Talk:Cyrus the Great in the Qur'an
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[edit] Moving
Please see the discussion at Talk:Alexander in the Qur'an (Theory), a similar and related case. Melchoir 07:48, 15 February 2006 (UTC)
I got rid of this part
Between Derbent and Dar'yal, however, there are no such mountains and the passes also are wide and passable. In ancient times savage hordes from the north invaded and ravaged southern lands through these passes and the Persian rulers who were fearful of them had to build a strong wall, 50 miles long, 29 feet high and 10 feet wide, for fortification purposes, ruins of which can still be seen.[3]
Because when you clikc on the link it says the wall was Sassanin in origin, and built in the fifth century AD.
[edit] Now really?
I have no idea why this article is here in the Wikipedia encyclopedia. It does not, it any way, conform to the standard of scholarship expected of articles in this encyclopaedia.
To begin with, I must insist on highlighting the stupidity of using Jewish sources as evidence to lend credence to any argumet about Cyrus the Great being mentioned in the Qur'an, or being Dhul Qarnain. I have never come across any Historians proporting to verify Cyrus' mention in the Qur'an, by using said Jewish sources almost exclusively, and paying lip service to the Qur'an and its contents, and mentioning 'Muslim scholars' in passing.
The article establishes its dubious premise of using these Jewish sources by narrating an incident (uncited) where the pagans of Mecca were induced by them to ask the Prophet Muhammad about Dhul Qarnain. From here on in, references from the Bible, and other historical situations abound. There is no attempt to explore the myriad verses of the Qur'an dealing with Dhul Qarnain, in conjunction with these sources. No attempt is made to even include the Qur'an, apart from the title. Using an instance of Jew instigated questioning (uncited) as an argument for using Jewish sources puts the substantial tracts of the article in doubt.
It has weasel words such as 'Muslim historians' in the sentence "and the Muslim historians have also accepted this", in an attempt to link Islam and Muslims to what is essentially a Jewish discourse. As such, 'Cyrus the Great in the Qur'an' is a misleading title.
Another telling feature is the absence of any references at ALL to any of these texts, relying on quotes (which are uncited) as evidences or proofs for the argument.
This article is useless conjecture; shoddy scholarship (or lack thereof), and absolutely stupid.
Badshahi. -- 05:28, 9 July 2006 124.180.207.128
- Regardless of whether the theory is true, if many prominent modern Muslim apologists and defenders of the faith think that it's true, then that's enough to earn it a place in Wikipedia. In any case, the point about Ba`al Haqqeranayim in the Hebrew of Daniel 8:20 is absolutely correct... AnonMoos 19:03, 20 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Replaced OR and verified tags with mergeto
There's enough reliable source to remove OR and verified tags. Therefor I removed them. But I think this is not independent issue and we can merge it to Dhul-Qarnayn.--Sa.vakilian(t-c) 14:48, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Zoroastrianism was not monotheistic
It was dualistic (i.e. there were two deities).
Mbassan 04:17, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
[edit] The chinese and the russians, and The Remnants of the Walls
In the Textbook What Islam Is All About, Published by Noorart, Lesson 47, Page 219, section D, reads:
"The famous wall does exist and its ruins are located in northen central Asia. There are many different walls there, strung throughout the Caucasus Mountains, and any one of them could be the iron wall in question. One such wall, whose ruins lie in a valley about 150 miles southeast of the city of Bukhara, has long since lost much of its iron due to rust.
The seventh century Chinese traveler, Hiouen Tsiang, reports seeing this huge iron wall with a huge gate near a place called Derbend. In Arabic this walled valley was named Bab al Hadid, or, the Iron Door.
The Muslim Khalifa who ruled from 842-846, Wathiq, sent a team to Central Asia to report on this wall mentioned in the Qur'an. The explorers found it in a valley that was about 150 yards wide. It was supported by two huge jambs and was made of iron bricks welded together with lead. Two huge gates of iron were placed in the middle of the wall. This was reported to us by the famous Muslim geographer, Muqaddasi, who also wrote about it in the year 985.
One proophecy that Dhul Quarnain made is that the wall will only last for so long and then it will be goneQuran 18:96. When the barrier is no longer there, the invaders from the other side will surge over the land and cause great destruction.
The wall is pretty much useless today, so who will soon come through that region and invade? Some scholars are of the opinion that the Russians and the Chinese are the Yajuj and Majuj (Gog and Magog). This cannot be proven, but it does make an interesting discussion."
Shouldn't the Chinese and Russians being the Gog and Magog theory be said? And the Place of the wall theory? --Obaidz96 (talk • contribs • count) 18:22, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
