Talk:Columbine conspiracy theories

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In my opinion, the Columbine High School massacre article is getting too damn long. I would suggest moving all of the oddball rumors and speculation into this article; I was going to do it myself, but I wanted a consensus, first. 152.163.100.200 16:05, 30 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] POV

The line 'Harris and Klebold couldn't possibly have brought so many explosives into the building by themselves, fueled many imaginations.' seems to be POV, I think including the word 'imagination' implies that the thought of them having help is imaginary and should be removed or re-worded better. Does any one else agree? Tydamann (talk) 13:46, 19 December 2007 (UTC)


[edit] proper place for conspiracies to run free

trying to get a conspiracy based wiki up and running. http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikiconspiracy. check it out, add input. most of all help me get it running (I'm kinda amature over here)--Matt D 03:21, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Renaming this article

A proposal has ben put forward to require renaming of all articles that have the phrase "conspiracy theory" in their title, due to what proponents claim is the inherent POV of that phrase. Please see Wikipedia:Conspiracy theory. A vote is occurring at Wikipedia talk:Conspiracy theory. -Willmcw 05:47, May 6, 2005 (UTC)

I do not think this article is being neutral. I think that the second of the police cover up is slanted towards the CT.

"The fact that many religious persons still regard her as a martyr regardless of the historical reality is cited as further evidence of their disdain for the truth." Is the preceding sentence fact or editorial comment? The author appears to refer to a pre-Columbine distain for truth on the part of many religious persons. To which particular distain for truth is the author referring? To what other evidence supporting a distain for the truth is the author alluding, and what citations of distain for the truth is the author referencing?

[edit] Section Rename

I've renamed the first section from "brainwashing" to "influences" because brainwashing sounded quite extreme for most of the material in this section. Some of the material in here was also incorrectly sectioned, I doubt Al Gore was influencing them or brainwashing them in any way.--Sully 09:36, 18 September 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Conspiracy?

Those saying these guys were influenced by certain music were not promoting a "conspiracy theory," even if some of their claims turned out wrong. Potential harmful influence from media/music has nothing to do with a "conspiracy. 134.69.166.38 04:35, 29 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Conservatives?

Because, of course, Senator Hillary Clinton is at the forefront of Conservative thinkers.

Hah...Jmlk17 20:42, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Other Theories

Other conspiracy theories that I've heard but cannot cite (haven't tried yet): 1) Bombs: Apparently these two young men carried 98 pounds of pipe bombs, including one that was 20 pounds, as well as a large cache of weaponry, into the school by themselves, unnoticed. Doesn't sound plausible. Did they hide all the bombs under their trenchcoats? Also, how were they able to place all of these various explosive devices throughout the school without anyone noticing? 2) The two sons of the man in charge of the case are very suspicious -- one apparently was there during the shooting, but wasn't a student and had no reason to be there. The other reportedly made a film project a year or two earlier, showing men in trenchcoats walking through the halls of Columbine, shooting, placing bombs, and ended with the school being blown up (with special effects). 3) Numerous people have mysteriously been killed in execution-style murders in Columbine since the shootings, most of whom were clearly related to what had happened there (friends of shooters, etc.). Suicides among this group have also made news since the shooting. I lack evidence to support any of this, and I'm hoping someone else might know more about them. Paxsboy 18:19, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Addressing your concerns:

1). They carried numerous bombs, but they carried them in in duffel bags and backpacks, well-hidden from any potential prying eyes. 2). I have never heard anything of the sort of the matter of the two sons of the "man in charge of the case". Upon searching through local news (I'm a resident of the Columbine School area), and national/Google, I have yet to find anything about a film project you described. That doesn;t necessarily mean it wasn't really made; perhaps it was a different school or project. 3). Numerous people have NOT been executed. Two Columbine survivors were executed at a local Subway restaurant, but those are the only two I know of. Suicides have taken place, and it is true that the ratio is quite higher, but that is to be expected among traumatized populaces. Just my thoughts and research. Jmlk17 20:41, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

Man in charge:

I have heard of this claim before. He was the lead investigator for the F.B.I. and that he had only one son. I found a link online mentioning it. (from judicial-inc.biz)

I found an article which talks in more detail about the man's son. (from broomfieldnews.com) In this one, Gomez (FBI spokesman) when Asked whether the FBI would be concerned if the agent's son had been involved in making the video, Gomez replied 'No, there would be no concern by the FBI.'

another somewhat un related article from (judicial-inc.biz) mentions they were targeting specific people, or groups of people. I recall one victim (who survived) said one of the men approached her, asked her if she believed in God, and when she said yes, he shot her. (does anyone else recall this story) Tydamann (talk) 13:58, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

Regarding (2): If you didn't find it, you weren't trying. Here's an article from the Associated Press. http://web.dailycamera.com/shooting/08acos2.html

There were many such articles during this time period. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.109.2.201 (talk) 04:12, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Matrix Source

I think its mostly common knowledge that The Matrix was blamed in part for Columbine. Here is one such source. To the person who reverted my edit. Sure, get me to cite my sources, but it would have taken you like 10 seconds to see that there is a significant amount of material on the Internet where Matrix is blamed for Columbine. I'm amazed that this wasn't mentioned already because it was such a big connection. -- Suso 12:03, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

I could easily see where this could come into play, but as it has been said extensively, the killers had been planning the assault on the school for months. The Matrix came out on March 31st, 1999, 3 weeks before the shooting. I highly doubt that the movie had that much, if anything to do with the whole ordeal, but hey, that's just me. 03:04, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
Interesting. Presuming that supporting sources for these assertions could be cited, IMHO this would be a useful addition to the article. -- Boracay Bill 14:22, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The phrase "conspiracy theory" is not a neutral way of describing something

I have proposed that articles titled with "conspiracy theory" be renamed at Wikipedia:Conspiracy theory titles, please direct all comments to the proposal's discussion page, thanks. zen master T 22:27, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Conspiracy theory titles proposes 15 articles for renaming. I commented on the discussion page opposing renaming 14 of those articles. This is the 15th, and I think that it is misnamed for its content. The article tosses the word "conspiracy" around, but it does not seem to discuss any conspiracy theories. The Conspiracy theory page says
“ A conspiracy theory attempts to attribute the ultimate cause of an event or chain of events (usually political, social, or historical events), or the concealment of such causes from public knowledge, to a secret, and often deceptive plot by a covert alliance of powerful or influential people or organizations. Many conspiracy theories say that major events in history have been dominated by conspirators who manipulate political happenings from behind the scenes. ”
I don't see anything fitting that description discussed in this page. -- Boracay Bill 04:01, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

I agree this article should be renamed for content, what new titles do you have in mind? zen master T 04:16, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Well, it is a theory as it may be possible but is not definitely proven true. It is theoretically possible that a conspiracy to supress the truth has taken place. At any rate, the theory itself exists, and is worthy of an article. -24.149.203.34 (talk) 08:39, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

There *are* conspiracy theories related to Columbine, mostly related to involvement/complicity by al-Qaeda operatives and/or the U.S. government. in order for this article to be valid, someone really needs to add these. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.71.111.141 (talk) 05:49, 13 May 2008 (UTC)