over to English. However, you're also right in terms of keeping wiki clean and tidy and sometimes certain articles just don't need to be written..gah I don't know.Annamite tonkinese 05:07, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

I certainly think Vietnamese mandarins (whatever they are called in Vietnamese) deserves its own article, as the Chinese and Korean ones. Vietnam is a distinct culture. Many people used to claim that Vietnamese music was "essentially" or "nearly" the same as Chinese, but it really isn't (though some of the instruments look similar). Badagnani 05:13, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] History

Do you think that a historian who states that "Almost all of the conflicts in Vietnamese history before the 20th century had involved Vietnamese fighting against Vietnamese, not against external enemies" can be considered a reliable source? I think he's nuts if he thinks that Vietnam and China got on well. Blnguyen (bananabucket) 08:00, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Well, the fellow is a self-proclaimed revisionist....He's got a PhD though, the fact that one has a PhD doesn't really qualify the theory to be credible. Blnguyen (bananabucket) 07:24, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Category:Systems

Thank you for your contribution to Category:Systems in the past. There is currently a Call for Deletion for this category. If you would like to contribute to the discussion, you would be very welcome. In particular, if you would like to save this category, please add a Keep entry with your "signature" using "~~~~". Please do this soon if possible since the discussion period is very short. Thank you for your interest if you can contribute. Regards, Jonathan Bowen 18:33, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Ton That Dinh

Hi there. Do you know which diacritic is meant to be used for Dinh? The book I used, was inconsistent and contradicted itself. Thanks, Blnguyen (bananabucket) 04:16, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Straw poll

You expressed opinions on the reordering of Cho Seung-hui's name. Please vote in the straw poll on renaming him in Wikipedia here. --Dynaflow 06:44, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Vietnamese people in Taiwan ???

Vietnamese people in Taiwan ??? Vietnamese people in Taiwan ??? Vietnamese people in Taiwan ??? Vietnamese people in Taiwan ??? Vietnamese people in Taiwan ??? Vietnamese people in Taiwan ??? Vietnamese people in Taiwan ??? --59.117.245.251 12:59, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

ja:在台ベトナム人 ??? --59.117.245.251 13:02, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Why is Cho's sister named in Korean order?

"It seems that some of the press is backtracking. NBC is naming his sister using the Western order. I hope they realize how stupid it is to call him using the Korean order when everyone around him, and even himself, use the Western order. I admire the LA Times, NPR, and ABC News for staying consistent without confusing the audience in naming him. DHN 00:34, 19 April 2007 (UTC)"

DHN, that doesn't mean the press is backtracking. I bet Cho's sis has US Citizenship, and therefore is legally recognized in that order. It would be the same thing as if Person A from Taiwan arrives in the US but stays as a Taiwanese citizen while his sister becomes a US citizen and renounced Taiwanese citizenship. WhisperToMe 01:00, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

Ah, so some groups are. Tell ya what: You can try this debate again in a few weeks if it seems like the news organizations more or less reach a consensus to reverse their positions. If that happens, then you are likely to get the article moved. WhisperToMe 00:24, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Why did the press use Korean order?

Check this Slate article: http://www.slate.com/id/2164659/?nav=fix

The press usually asks the subject and/or his or her kin what the preferred order is.

In this case, Cho died, and his family could not be contacted. So an officer of Korean descent reccommended FNGN.

WhisperToMe 08:01, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Nguyễn lords

Why are you reverting my Interwiki corrections? --JonnyJD 15:50, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

About the lords (list): de:Kaiser der Nguyễn-Dynastie, Nguyễn lords, nl:Nguyen-heren, vi:Chúa Nguyễn

About the Dynasty altogether: de:Nguyễn-Dynastie, Nguyễn Dynasty, fr:Dynastie Nguyễn, ja:阮朝, vi:Nhà Nguyễn, zh:阮朝

I am quite sure about all of them except vi:Chúa Nguyễn and vi:Nhà Nguyễn. If it is the other way around we have to exchange the vi-links only.

--JonnyJD 16:02, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

The article in de.wiki lists the names of the Nguyen emperors of the Nguyen Dynasty (1802-1945). The other articles are specifically about the Nguyen Lords (1558-1775), who are only related to the Nguyen Dynasty in that they're the dynasty's ancestors. They are not the same thing. As far as I am aware there is no article in de.wiki specifically about the Nguyen lords. DHN 16:19, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

(I moved the answer --JonnyJD 16:33, 4 May 2007 (UTC))

Well - Who should understand that.. Okay - Then it's clear why you reverted me. I will check the links again. Also concerning the time periods. There is still not everything correct, because there are some conflicts left. There might be some links we have to remove yet. Thank you for the important information. --JonnyJD 16:33, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

The conflicts are solved (mostly the nl-redirect). I also put a message in de:Kaiser der Nguyễn-Dynastie about the problem of the different period in the other languages. Thank you for your cooperation ;-) --JonnyJD 16:51, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "Unusual" meats

Aren't "unusual" animals eaten in the South as well? Badagnani 18:37, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] 75.31.139.180

I noticed that you reverted some edits from this IP. This IP Appears to be making a lot of possibly bogus edits to Vietnam related articles. If you have time to review, check them out. thanks. —Gaff ταλκ 06:39, 13 May 2007 (UTC) For example: Demography of Vietnam —Gaff ταλκ 06:42, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Merge tags on Miao people and Hmong people

I've removed the tags you have added for the time being since you did not provide a reason for why you believe the articles should be merged. As it stands, the Miao people article needs a lot of work, but it is really focused on "Miao" as an official ethnic minority (nationality) in China. It includes some information about the group as a whole (including information about the "legendary" history of the Miao). The Hmong people focuses on the Hmong as a global community. In China, they constitute only a subsection of the Miao nationality and their numbers are significant enough to warrant another article. The article contains specific information about Hmong people in Laos and America that would be unsuitable for the Miao people article (since most Miao people aren't Hmong). It is also true that the Hmong people article needs to be expanded to include more information about Hmong people in Thailand, Australia, and France - more information that would not be suitable for the Miao people article.

I think it is somewhat misleading at the moment since the articles still share many of the same pictures, but hopefully, this will be rectified as the articles are expanded. These are some of my reasons for not merging. If you disagree, please replace the merge tag and I'd be happy to discuss the issue more with you. Thanks. Nposs 02:26, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Join the Southeast Asia WikiProject

Will you consider joining Wikipedia:WikiProject Southeast Asia? I think you have made a lot of contributions to Vietnamese-related articles, and would appreciate your voice in helping coordinate the editing of all related articles. Yellowtailshark 04:17, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Ume

Can you check this edit for accuracy? Badagnani 05:52, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Need help with Vietnamese fruit

Yesterday in the Vietnamese grocery store I saw a frozen whole fruit, the size of a grapefruit but with a hard, rough skin. I was told that one can't eat it fresh, but that it's cooked with sticky rice to impart a red color. I think it's called "gat" or "trai gat." I can't find anything online so I think I need the tone marks. Any idea of what this is, so I can try to determine the species? Thanks, Badagnani 20:28, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

OK, I think it's "trai gac" (photo here. But I still can't find the species. Badagnani 20:30, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

Found it: Gac. Badagnani 20:35, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Basil seeds

Hi, I want to add the tone marks to the Basil article, in the discussion of basil seeds (used for sweet drinks). I think it's called "hot e." Badagnani 00:59, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

I think I got it: hột é. Badagnani 01:03, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Sterculia lychnophora

I think I'm going to need help to add to this one: Sterculia lychnophora. Badagnani 01:22, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks--I've got a package of them here. They look like giant, dark-colored rose hips or huge, oblong allspice berries. The people in the Vietnamese grocery store told me they were called doei oei and that you put 2 or 3 of them in about 3-4 cups of warm or cold water, then they swell up about 8-12 times their size. The proprietor told me I could also add basil seeds, which also swell up. She said that Vietnamese people drink tons of this stuff, often iced, in the warm months. I've linked a photo at Sterculia lychnophora. It's good to know of Vuong Ngan Ha's expertise. I'm going to try making some of this stuff now. Badagnani 01:39, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

What does the "hạt" in hạt lười ươi mean? Badagnani 01:42, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, that's the thing. Any good Vietnamese online sources about this thing you can find that could add to the article? Sorry for constantly bothering you with extremely obscure Vietnamese foods! Badagnani 01:43, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

From this photo, it looks like it's used in a tong sui-type sweet soup (as well as cold drinks). Can you tell anything about this soup from the list of ingredients? Is it a sweet dessert soup? Is it considered medicinal? Badagnani 02:03, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Gac

I wrote to a Flickr user in VN who says she's a huge Wikipedia fan and she gave me permission to upload her photo of gac-flavored rice. Take a look at gac. It's quite nice. Badagnani 02:41, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

Here's a photo of the fruit (I've asked for permission to use these as well). I think it is more popular in the north. I'd never seen one before yesterday (they had it frozen in the Vietnamese grocery store). The owner told me I didn't want to bother with it because it has to be cooked; she pointed me to the pinkish-red sticky rice that was already made, on another shelf. Apparently it has a short shelf life even in Vietnam. Badagnani 02:58, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Need help with Vietnamese plant name at English Wikipedia

I tried posting this to Vuong Ngan Ha's page at vi:Wikipedia and it wouldn't let me save it; there's some weird diagonal message over the "save" button. Any idea what's going on? Are they blocking anons? That's not very welcoming to contributions from foreign editors, I think. Maybe you can answer this?

Hi, User:DHN suggested I ask you if I ever need help with the Vietnamese name of a plant. Can you add the Vietnamese name for en:Sesbania grandiflora, at the article on the English Wikipedia? Thank you, Badagnani 03:08, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Vietnamese Naming Convention

There seems to be an inconsistent usage of Vietnamese diacritical marks for article titles. I've created a Wikipedia:Naming conventions (Vietnamese) page to begin the discussion on setting a convention. Yellowtailshark 03:37, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Bánh bò nướng

Hi, I'd like to make an article about bánh bò nướng ("cow cake"). Do I have the diacritics right? Badagnani 06:26, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! It's a very sweet, chewy, coconut-flavored cake. Maybe the best-tasting Vietnamese food of all time. It's got many little holes. See if you can find it in the Vietnamese store the next time you're there. It's really good if you heat it up in the oven first. Here's a photo of it (though I've never seen it green): http://pwmf.blogspot.com/2005/10/bnh-b-nng-vietnamese-honey-comb-cake.html Badagnani 06:43, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Here are photos of the normal-colored kind: http://images.google.com/images?svnum=10&um=1&hl=en&q=%22banh+bo+nuong%22 Badagnani 06:44, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

I made the article. Can you add anything to it from Vietnamese-language sources? Badagnani 07:02, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Oh, good, you know it. I didn't know there was a non-baked version. Do you think they should be consolidated in one article or should I go ahead and make the "banh bo" article as well? Badagnani 16:53, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Is the steamed one called "Bánh Bò Hấp"? Badagnani 16:55, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

OK, I've put the two into a single article, Bánh bò. See if you can add anything. Badagnani 18:49, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Rượu nếp

I've finally made Rượu nếp. Would you check it for any omissions or inaccuracies? And what is "ruou nep bac," for which there are a few references on the Internet? Badagnani 20:15, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Is the description of ruou nep at Rice wine correct? The VNStyle article I've linked does say that some versions can be drunk. Badagnani 20:19, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

OK, thanks--I've got another Vietnamese word under my belt now: "bac." Check out the article now and see if it all looks accurate; I've added a few things. Rượu nếp. Badagnani 20:35, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Two more questions, which maybe you could answer by looking at Viet-language sources: 1. does it have any sugar in the recipe (com ruou seems not to have any, though there may be residual sugars due to the fermentation of the rice), and 2. is this the drink that the minority people serve and which guests drink simultaneously with their hosts from big clay jugs through long straws? The article I linked seems to assert that it is. A friend from Hanoi told me that there are "minority drinking houses" in Hanoi where you can pay to do this, and beautiful female hostesses will drink with you while a musician is jamming away on a trong com (rice drum). You pour the liquor into the jar with a buffalo horn and you have to look deeply into the eyes of the hostess while drinking. Totally fake, but popular nonetheless! Badagnani 20:38, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

I wonder if the minority wine is the same thing, just with two different names (because the article I linked says ruou nep is the one). Or maybe ruou nep is the one served by northern minorities and the other one is served by the Central Highland minorities. Badagnani 20:52, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

I found these in the Viet link you forwarded: Rượu trứng and Rượu thuốc. Do these need articles? Do you know what they are? Badagnani 20:52, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

What does the banana leaf contribute to the ruou nep in the Viet-language recipe? Badagnani 20:52, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Do these links, or these links, or these links explain the differentiation between the two names of the minority wine? Badagnani 20:56, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

It mentions that the minorities make it in the links I gave above. But maybe they're referring to the minorities who live in the north, in the mountains west of Hanoi. That would make sense. See what you can get out of the links. Badagnani 21:14, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

I just found a scientific paper that mentions Ruou Nep Than (purple glutinous rice wine), which is made in the Mekong Delta. That would contradict the sources we have, which say that ruo nep is not made in the South. Badagnani 21:27, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Any idea what "Ruou Nep Nuong" is? I just found a reference for it. Badagnani 21:28, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Here are the links that I thought might refer to minorities making ruou nep, because many of them mention ruou can in the same sentence: these links, or these links, or these links Can you see what they say? Badagnani 21:32, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

OK, thanks for sorting that out. But it's confusing because ruou nep nuong also has ruou nep in the name, but it's made by a minority. Any idea what minorities make it, how it differs from regular ruou nep, and where exactly Nuong is? BTW I've added the following text to the article: "Yet another variety of minority rice wine is rượu nếp nương, made from a variety of glutinous rice grown in a mountainous cultivation area called Nương."

Can you check the article to see if everything is accurate? I think I'm pretty much done with this one; we'll just wait for editors with more expertise to add to it in the future. Badagnani 21:49, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Is it possible nep Nuong is from Dien Bien Province? See this page. Badagnani 21:53, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

These two sites seem to say that nep nuong is from the Tay Bac region: http://www.nongnghiep.com.vn/product_info.php?&products_id=112&osCsid=1f19fad027979878ba1bb9d24c35136a and http://vietnamnews.vnagency.com.vn/showarticle.php?num=01RES060205

OK, I've added a description of ruou nep nuong to the Ruou nep article (nuong is not a proper place name, correct?) But I don't know what to put for ruou nep trang and ruou nep than. Should I add a sentence or two about each of these variations, along with ruou nep nuong? That would make four varieties, the way there are two varieties of banh bo. Badagnani 22:04, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

It looks like than is a brown-colored fermented glutinous rice wine made from brown sticky rice, and trang is actually not a rice wine, but a distilled rice liquor. Am I correct, and should all of these be discussed as variations in the Ruou nep article? These wines/liquors are quite different from the pudding usually associated with the term "ruou nep"! Badagnani 22:10, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] More foods

We don't have a WikiProject Vietnam, is that right? If we did, we could coordinate articles that need to be written. In the meantime, this Flickr photo has a comment on the bottom that names some of the foods. One is the banh bo we've been working on, but do you recognize any of the other names? Maybe some of them need articles of their own. Badagnani 23:48, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Sâm bố lượng

I managed to figure out the translations of the above cakes, so may make articles for them (one has banana, another has pandan, and another cassava). A friend in Vietnam just mentioned a sweet dessert called sâm bố lượng. Only one Google hit (a discussion board posting in Vietnamese). Any idea about this food? Badagnani 01:26, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

Wow, you're good! Now I recall she said it's a Chinese food from the "5 District" (presumably of HCM City). Does that mean Chinatown? Badagnani 01:38, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

It sounds like it must be a tong sui like luk mei. Is it Vietnamized, like banh bo or pho, meaning that it merits an article under the Vietnamese name? I suppose it has a spelling in Chinese characters which would be helpful to allow for searching in Chinese as well. Badagnani 01:52, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

That photo isn't a good one. Tong sui usually look more like this or this. Badagnani 02:04, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

I think it might be this one. One website had both Chinese and Viet, and called it Chè Sâm Bổ Lượng (not sure what the "Che" is). Badagnani 02:24, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

Man, you should teach Vietnamese! I wasn't sure about the first character, because it doesn't sound like "sam" in Cantonese or Mandarin (not sure about Min Nan/Chaozhou, which also has a strong presence in south VN). I originally thought "sam" might come from "3" but there are at least 4 ingredients in the soup (in addition to sugar and water). The way I found the characters was by doing a "Rosetta stone"-type search, putting in the Viet name plus the Chinese character 三. Eventually there was a page in Chinese explaining the Vietnamese soup. Badagnani 02:51, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

See here. Badagnani 02:52, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

It says the dish is popular in Hainan, where it also includes coconut as an ingredient. They speak mostly Min Nan (though there are Cantonese there as well), so maybe "sam" comes from a Min Nan pronunciation--which Wiktionary doesn't list yet. Badagnani 03:01, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

OK, not just Hainan, then. The Chinese Wikipedia article confirms that the recipe is nearly identical to the Vietnamese version, but still doesn't identify where "sâm" comes from. Badagnani 03:09, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

Oh, there's no "ching" sound in Vietnamese? I'm waiting for the day when some han tu expert is going to put all the Viet readings of the han tu into English Wiktionary. A fair number are already in the Viet Wiktionary and it's dizzying how many different readings (up to 8 or more) exist for some characters! Badagnani 03:17, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks--does it give all the readings, like the Viet Wiktionary does, or just the most commonly used ones? Come to think of it, even in Chinese there are often multiple readings for a single character, depending on context, the weather, etc. Badagnani 03:27, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

Would you check out Sâm bổ lượng? Badagnani 01:53, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

I thought you thought the Vietnamese version was slightly different. If not, I could just move the article to the Chinese name... Badagnani 02:12, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Well, we've got Zhajiang mian and Jajangmyeon, and they're a little bit different...so I guess we can keep the article for now and maybe also add one for the Chinese name--then merge them later if other knowledgeable editors claim they're exactly the same. But there are probably some small differences, as there are between the various SE Asian pho-like rice noodle beef soups in neighboring countries. Badagnani 02:22, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

I just tried this for the first time. I found it pre-made in a grocery store in Akron, Ohio. In place of the Job's tears they used regular pearl barley. And there were also thinly sliced strips of ginger root, and what I think are gingko nuts. Should I add these as alternate ingredients? I made a point of asking the owner, "This is a Chinese dish, right?" At first she said, "Yeah, Chinese," then said "No! It's Vietnamese! I guess pizza is American, too... ;) Badagnani 18:50, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Bánh da lợn

Here's a new one--can you check it? Badagnani 04:49, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Bánh khoai mì

One more to check: Bánh khoai mì. Badagnani 05:14, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Ha. I haven't tasted most of these things, I just met, in my research on gac, this Vietnamese woman on Flickr and she keeps posting these kinds of photos, like this one. I feel like if each cake isn't documented properly at Wikipedia, we aren't doing our jobs right. ; ) (And besides, we have to outdo the Viet Wikipedia, to spur them to make their own articles on these things!) ha ha Badagnani 05:30, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Oh yeah, what do you think about a WikiProject Vietnam, or are there not enough of us interested in the subject? (I think there are fewer than about 6!) Badagnani 05:32, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

I'm not that knowledgeable so I'd leave it to you guys/gals. Isn't VNH banned from en:wiki? Badagnani 05:53, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Bánh chuối

Here's a new one. Badagnani 22:41, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Bánh chưng

Hi, any idea if the "chung" in Bánh chưng comes from the "zong" in Zongzi? Badagnani 23:00, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

It looks like it might come from the Cantonese pronunciation, not the Sino-Vietnamese reading (which is tống). Badagnani 23:13, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Could it be coincidence that the Cantonese is jung? Badagnani 23:14, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

I just wonder whether, since this dumpling was adopted probably hundreds of years earlier than sâm bố lượng (which was apparently introduced by recent southern Chinese immigrants, and acknowledged as such), that the origin story/etymology you know is an example of folk etymology? The Navajo, for example, only got to Arizona a few hundred years ago but many of their legends state that they always lived in that area. I don't want to diminish the uniqueness of any Vietnamese food item, of course--I just want to make sure we examine all possibilities here, as many of these things aren't well documented in writing, but more through oral tradition. Badagnani 23:19, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Let me just say that I don't rule out the fact that the leaf-wrapped, steamed glutinous rice dumpling may be of Southeast Asian rather than Chinese origin in the first place (and thus it may be an example of something that didn't necessarily get introduced to VN from China). Badagnani 23:20, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

As above, I'm not stating it's of Chinese origin, just asking (because of the similarity in the word). Since Zongzi is a southern Chinese food, maybe it even came into China from Vietnam. Maybe there's no way to know. Is there a han tu for the chưng food? Badagnani 23:31, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Ah, it means "steam." Very interesting! This is distinct from "hap," the adjective meaning "steamed." Badagnani 23:41, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Should I add the han tu to the Bánh chưng article, just for interest's sake? It wouldn't imply a Chinese origin, but it would imply that it's an old food in Vietnam, if there is a character for it (it means it was eaten in the times when Vietnamese used Chinese characters). Badagnani 23:42, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Nom

Oh, no--I don't know the difference between "han tu" and "nom"! I'd better leave it up to you. Is it something like how Japanese has hiragana and katakana (two different sets of characters, for indigenous and foreign words, respectively)? Badagnani 23:47, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

And the character you gave me shows up as an empty box...strange. Badagnani 23:48, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Oh, my God--what a disaster! Yes, I see why the current roman-based alphabet was so roundly accepted, though it's sad that so few young people can read the characters, cutting them off from much of the old literature of their own culture. A couple of years ago I met a guy in New York city (he plays dan tranh on Billy Bang's jazz album) who has created software for the Sino-Viet characters and I think even has an institute for the study and preservation of these. So a few people are still into it. Badagnani 00:12, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

That's the guy!!! Badagnani 00:19, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

I had no idea, and I wonder what kinds of views he's expressing. From his resume I see that he has a very wide range of scholarly interests, so he must be a genius. It was a pleasure to hear him explain about how he put the Vietnamese dan ca together with jazz. Badagnani 00:30, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Banh tet trung thu

Do you know anything about something called "Banh tet" or "Banh tet trung thu"? I think we need an article on it. Badagnani 03:43, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

Are they related to Mooncake? Badagnani 03:43, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

OK, looks like "Bánh Tết trung thu" is a very uncommon name and that "Bánh trung thu" is the main name for this. Like the sweet soup described above, I wonder if this should just be a redirect to Mooncake, with discussion of the Vietnamese version in that article (which I've just added). Badagnani 03:51, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

I redirected it to Mooncake, with added description and addition of a "Vietnamese cuisine" cat.

[edit] Banh Tet

OK, I think we need this article: Bánh Tết or Bánh Tét (not sure which is correct). Badagnani 04:01, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

There are nearly 3,000 hits for the former--is it really not an alternate spelling? http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22B%C3%A1nh+T%E1%BA%BFt%22&btnG=Google+Search Badagnani 04:06, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

Uh-oh, this is confusing. This one looks different from this one or this one. Badagnani 04:14, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

It doesn't mean "cake"? Most of the photos (under the spelling you say is correct) show the log-type thing, so I think it probably merits an article of its own. Do you agree? Badagnani 04:16, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

OK, all I'd need now is what "tét" means. I was confused because I thought it referred to the holiday. Badagnani 04:34, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

From the English-language sources, it seems that some non-Vietnamese who are writing about this think that "Tét" means the holiday, because people eat it for the New Year. Badagnani 04:53, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

One more question: are bánh tét ông and bánh tét bà specific types? Badagnani 04:56, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

Did you say it's mainly a southern thing? And should I make reference to the northern rectangular one in the article? You said they're related? Badagnani 05:15, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

New article --- Bánh tét

All right, I'm flying blind so if there's anything that should be fixed, I hope you'll do it.  :) Badagnani 05:22, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

I think mochi/dduk would be made from glutinous rice flour rather than whole rice grains. But from the photo, bánh giầy looks most like mochi. I found the Vietnamese Wikipedia category for banh and it's funny that they have about a dozen more kinds of banh. Vietnam seems to have an endless number of these! Badagnani 05:40, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

It's so confusing my head is spinning. Of course, this is just one guy's opinion, but knowledge of neighboring countries can provide interesting cross-cultural context. I believe the original cultivation region for rice was SE Asia (so the scientists believe), so it's possible that various wrapped rice dishes may have spread north into China in ancient times--then maybe spread back? Badagnani 05:50, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

Oh, the Rice article says China was the original area of cultivation. Badagnani 05:52, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Bot

Wow, your bot is doing great work! Badagnani 06:49, 10 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Trieu Thi Trinh

Hello there. You seem to very knowledgeable about Vietnamese history. I was wondering if you could translate some of the information in the Vietnamese that is not in the English version. Also, I was wondering if you knew when exactly (what century) Trieu Thi Trinh first appeared in Vietnamese historical records. From Vietnamese/Western sources, it states that she first appeared in historical records written in the Le Dynasty while in Chinese sources it states that she first appeared in the Qing Dynasty. Also maybe you could look into the article to find mistakes that I have made. Thanks :-) (whipsandchains 20:45, 12 June 2007 (UTC))

"Most, if not all, of Vietnam's written records were confiscated by China during the 20-year Chinese domination in 1407-1427."

-Really? I didn't know that. Really sorry about what my ancestors did to you guys. Shame, I wanted to learn more about her.

I edited your entry of Trieu and filled the blanks:

The Mậu Thìn year, [248], (11th year of Hán Diên Hy (Han Yanxi (延熙)); 1st year of Ngô Vĩnh An (Chiwu (赤烏))). The people of Cửu Chân again attacked citadels, the prefecture was in rebellion. The Wu king appointed the "Hành Dương" Imperial Imperial Secretist Lục Dận [Lu Yin] (some books say Lục Thương) to Inspector of Jiaozhou. Dận arrived, used the people's respect for him to call them to lay down arms, people surrendered, numbering more than 30,000 households, and the prefecture was once again peaceful. Afterwards, a woman from the Cửu Chân commandery named Triệu Ẩu assembled people and attacked several commanderies (Ẩu has breasts 3 thước [1.2 m] long, tied them behind her back, often rides elephants to fight). Dận was able to subdue [her]. (Giao Chỉ records only write: In the mountains of Cửu Chân commandery there is a woman with the surname Triệu, with breasts 3 thước long, unmarried, assembled people and robbed the commanderies, usually wearing yellow tunics, feet wearing shoes with curved fronts, and fights while sitting on an elephant's head, becoming an immortal after she dies).

Is it ok if I add it to the Wiki page? (whipsandchains 02:08, 13 June 2007 (UTC))

Hello :) I trasnlated the important part of Lu Yin's biography. His only contribution to Wu seems to be the putting down of the 248 revolt and capturing some bandits afterwards.

From my research Cang Wu seems to be a prefecture within or near Jiaozhou. Could the Bandits in Cang Wu be Trieu?(whipsandchains 03:37, 13 June 2007 (UTC))

Hello again :) Yes, I believe you're right about 九真, it's Jiuzhen. Yes, I see your point about the bandits, The literal translation would be "Armed against the Law" and in modern terms usually means thieves, but rebels is also a possible translation in this context. Thanks for pointing that out. I've revised the bio:

Cang Wu at the time was under the Jiaozhou. Jiaozhou during Han was a huge area that covered roughly today's Guanzhou, Guangxi, Yunnan provinces, and part of Northern Vietnam all the way to central Vietnam. (whipsandchains 04:31, 13 June 2007 (UTC))

Should we paste the two accounts into the article? (whipsandchains 05:08, 13 June 2007 (UTC))

Hello again. I've added the excerpts into the article. I wasn't sure if I should split the Traditional and Modern account into 2 sections or not. Feel free to change it if theres anything wrong. I'll do more research into this topic within the weekend. Thanks so much for your help :) (whipsandchains 06:09, 13 June 2007 (UTC))

Hello, I asked a friend to look over my translations for errors and did a few corrections. Heres the revised bio for Lu Yin.

"In the 11th year of Chiwu (赤烏) [248] in Jiaozhi (交趾), Jiuzhen (九真) rebels attacked walled cities which caused a great uproar. Lu Yin (陸胤) [of Hengyang (衡阳) ] was given rank of the Inspector of Jiaozhou by the Sovereign of Wu. He took his troops and entered the southern border and sent word to the rebels. He used his craftiness to convince them to accept his terms. [In] Gao Liang (高涼), the commander Huang Wu (黄吳) with 3,000 households came out to surrender. Lu Yin now led the army south to that region. He announced his sincerity [to the aborigines] and distributed gifts. The [remaining] 100 rebels leaders and 50,000 households, who had been unruly and unapproachable, kowtowed [to Lu Yin]. Thus the territory was handed over peacefully. At once Lu Yin was given the rank of General who Tranquilizes the South. Again he was sent on a punitive expedition against the rebels in Cang Wu (蒼梧). He defeated them quickly. From start to finish Lu Yin's military troops totaled 8,000. Lu Yin then helped to plant crops and kept the people fed."

Cheers :) (whipsandchains 01:12, 14 June 2007 (UTC))

  • Hello :) I looked into the confiscation of Vietnamese records. Chinese records do say that it happened.
Imperial orders were sent to the Cheng-guo Duke Zhu Neng, regional commander of the force being sent on expedition to punish Annam. The orders read: "When the army enters Annam and takes prefectural cities, none of the registers, maps or gazetteers which are obtained are to be destroyed."[1]

I also asked around abit for more info on the good Lady Triue. According to Keith Taylor, the earliest writing that mentioned Lady Trieu is the An nam Chi Luoc[2] (1335) written by Le Tac, who submitted to the Yuan, thus many people consider this account to be from a Mongol perspective. Cheers (whipsandchains 23:58, 16 June 2007 (UTC))

[edit] Cao lau

Are there tones for Cao lau? Badagnani 04:44, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks--any idea what the "cashew root powder" described in the article is? I've never heard of this food/seasoning. Badagnani 04:52, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

Amazing story! Is Mi Quảng the wrong spelling? Badagnani 05:11, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

Are you saying that the "cashew root" is a mistranslation of the plant whose ashes are used? Badagnani 05:11, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

If it's used "just for color" and paprika could be a substitute, I think maybe they mean "turmeric powder." Not sure how they got cashew root powder, but maybe that's a real ingredient after all. Badagnani 05:34, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Bánh cuốn

Could you check Bánh cuốn? Badagnani 05:43, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Chè

Do we need an article on "chè" (sweetened porridge)? Badagnani 03:09, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Chau Giang

Hi, can you figure out diacritics for Chau Giang? Badagnani 07:30, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Bánh khoai mì

I just bought some bánh khoai mì and the last letter is a "y" with a line over it rather than an "ì." Is this an alternate spelling? Badagnani 18:47, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks--so we just keep the article at the present title, and no need to even mention the alternate spelling in the article? Badagnani 19:13, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

The Vietnamese "D" pronounced like a "Y" is one of the hardest pronunciation things for me to remember. Today I asked for "banh Da lon" and they didn't know what I was talking about. I described it, and they said, "Oh, 'ya lon'. Badagnani 19:19, 16 June 2007 (UTC)