Talk:Chua Ek Kay

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A fact from Chua Ek Kay appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know? column on February 18, 2008.
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[edit] Improvements to article

Hi, Marcuslim. I was thinking of creating an article about Chua Ek Kay, having read about his recent death. Glad to see that you beat me to it. Has anyone checked to see if there's an obituary in the English or Chinese newspapers? This may provide his date of birth and the names of his spouse and children. I'm not in Singapore so I don't have access to the papers. Also, it's great that the article is referenced by a number of newspaper articles, but these need to be incorporated into the article as in-line citations. — Cheers, JackLee –talk– 01:47, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Hi Jack, good that you reminded me of obituaries. Yes, there was a few last weekend, but I don't recall seeing his birthday printed on them. Right now, there are still news articles flowing in, and i'm in the midst of compiling the necessary information to present first, then to bring out the other finer points like family members and stuff. But i'm glad I found another passionate soul for Singapore artists...it was rather disturbing to see that Ah Meng took the headlines on ST, instead of him (both died about the same day!)..LOL.
Cheers Marcuslim (talk) 09:33, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Yes, Wikipedia's coverage of Singapore artists, and in fact Cultural Medallion winners in general, is currently poor. I created one, "Neila Sathyalingam", after reading an interesting article about her in the Straits Times, but more articles could certainly be produced. One of the difficulties is that information about such people is often not readily available online. I also wish journalists who write obituaries about Singaporeans would provide fuller biographical information. Very often, not even the full date of birth is stated. — Cheers, JackLee –talk– 18:46, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

I guess this is the part where the discussion on Singapore becoming more civic-minded, comes in. I do note that in many ways we do lack certain social graces, and respecting artists and their works is one of them.
Regarding the Chua EK article, i note some improvements you've made...and I'm learning something with regards to programming codes for Wikipedia. It would seem to me that there's endless ways of programming a page, as compared to the standard ways i'm using. Perhaps you can enlighten me also, on the part for referencing...How do you manage to list multiple citations, pointing to one reference source in the list? And what happens if say, there's another different citation, in between to same ones, i.e. citation no.3, in between 1 and 2? Please advise. Thanks. Marcuslim (talk) 02:19, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

You give a name the first time the citation is referred to, like this:

This is the sentence requiring a citation.<ref name="Straits Times"/>[The citation goes here].</ref>
The next time you need to refer to the same citation, you do it as shown at the end of this sentence
– note the oblique ("/") after the reference name.<ref name="Straits Times"/>

Using this referencing method means that occasionally footnote numbers will be out of order. This doesn't really matter. For more information, see "Wikipedia:Footnotes". Actually, I note that you have (or another editor has) already started using this referencing method. — Cheers, JackLee –talk– 14:01, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

I've done a general cleanup of the article. Here are a few more things that need to be fixed, as well as some comments:

  • The quotation ""bridge between Asian and Western art" in the introductory paragraph needs a citation.
  • Are you the copyright owner of the photograph of Chua in the infobox? If not, you can't license it to Wikipedia under a Creative Commons licence. Only the copyright owner can do so. You must either contact the Straits Times and request that they license the image to Wikipedia (unlikely to happen, I believe), or provide a justification for fair use of the image that satisfies the non-free content criteria. Let me know if you need help with this.
  • Individual years ("1947") need not be Wikilinked. However, full dates ("[[8 February]] [[2008]]") should be linked. This is to ensure that full dates display according to the date preferences selected by users (people from the US usually want dates to be displayed like this: "February 8, 2008").
  • Can you confirm if the name of the gallery is "Art Forum" or "Art-Forum"? I see both being used in the article.
  • Can more be added to the article about Chua's artistic style?
  • In addition to mentioning awards that Chua received in the infobox, this should be mentioned in the main text as well.
  • In the "Further reading" section, you've set out some books with Chinese titles. Were the books actually in Chinese? If so, the Chinese title should be given first and the English title as a translation, like this: "Chua, Ek Kay (2007). 蔡逸溪: 荷塘净界, 水乡洄荡 [Chua Ek Kay: Lotus Pond and Water Village] (in Mandarin). Singapore: Cape of Good Hope. ".
  • In the "Notes" section, use {{reflist|2}} rather than {{reflist|4}}.
  • Separate quotation sections are generally deprecated. Also, {{cquote}} is only to be used for pull quotes. For ordinary quotations, use {{quote}}. I've incorporated the quotations into the main article text.
  • "Wikipedia:Persondata" should be added to biographical articles.
  • I've removed the category "Category:Singaporean people", because the article has already been categorized under "Category:Singaporean painters". An article should generally be placed in the most specific category that it fits into, and should not be included in both a category and a sub-category of that category.

— Cheers, JackLee –talk– 16:01, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Copyrighted image

Are you the copyright owner of the photograph of Chua in the infobox? If not, you can't license it to Wikipedia under a Creative Commons licence. Only the copyright owner can do so. You must either contact the Straits Times and request that they license the image to Wikipedia (unlikely to happen, I believe), or provide a justification for fair use of the image that satisfies the non-free content criteria. Let me know if you need help with this.

Hi Jack, thanks for the Wiki code lessons. With regards to the copyright issue, it has been highlighted to me before by other users - latest by aldwinteo - and through some search I found out on another discussion thread that Singapore offered no privacy laws, and thus there's no copyright infringement issues for use of material from Straits Times Singapore. That being said I've continued to give due naming for the source that this image was taken from. And to add, this image of Chua was modified from an original 3/4 pose version; hence the Atrribution Sharelike 3.0 licensing.
That being said, I'm ready to learn something about Wiki's copyright issues, and to be proven wrong if we do find out something new about copyrights from the Straits Times Singapore...that will be something new that we can all learn from. For now you may like to read this thread that i've taken my reference from http://tomorrow.sg/archives/2006/07/30/straits_times_infringes_on_copyr.html. Thanks for sharing your concerns Marcuslim (talk) 01:07, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

I'm afraid what you've mentioned is inaccurate. While not an expert on the subject, I'm a Singaporean lawyer and studied intellectual property law as part of my law degree. There is no right of privacy in Singapore law as such, which means that Chua's family could not bring a claim for invasion of their privacy. However, the photograph is most certainly subject to copyright law, and if no permission has been obtained from the owner of the copyright in the photograph (which could be Chua's relative or The Straits Times) then its use is a breach of copyright and also violates Wikipedia policy. You aren't entitled to modify a copyrighted image (for instance, by cropping it) and then claim it as your own as the modified image is a derivative work of the original image. The discussion on Tomorrow.sg highlights the distinction between privacy law and copyright law. Therefore, the only way the image can be used is if a fair-use justification is provided for it. However, such justifications are subject to review by administrators, and the image may be deleted if it is felt that the justification is inadequate. — Cheers, JackLee –talk– 16:54, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
OK, I've added a fair-use justification to Image:ChEk.jpg. Have a look. — Cheers, JackLee –talk– 17:08, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] DYK nomination

Hi, Marcuslim. As I mentioned, I nominated this article to be featured in the "Wikipedia:Did you know" section on the main page. An editor has commented that the statement that "some of Singaporean artist Chua Ek Kay's abstract Chinese ink paintings were inspired by Australian aboriginal cave paintings" is unreferenced: see "Template talk:Did you know#Articles created/expanded on February 14". Are you able to insert a reference for that information? — Cheers, JackLee –talk– 16:40, 18 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Copyrighted images

Hi, Marcus. This is a reminder that you can't upload copyrighted images on to Wikipedia, as you have done with "Image:ChEk2.jpg" and "Image:BicyclesRestAtTheBacklane.jpg", under Creative Commons licences if you are not the copyright owner. Merely making amendments to the images, for instance by cropping them or reducing them in size or resolution, does not give you rights over them. Please amend the image description pages to add fair-use justifications, as was done with Image:ChEk.jpg. Thanks. — Cheers, JackLee –talk– 17:27, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Persondata

I understand this is a metadata, but my question is how useful is persondata and how does it work? Can anyone shed light on this? Marcuslim (talk) 03:10, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

I was previously advised by a Good Article reviewer to add Persondata to biographical articles. I think the best place to try and find an answer to your questions is over at "Wikipedia talk:Persondata". — Cheers, JackLee –talk– 03:47, 28 March 2008 (UTC)