User:Deco Da Man/LessonsLearnt

What! I have some things to say about this:

1. I have contributed to Talk:ActionScript/rewrite. You have lied.
2. I can assure you I am not using wikipedia as a social networking site.
3. I may have mainly made edits to my userpage, but only because I have been experimenting with wikipedia and reading and learning Wikipedia's policies and tutorials off by heart.
4. I have had no warnings at all about this, this is something you have done before. I've been reading.
5. Have you ever read Wikipedia:Please_do_not_bite_the_newcomers
6. I am still getting 'aquianted' with wikipedia and have not had the courage to edit anything major just yet.
7. I noticed that when you deleted my user page you put 'used wikipedia like myspace'. If I want a place to use like MySpace, I would go to MySpace.
8. I have also been spending time contributing to Wikipedia by making a Flash Client for interacting with Wikipedia. I made a Recent Change watcher in Adobe Flash that has the following code. It needs a multiline dynamic textbox on the stage called 'main_Text_box' on the satge to work

var urlrequest:URLRequest = new URLRequest("http://en.wikipedia.org/w/api.php?action=query&list=recentchanges&format=xml&rclimit=10");
var urlloader:URLLoader = new URLLoader();
urlloader.addEventListener(Event.COMPLETE, updateChanges);
var recentChanges:Array = new Array();
function updateChanges(e:Event) {
 var xml:XMLDocument = new XMLDocument(e.target.data);
 for each(var xmlchild in xml.childNodes[0].childNodes[1].childNodes[0].childNodes) {
  var changed = true;
  for(var i=0;i<recentChanges.length;i++) {
   if (xmlchild.attributes.title == recentChanges[i].title && xmlchild.attributes.timestamp == recentChanges[i].timestamp) {
    changed = false;
   }
  }
  if (changed) {
   recentChanges.push({title:xmlchild.attributes.title, timestamp:xmlchild.attributes.timestamp});
   if (recentChanges.length>50) {
    for (var i=0;i<recentChanges.length-50;i++) {
     recentChanges.shift();
    }
   }
  }
 }
 main_text_box.text = "";
 for (var i = recentChanges.length-1;i>0;i--) {
  main_text_box.htmlText += i+"    "+recentChanges[i].timestamp+"           <a href='http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/"+recentChanges[i].title+"'>"+recentChanges[i].title+"</a><br>";
 }
 getChanges();
}
function progressEvent(e:ProgressEvent) {
 var progPercent = e.target.bytesLoaded/e.target.bytesTotal;
 trace("Loaded: "+(progPercent*100));
}
function getChanges() {
 urlloader.load(urlrequest);
}
getChanges();

Good grief! Another example, from the same admin (User:Ryulong, of taking the book & not just throwing it but absolutely squashing the perceived offender under it. Given the few edits involved, this sanction is so out of proportion as to beggar the imagination.

Of the edits Deco Da Man has done since his initial (& I would argue unjust block from the same admin) was lifted, the only ones I could find that look like "social networking" edits are those improving the design (at Wpktsf's invitation) to User:Wpktsfs/poetry, on User talk:Wpktsfs about those edits, him signing User:Chetblong/Super Secret Page, and a couple of notes to User:Selfworm about "super secret pages" and guestbooks set up by Selfworm. Interestingly enough, Deco Da Man's edits were only in response to stuff set up by those other users; interestingly enough, none of those other users got warnings (or blocks) about behavior that might be considered to amount to "social networking." His other edits since the prior block ended have been to thank me for standing up for him, archiving the conversation surrounding the prior block, welcoming a new user on that user's talk page (User talk:Iw newc84, and contributing to Talk:ActionScript/rewrite.

Otherwise, Deco Da Man seems to have taken to heart my advice after the last block to learn the rules & keep his nose clean before making edits... & what does he get for taking but further punishment from an admin who, pardon me, seems to have a particular animosity towards him. Or at least that's the only explanation I can summon up for not just one but two blocks made by the same admin based on very few edits, without any warnings given in advance per the usual Wikipedia practice of WP:Assume good faith and (Deco Man is right to point out) Wikipedia:Please_do_not_bite_the_newcomers. I certainly hope whichever admin reviews this block is more fair in their evaluation of Deco Da Man's activities, particularly in light of his age (13), inexperience, & relative newness to Wikipedia. Be sure to also review the history of the prior block that Deco Da Man has archived. --Yksin 17:18, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

• Update. I just noticed that Ryulong has also deleted the page User:Deco_Da_Man/LessonsLearnt in which Deco Da Man had previously archived the material relating to his prior block based on charges of sockpuppetry. However, all that stuff was previously on this talk page; see [diff] for what it looked like immediately prior to MaxSem lifting the prior block. --Yksin 17:28, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

• Hi all. I'll see if I can contact the blocking admin. In fairness, though, Deco needs to start looking at mainspace edits and maybe tidying up an article or two. Ryulong does have a point about MySpace, though .... - Alison ☺ 18:42, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

Oh, I have no doubt that Deco Da Man needs to look into these issues about what a user page ought to be used for, and contributing also through doing mainspace edits, even if only to copyedit for typos etc.

But I just discovered that Wikipedia:Blocking policy makes no mention of "User didn't make any mainspace edits in four days" or even "User made five or six edits that look a bit like social networking" or even "User has a user page that resembles the self-introductions made on Myspace pages]] as sufficient reason to block a user. Certainly talking or warning a user about these things would be well within reason -- & Deco Da Man seems to respond pretty well to such cautions & advice -- but laying a block down instead is overkill.

That said, thanks for taking a look. --Yksin 18:56, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

With "LessonsLearnt" I just went through any item in his user space that he created and deleted it. If he agrees to lay off the user space and get to work on improving articles, I would not disagree with an unblock.—Ryūlóng (竜龍) 20:32, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

I'd be glad to lead him by the hand & offer suggestions for how he could get started in making productive edits in mainspace. But meantime, by deleting "LessonsLearnt", you deleted a valid archive of his user talk page -- specifically, the discussion surrounding your first block of him for suspected sockpuppetry. Now it sounds as if you're saying you're disallowing from making an edits in userspace at all, whether those edits serve legitimate purposes for improvement of Wikipedia or not. That's an awfully highhanded way to wield admin powers. --Yksin 21:02, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

• Ok - I've discussed this with the blocking admin and have restored the LessonsLearnt page, though we both agree it is somewhat MySpace-y. It's not that Deco is disallowed from making userspace edits per se, but that he needs to move out of here and start editing article space, which is what this project is all about. May I suggest he maybe begin doing some wikignoming work and possibly use that to gain experience here? WP:CLEANUP would be an excellent place to start and could I suggest that if Deco agrees to Ryulong's suggestion, that you both target an article or two together and Yksin can guide him through it? - Alison ☺ 22:04, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

I'm completely willing to help with that, if Deco Da Man is willing. We actually cross-posted just now; I just spent some time making detailed suggestions to Deco Da Man to both the main concerns Ryulong and you have expressed. I seriously do believe that the main thing here is that this is a fairly youthful individual who mainly just needs a guiding hand to get him on the right track. Now I guess it's a matter of waiting for him to wake up along with the rest of Australia, & respond to this offer. --Yksin 22:17, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

A more formal proposal

I think what I'm offering is something like this: Wikipedia:Mentorship or Wikipedia:Adopt-a-User, with me acting as mentor/adopter to Deco Da Man. I notice that I satisfy all the criteria for an adopter under the AAU program. Would this be acceptable to you, Ryulong? Alison? Would you be able to work with this, Deco Da Man? --Yksin 22:32, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

• I'm okay with that, Yksin. Good idea - Alison ☺ 22:48, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
  • My understanding from this conversation with Ryulong is that if Deco Da Man agrees to lay off on edits of his own userspace for awhile, & to focus instead on mainspace article edits, & to be mentored by me in order to accomplish those ends, that Ryulong will remove the block. Just say okay to this, Deco Da Man, & it can happen.
  • I'm not mean, but if you say okay, you will have to follow through. --Yksin 00:36, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Suggestions for working on Wikipedia

Hey Deco Da Man. In hopes that your second (& in my eyes, second unjust) blocking case is resolved favorably, there are nonetheless some issues that another admin (Alison) besides the blocking editor (Ryulong)) believes need to be addressed: appropriate use of your own userspace, & making contributions by edits to Wikipedia mainspace (i.e., articles). So, here's some suggestions:

Appropriate use of your own userspace.

First take a look at policies and guidelines: WP:NOT#SOCIALNET and Wikipedia:User page

• Per WP:NOT#SOCIALNET, Wikipedians have their own user pages, but they may be used only to present information relevant to working on the encyclopedia. If you are looking to make a personal webpage or blog, please make use of one of the many free providers on the Internet. The focus of user pages should not be social networking, but rather providing a foundation for effective collaboration.

Based on my memory of what your userpage looked like before it was deleted, I'd guess that you from Ryulong's POV it was providing more autobiographical detail about yourself than necessary for Wikipedia purposes, while giving very little about what your interests are on Wikipedia. Take a look at my user page, for example. Or here are other examples I'm just randomly grabbing to show how various users inform the community of their Wikipedia-specific activities/interests: Gimmetrow, Pb30, Keenan Pepper. Note how this last one provide some autobiographical info, but also mentions specific interests & includes a to-do list of tasks that particular users wants to accomplish. You might consider using Template:Todo, which is a nice gizmo way to do the same thing.

All those pages focus more on what how the users involve themselves in Wikipedia than in their non-WP lives/histories: the info, to quote from above, is "providing a foundation for effective collaboration."

Making contributions in Wikipedia mainspace

Maybe you don't know where to begin...? Some start-up resources

• Read Wikipedia:Contributing to Wikipedia. In particular, see the section called "Where do I start?" It's got a lot of good practical suggestions, and links to lots & lots of different kinds of collaborative projects, cleanup efforts, etc. etc. that you could get involved in. For example, one of the projects linked to there is Wikiproject Wikify, which has a well-organized page about how to help with this Wikignome-like task, along with how-to's and tools. Even just a half hour in an evening after school contributing to a project like this would add significantly to your mainspace edits, & maybe make admins like Ryulong feel a whole lot better about you.
• Since you seem to be interested in programming, you might also want to check out the "Programmers wanted" section on the above page.
• Join and become and active member of a WikiProject. For example, there's a whole bunch of them related to Computer science. Or, since you're an Aussie, maybe one of the Australia-related WikiProjects might be up your alley. Check out various projects pages, their purposes, lists of tasks needing to be done -- join a project or two, & do some stuff for them. (And feel free to add userboxes, if available, to your user page to indicate your participation in those projects.)
• Learn how to fight vandalism. Even if you don't become a dedicated vandalism fighter, vandalism is so common that it's good to know the best ways to fight it -- first by learning exactly what it is, of course, in order to be sure you're not inadvertently reverting good edits. I personally learned a tool call Twinkle which makes dealing with vandalism pretty fast & easy, & also assists in making appropriate warnings on the talk pages of vandalizing editors. Mostly I just focus on reverting vandalism on pages on my watchlist, but now & again I go to Special:Recentchanges (linked from the left side of every Wikipedia page) & check out recent edits, especially of mainspace articles edited by anonymous IPs, & look for vandalism & revert it.
• (Be sure when you make edits to put a note in the article's edit summary.)

Anyway, I hope this block, too, is resolved in your favor, & there's a few suggestions to help you keep it off you. Please do ask for help if you don't know what to do. I've got your talk page on my watchlist -- so even if you can't write on mine because of a block, I'm keeping an eye out. --Yksin 22:13, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

Y

I just restored your userpage. Please - don't go hacking away on it quite yet (MySpace, remember?) - you need to move out of your userspace and start making encyclopedic edits. Trusting you, so restoring it, ok? - Alison ☺ 08:42, 21 June 2007 (UTC) [edit] Unblocked Your request to be unblocked has been granted for the following reason(s): You have been given good advice on contributing to the encyclopaedia from Alison and Yksin, please follow it. Request handled by: Steve (Stephen) talk 04:55, 20 June 2007 (UTC)