Talk:Dale Earnhardt

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[edit] NPOV

I found portions of this article to be strikingly biased and un-encyclopedic. In the death section, it cannot be assumed that Earnhardt consciously blocked the field. The line “He decreased his speed to block the rest of the field” particularly bothers me. The last paragraph under controversy also needs to be reworked, for example “Leading experts all knew that, with the chassis change, lack of soft walls, and/or head and neck restraints, the configuration was a recipe for disaster” is obviously unacceptable, unless sourced. The year by year chronology also reads more like a storybook then an encyclopedia, and could be inproved.--RA64 17:14, 5 February 2006 (UTC)


I really think we shouldn't have the picture of the wreck at Daytona that took his life. I want to know if everyone else agrees with me before removing it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Gordonfan (talk • contribs) .

Please sign your comments with ~~~~.
Also, I felt the same way you did at first, but I think it's a valid illustration of what it was like. --Golbez 09:49, Feb 21, 2005 (UTC)
We should no more remove that picture of the crash than we should remove pictures of the Pope at his funeral. Sachmet 02:47, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
I think that the way he died only served to enhance his legend - crashing on the last lap of the biggest race in the sport while holding back the pack so his son and teammate could finish first and second. It's almost too much like a movie ending to even be true. Because of that, I think the picture should stay. It's not as if it's a gory, in the car shot of them pulling his body out. Also, it is a very important moment in NASCAR history that should be preserved on this page. Gorrister 10:16, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
Agreed, it's not a horrifying or sensationalist pic. Unfortunately, it's impossible to capture the essence of his drives in a still pic. I remember one IROC where he started out at the back of the pack and by the end of one lap was leading. Wish I could put that in here somehow. Gzuckier 16:44, 25 May 2005 (UTC)
Third that notion. I had little recollection about the incident until I read this article and saw the photo. --Madchester 05:28, 2005 Jun 2 (UTC)

I absolutely agree that the picture of the wreck Dale died in shouldn't be on this page! Itis disrespectful to his memory. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 150.131.70.174 (talk • contribs) .

I question the use of the term "suicide." The incident happened before I started following NASCAR, but I have never heard anything to suggest that Earnhardt "intentionally took his life." I am not qualified to debate whether or not he willfully pulled back to hold off other drivers. Regardless, I think the term "sacrifice" would at least be a more appropriate term. 63.173.199.124 15:52, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

I got an idea, maybe you show just show a picture of Earnhardt in the 2001 Daytona 500 racing instead of showing the crash, it would help remember him the way he should be.


There's nothing wrong with the crash pic, It's not like that's the only picture on that page. Leave it, its one of the few crash pics that really are important.

[edit] Further NPOV

Browsing through the article, I would have to say that there are more problems with NPOV here, following is a good example:

"Finally! The first words out of everyone's mouth when Dale Earnhardt finally scored the victory in the only jewel left from his crown. After 20 years of disappointment in the Daytona 500 and dominating races only to fall to the wayside late in the going, Earnhardt finally held on and did not let go."

Frankly most of his racing career summary reads more like a fan-page, than an encylopedia. I would edit myself but am European so have no clue about Nascar ^^ Unicron 12:36, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Location of Earnhardt's farm

It has been reported to Wikipedia (by email) that Dale Earnhardt's farm was in Mooresville, rather than Kannapolis. Could someone knowledgeabout on this topic please research it and update the article appropriately?

Just a not to let you know about the ale Earnhardt Sr. article. Dale was born, Ralph Dale Earnhardt. NOT, Dale Ralph, as you have noted. Also in the same article, Dale's farm was in Mooresville,N.C. NOT in Kannapolis,N.C> as you also missed.

Thanks, Kelly Martin 15:10, 1 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] I also have problems with this article

I'm also troubled by the writing of this article. I corrected a few things, but haven't had time to review the entire thing.

My comments are similar to others here...the biggest problem I have is with the section on his death. To insinuate that Earnhardt "backed off" to block the cars behind him is absurd, especially considering the dynamics involved in restrictor plate racing. No one backs off in the draft; if they did, they would get run over. The drivers may lightly touch the brake to stay in the draft, or brake slightly to keep from getting too far ahead of a pack, but they don't back off.

Regardless, it was clear at the end of that race that the two DEI cars were better than anyone else. Earnhardt happened to be in a position where he could help them and simply was content to ride in third and TRY to keep the others at bay. But with the aero package that was used for that race, he would've been hard pressed to hold them back there very long.

Another problem I have is trying to link his crash to the one of his friend, Neil Bonnett. Yes, Bonnett died in basically the same location. But Bonnett's crash was caused by a tire failure, not by driving onto the apron of the track. Furthermore, Earnhardt's crash was not caused by Earnhardt purposely driving onto the apron. His RF tire might have dropped below the apron, but that was due to the contact with Marlin's car. And NASCAR did not mandate the "out-of-bounds" rule because of those two crashes. They did it because there had been an alarming amount of passing done on the apron in past races and NASCAR, under increasing scrutiny due to Earnhardt's crash, marked that area "out-of-bounds."

I have other issues, but these are the most glaring IMO. I wasn't an Earnhardt fan, so I can only fill in and correct certain areas. I did most of the Davey Allison article and will soon try to cleanup the Bill Elliott article and add more content. I would appreciate comments to those when I'm done.

Another thing I noticed was that it says that "Earnhardt’s car was nudged by Sterling Marlin", though looking at the replay (I still vividly remember watching the accident unfold), that it looked like Earnhardt had gotten loose or his car shot down (more than likely accidental), Marlin was in the way, and then everything else happened. Of course though, im sure any viewpoint could be considered a point of view, so I would rather have more insight on that before any edit would be made on it. PYLrulz 00:50, 29 May 2006 (UTC) (NOTE: Someone forgot to sign their comment above me)

[edit] Image

I readded the Dale Earnhardt death crash image, even though he died in that crash I think the image should be in wikipedia to describe the insident. Any thoughts? Thanks --Jaranda wat's sup 03:21, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

I've no problem with it. We have pictures of plane crashes here. --Golbez 03:55, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
For the record, I vote to remove the pic. I think its too disturbing, but I'll live with the majority vote. It looks like the votes above agree with you two. Royalbroil 04:03, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
After further review, I retract my comment. Let's let this discussion RIP. Royalbroil 02:35, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
I agree with Jaranda and Golbez. While some may find it troubling or offensive, Wikipedia is not censored. As it helps portray the crash and is probably one of the more famous NASCAR photographs, I also believe it belongs here. DomRem | Yeah? 04:13, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

Ive got no prob with the pics it shows how nascar has evolved from a very low tech (saftey wise) into a high tech saftey concious sport.


I think the picture should stay. There's nothing gruesome about the actual shot, and it shows how the car looked during the accident, it was a much less violent crash then 20 that Earnhardt was in during his long career. Budcrew08 17:00, 28 March 2006 (UTC)budcrew08

Im a more Jeff Gordon person, but Dale is awesome and the image should stay. I feel that taking off the picture would be an insult to his memory. Also, I found an image on google of Dale's crash, if anyone wants to post it for me because i'm new and they have the restriction. Search "2001 Daytona 500" and look for the 3rd picture from the top to the bottom on the 2nd column. Thanks, and don't delete the image. Anonymous Contributor

P.S. What's so disturbing about a badly crashed stock car?

Could we add some picutes of him in the 3 car doing something other than crashing? Maybe a picure of the pass in the grass, winning Daytona, he and Dave fishing, etc. -richardtwilliams May 28th


Should someone say that that crash killed him, so people that don't like NASCAR know the importance of that picture? NASCAR9 (talk) 22:58, 18 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Succession Boxes

Hey, last week I went through and added championship succession boxes for almost all of the Nascar Grand National/Winston/Nextel Cup Champions. I notice that a couple have since followed suit and chosen to add similar links for the Busch Series and Craftsman Truck Series Champions.

Anyway, as I am an unregistered member, I'm unable to make changes on Dale Earnhardt's page due to the restriction that has been added on there for vandalism. Could somebody with the freedom to edit the 7 time champ's page possibly do a favor and add these for me? He's currently the only break in the link from Red Byron in 1949 through to Tony Stewart in 2005. 192.231.124.24 05:37, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

Thanks, DomRem. Looks good. :-) 192.231.124.24 20:40, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Organization

The Legacy section contains a lot of trivia that may be better off in a dedicated 'Tributes' section. Things like the first two paragraphs and the driver's safety paragraph should stay in Legacy, while listing tributes such as street names, team names, books, movies and music should be listed separately. Legacy would probably remain the best place for his inductions into the halls of fame.

This is too big an edit for me to just up and do without comment from others, so if someone agrees please go ahead and do it. I'm also not quite sure how. Heck, I'm not even sure how to sign talk pages, so I hope this works:Hokisazchka 06:00, 15 May 2006 (UTC)


"It is remarkable, and almost symbolic, that his son, Dale Jr., is still officially marked as "Earnhardt Jr." on the ticker, even when Kerry and Dale Jr are racing together on the racetrack."

actually I'm not sure if its that remarkable. A lot of famous people are known as Jr. even when the Sr. is not that famous. Earnhardt Jr's nickname as "Junior" is no more significant then Al Unser Jr's nickname as "Little Al".--RA64 17:53, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Glaring omission

Nary a word about merchandising of Earnhardt gear, clothing or memorabilia. To me the subject is more signficant, particularly to NASCAR, than much of what is mentioned. --Buckboard 09:23, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] German-American

Can someone provide a source to support this? Michael 03:37, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Kirk Shelmerdine

I think the article ought to mention the contribution of Kirk Shelmerdine, the crew chief for the 1986, 1987, 1990 and 1991 championships. Don't know enough myself about this, not even sure when Shelmerdine became Earnhardt's crew chief - the article on Shelmerdine has this as 1982, but this article has Earnhardt racing for another team in 1982 - they can't both be right, surely?

[edit] Merging in broken of sections discussion

I think the parts of the article that were broken off into separate articles should have been. The portions broken off into articles were extremely distracting because of the high number of vandal and trivial edits. These portions took the emphasis off of Earnhardt, and on to controversies. I think they should remain broken off. --Royalbroil 02:58, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Autopsy photos

The main article discussed the "tabloidesque attempt to publish" the photos, which is both inaccurate and biased. The Orlando Sentinel, which originally asked for the photos, was attempting to have an independent expert analyze the cause of Earnhardt's death in the wake of the controversy caused by the crash.

None of the three plaintiffs in the case that challenged the Earnhardt Family Protection Act had any intention of publishing the photos, and testified to that effect in court. It should also be noted that requesting medical examiner information was fairly commonplace in high-profile deaths prior to Earnhardt's death, especially in cases where the cause of death is in dispute (see Martin Anderson for a more recent example of this). If Earnhardt's bio page discusses the autopsy photos scandal, which I don't believe it should, then the article should get it right.

The spinoff article Dale Earnhardt: Autopsy photographs controversy explains the situation much more accurately. --Paper_pusher 03:44, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Edited Typo

Sterling Marlin's name was listed as "Sterling Marling" in the second paragraph of section 3.

[edit] Regarding the Bristol Incident with Terry Labonte

This line (with emphasis on the section I'm interested in) formally read, "Labonte caught Earnhardt and passed him coming to the white flag, but Earnhardt drove hard into turn four, bumping Labonte and spinning him around. Dale went on to collect the win while spectators booed and made obscene gestures." User 64.12.116.14 editted this line to say that it was turn two where the incident happened. Personnally I find that neither of these make much sense. You don't usually drive hard into the exiting corner. It would make sense that it would be either Turn 1 or Turn 3 that Dale Earnhardt "drove hard into", but because I've never seen the race, I don't know which is correct. Any input would be appreciated. Johaen 00:49, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Parts of the article redone

Some parts of the article, earlier today, were just rewritten, with the early part of Earnhardt's career being split into his early career (pre-1984), and his return to Richard Childress Racing for the 1984 season. I am intending to break the 1990s section into two sections (early and late; with the late 1990s section going into 2000, as the death of Earnhardt should still warrant a separate section. However, that section will also be cleaned up this weekend to read like an encyclopedic entry.

Feedback is welcome. AEMoreira042281 04:18, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

I'd say you've done a pretty good job so far. I think you should break the 90's into 3 sections. The first part would cover the dominance Earnhardt had between 1990 and mid-1996, the second part would cover the winless streak from mid-1996 to the end of 1997, and the third part would cover his resurgent latter years from 1998-2001. Mustang6172 07:02, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Rule of threes

Is there verification for the following statements in the "aftermath" section:

For the first three weeks after Earnhardt's death, on-track incidents brought out the caution flag on lap three. Three weeks after Earnhardt's death, Harvick scored his first career Cup win at Atlanta driving a car that had been prepared for Earnhardt.

Either these are amazing coincidences, or someone is attaching undo significance on "three". PrometheusX303 00:57, 15 September 2006 (UTC)

As I recall there was a wreck the first 3 weeks within 3 laps from the start. Also, Fox had a silent lap 3 where they would not talk while the field was on lap 3. I would check Fox sports for the verification. chefantwon216.153.166.69 21:09, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] 50 Greatest Drivers

NASCAR did not rank them, as the article also shows. Zenmiester 16:27, 10 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] an unmentioned fact

65.100.181.27 04:16, 21 March 2007 (UTC) I guess this could go under legacy or trivia: Many people thought (or claimed) that Dale could see the air in front of him. This more often symbolism for his excellent driving ability than actual belief, but it is still important to the image he maintained. Also, Zenmeister has said that Nascar did not do the rankings for the top 50 drivers (that earnhardt appeared in). Although i can not deny (or confirm) this, it is a complete certainty that he would have been included no matter who made the list.

[edit] Photo Caption

According to the "Death of Dale Earnhard" entry, he died instantly when he it the wall. However, the caption for the crash photo in this entry states: "Earnhardt would die from injuries sustained in this accident" which suggests he died later. Which is it? Originalname37 03:33, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

youre taking it to literal. if you shoot a deer,it dies from the injury sustained in the shooting,and you would also kill it instantly(if youre as good a shot as i am)4tildes.

Actually, you're the one who's taking it literally. Though not *literally* required, a death "from injuries sustained" typically implies a death *later* from these injuries.Originalname37 19:34, 14 September 2007 (UTC)


His death was not announced for a while after the race, but I remember how the ambulance left the track at normal road speed (evidently because the patient was already dead.) There must be video of this on the web somwhere. Timothy Horrigan (talk) 20:41, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Kevin Hamlin

The link to Kevin Hamlin needs fixing. THis link leads to Kevin Hamlin the young Busch Series racer, not Dale Sr's former crew chief.Dspillmann 04:20, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] A song recorded by Dale Earnhardt in 1985

Dale sang the Larry Alderman song "Hard Charger" on a 1985 Nascar country album: "World Series Of Country Music Proudly Presents Stock Car Racings' Entertainers Of The Year".

The only recording I can find is this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fkww-mvRrYo

The song is mentioned on Larry's MySpace page-- http://www.myspace.com/songwriter_1

Jake7457 15:57, 2 July 2007 (UTC)


[edit] Pass His Son?

In the death section it says "either to block Marlin or to try to give himself a chance to pass his son" I don't think the "pass his son" part is correct. When Dale was in turn 3 on the last lap just before the accident he had roughly about 7-8 car links between himself and Dale Jr.. I think it would have been impossible for him to catch Dale Jr. before the start finish line, unless Jr. would have lost it and wrecked. Plus if you look at it from a racing stand point, Dale knew the pack of cars behind him were fast (#40, #2, #36...etc.) he was clearly blocking that pack so his DEI cars would finish good. Anyways I rewrote it to "Earnhardt moved from the center of the turn toward the bottom, possibly to block Marlin." - KaseyKahneFan 16:21, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] tribute

does anyone know where to find a copy of the tribute to dale that was aired on tv with the music from garth brooks "The Dance"? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.244.7.237 (talk) 17:00, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

Limewire has it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.168.242.14 (talk) 01:43, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Tone

Tone is still as awful was it was before. We are here to write a neutral encyclopedia free of judgments...phrases like "Despite the early start, Speedweeks was a disappointment for Earnhardt" and "always a media favorite" and "drawing fire" read like a magazine piece, not fit for an encyclopedia. Also many weasel wrods, such as "which some attributed" and "what many considered" and so on and so forth. I picked those examples from just two paragraphs. hbdragon88 (talk) 10:02, 8 December 2007 (UTC)


there were a few versions done with that song - the DJ at my local country station did one and won awards with it however i cannot find that version —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.153.28.91 (talk) 09:48, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Semi-Protect?

Does anyone think this page should be semi-protected? There has sure been a lot of vandalism/"fan-cruft" by IPs in the past. Boss Big My Talk page 14 December 2007

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Earnhardt crash.jpg

Image:Earnhardt crash.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 06:54, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] This just isn't true

(Had he won the championship that year, he would have been the only driver to win the title in his last full season.)

Joe Weatherly and Alan Kulwicki also won the title the last seasons they ran full-time (okay, nobody ran full-time in Weatherly's day, but he still came as close as anyone did in the '60s, which is why he was in the running for the title in the first place...)

Sean (talk) 21:37, 6 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] GRAG

He ROCKED —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.8.140.202 (talk) 23:13, 22 May 2008 (UTC)