Talk:Chinilpa

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[edit] Ilpa (일파)? Who says so? I've NEVER heard that phrase.

This heading needs some reworking. I'll just post it here, so if anybody can find a source or give an argument that the word "Ilpa" is common, please insert it back (with appropriate reference if possible). Yongjik 04:49, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

Chinilpa (친일파, 親日派, literally 'people friendly to Japan') or Ilpa (일파, 日派) is a Korean slur for pro-Japanese Koreans, including but not limited to the pro-Japanese activists and collaborators as well as those who worked for the better relationship with Japan during the periods of Korean Empire and Korea under Japanese rule, who are recognized as national traitors in Korea. In contrast with Japanophile, chinilpa has no positive meaning.

On a second thought, I think somebody might have confused the slang il-ppa (일빠) with Chinilpa. (Note the two p's --- it is a different character in Korean!) In some internet subculture, the slang ppa ("fan"; usually disparaging) became quite productive and may attach to virtually anything. I've seen "hwang-ppa" (fans of Hwang Woo-Suk), "hwan-ppa" (fans of Hwandan Gogi), "peulto-ppa" (fans of StarCraft Protoss players), and even "guk-ppa" (fans of anything Korean).

If this is the case, then it clearly does NOT belong to this article about Korean collaborators to Japanese colonial government. Yongjik 02:11, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

Yongjik, thank you very much. I did not know they wright two way for one hanja (日派). I retrieved 일빠 and found that 친일파 and 일빠 are basically the same and bad meaning. 일빠 seems a net slang and a lighter warning to a person blindly supports Japanese stuffs and not used for historical pro-Japanese collaborators before WWII while 친일파 is more official. The usage itself is commonly found. Following are some examples found in Korean forums while they may not be completely representative.
  • yamatosniper 여기서는 꽤 오래 쓰여진 용어입니다. "일본 빠순(빠돌)이"의 축약어 w 『친일파나 친일 행위를 하는 사람』을 가리키는 말이지요.
  • tjtmdeo valkyrie17cm야 정신병적 행동으로 일본을 찬양하는 사람들을 일빠(친일파)라고 욕하는것은 맞지만 너의 의견에 동의하지 않는다고 일빠(친일파)라고 욕하는것도 어느정도 니가 정신병이 있다는거 아니겠니?
Jjok 15:46, 7 October 2007 (UTC)
Don't pay too much attention to people who would accuse others of being "일빠"... Especially those who think "일빠" and "친일파" are the same.... :) The term "Chinilpa" has a historic meaning, and whatever a contemporary person does online doesn't make himself a Chinilpa... I mean, how can you support a colonial government that was dissolved 62 years ago? Those idiots are just playing at insulting others, just like some Americans will say "u are a TERRORIST LOL go to hell" online.
By the way, the character 빠 (ppa) is NOT the hanja 派; it comes from another slang ppasuni (빠순이). As far as I know, it originally meant "a brainless teenager girl who is a fan of (some singer you don't like)." Yongjik 02:16, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for the information about ppasuni (빠순이). I am not sure why some online translator returns 日派 for 일빠. However, ilppa is also bad meaning in Korea, and Korean kids need to be very careful about avoiding people's recognition of themselves as Japanophile when they enjoy (or not?) Japanese anime and manga.

Jjok 18:12, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Move to "Korean collaborators to Japanese colonial government"

I propose that this article be moved as such. After all, the term "Chinilpa" is NOT a proper noun, so is not appropriate for an English wikipedia. Because of this title, the article starts with some irrelevant discussions on what the hell the word means, how it is used, and how it might/might not be confused with some other terms... all of which are not really that interesting to most English speakers.

Are we trying to explain the Korean word here, or the concept? I think it should be the latter: Wikipedia is not a dictionary, after all.

Once we move the article, all such stuff can be simply cut out or kicked away to footnotes. The article would look a lot better. Yongjik 02:11, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

Not only "not really that interesting to most English speakers" but also unfamiliar or unknown to most students of Japanese history. We should pick something in English that's easily understandable and recognizable. What that should be, however... I'm really not sure. LordAmeth 13:58, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
I'd agree that it's the concept that is importance. Since the main article is Korea under Japanese rule, perhaps Korean collaborators under Japanese rule would be more elegant (that "to" is just wrong). On the other hand "collaborator" is a bit of a loaded word, probably quite a good match for "Chinilpa" in fact, so perhaps a more general article such as Korean people under Japanese rule would allow the wider story to be told in a more NPOV way, I'm sure that noone was 100% "collaborator" or "anti" in any case.FlagSteward 18:02, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
A small conundrum, wot. It is more challenging to come up with a short and meaningful equivalent in English because we are asked to consider an alternative to a Korean noun that describes a sub-group of individuals, no? Thus, "Korean collaborators to Japanese colonial government" is a little awkward. In particular, the preposition "to" seems strange. What about this:
Pro-Japanese collaborators in Korea
This might be better considering that many Chinilpa are still alive and living in Korea and other parts of the world. 74.12.83.52 18:42, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
Pro-Japanese collaborators in Korea sounds just fine. Korean people under Japanese rule sounds like a good article to create, though based on the title alone, I should expect it to be more about the general lifestyle/society issues concerning the Korean people in general, under Japanese rule, a subject within which collaborators would get buried in some sub-section. LordAmeth 22:24, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
Yes, that sounds great! Korean people under Japanese rule would certainly be an interesting article to create, but that is a totally different story. After all, the majority (>95%?) of Korean people under Japanese rule were neither "Chinilpa" nor "independence fighters (독립투사)," but simply a bunch of farmers, fishers, teachers, and artisans trying to live through difficult days.
(Off-topic) It is somewhat unfortunate that some Korean school textbooks and folk tales give the impression that Koreans of 1910--1945 consisted solely of devilish Chinilpa, oppressed common folks supporting independence fighters, and nothing between... Fortunately this view is changing in these days. (Or perhaps it's just that I grew up and learned the whole story.) If anybody can read Korean, I highly recommend "Allow Dance Halls in Seoul: Birth of Modernity" (서울에 딴스홀을 허하라: 현대성의 형성) by Kim Jinsong (김진송): A link in Korean bookstore, ISBN 9788987057989 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Yongjik (talk • contribs) 02:58, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

I agree the term is rare and should not be overused like I do, however, "Chinilpa = Pro-Japanese collaborators in Korea" is too narrow usage. It is similar to say "Wokou is Japanese pirates". The appearance of chinilpa in English has been rare since most of chinilpa arguments except the official Pro-Japanese collaborators are really domestic issues in (South) Korea. The actual meaning is much wider, deeper, and current. Let's see the definition in Chosun Ilbo:

In the article describing about an issue of the author of "맞아죽을 각오로 쓴 100년만의 친일선언", the columnist defines chinilpa as "친일파는 우리나라와 일본이 싸울 때 일본 편을 드는 사람이다." "親日派は韓国と日本が戦うとき、日本の肩を持つ人だ。" I could not find the English version but it means Chinilpa is a person who sides with Japan when Korea and Japan are fighting and it is very common view in South Korea. So, chinilpa is not limitedly used for historic pro-Japanese collaborators and relatively well-known people who are nowadays denoted as Neo-chinilpa, such as Cho YoungNam, O Seonhwa, Han Seung-Jo, Gim Wanseop, Ji Man Won, Lee Yeonghun, and Ahn Byong-Jik. If a Korean man cheering a Japanese soccer team fighting against a Korean team in a South Korean stadium, he will be recognized as chinilpa. It sounds incredible but it actually is.

The practical meaning of chinilpa is actually the same as Japanophile. The difference is it is a bad thing in Korea. I chose chinilpa as article title instead of "Japanophile in Korea" to describe the specific concept and aspects in Korea. If it is necessary to move the article, it should be Japanophile in Korea, but not Pro-Japanese collaborators in Korea. The latter is one specific part of chinilpa and does not properly describe the whole concept of the term. Jjok 16:48, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

I think you are trying to fit too much things into a single basket. A word like "Chinilpa" (with its loaded tone) can be (ab)used to denounce many different people, and that is precisely why this article should be renamed. We cannot agree on what "Chinilpa" means, but at least we can agree on what "Pro-Japanese collaborator in Korea" means.
Let's take a look at your list.
  1. Cho Youngnam (조영남) is a singer and, IMHO, just being sensational by playing word games. (I think he had some honest intention, but doubtlessly such a controversy helped his book sale.)
  2. Kim Wanseop (김완섭) is a notorious bastard, well known in some internet circle. He once claimed that "All graduates of Ewha Womans University are whores." (I think he also claimed that "all married women are whores." Such a distasteful garbage, I can't remember the details.) He even wrote a book named... more or less... "whore-ology" (창녀론). I'm surprised that you admit knowing his name... where did you get that?
  3. O Seonhwa (오선화) is making her living by writing sensational third-class books in Japan that hates Korea, which generates rage in Korea, which in turn helps her celebrity in Japan... I haven't read anything by her, but from what I heard, her reputation is on the same level with that of Kim Wanseop.
    Added: She even has a wiki article! (ko:고젠카) She claimed that she graduated Daegu University (대구대학교), which turned out to be false. It seems her first books weren't even written by helself at all. She has also changed her nationality to Japanese, but is apparently hiding the fact because "A Korean who says Korea sucks" sells much better. [1]
  4. Ji Manwon (지만원) is a political extreme-right nut who claims that the current Roh Moo-hyun regime is communist and is controlled by North Korea. He also served in prison for defamation(?) for saying the Gwangju Massacre (5.18) was a riot masterminded by North Korea and communist dissidents. [2]
  5. Han Seungjo (한승조) was a professor in Korea University, who wrote a column in Japanese right-wing magazine that says "Japan's colonization of Korea was a blessing." Interestingly, he also claimed that the current Roh government's attempt to prosecute (well, more like "catalog" in reality) Chinilpa is a "conspiracy for the extended rule of South Korea by leftists." [3] He seems to be well regarded by Ji. Birds of a feather...
  6. Lee Yeonghun (이영훈), a professor of economics in Seoul National University, might be the only guy worth listening to in the list. He is also politicaly conservative. He is famous for his contention that Korea achieved substantial economic development during the Japanese colonization period, for which, yes, he was attacked as a Chinilpa. But I also heard his reputation is largely built by people who wouldn't even bother to read what he actually says. For example, here he is quoted as saying:
    1. So I viewed that Japan's colonial regime of Korea was filled with logical contradiction, doomed to disintegrate. 그래서 저는 일제의 조선 지배 체제는 조만간 해체될 수밖에 없는 모순에 가득 찬 것이었다고 보았지요.
    2. Whether there was exploitation or not, imperialism deserves criticism by itself. Why? Because it is a regime that is against human nature. 수탈 여부와 무관하게 제국주의는 그 자체로 비판의 대상입니다. 왜 그럴까요? 다름아니라 인간 본성에 반하는 체제가 제국주의이기 때문입니다.
    3. Now then, what happens if such economic development continues? Land, natural resources, and industrial facilitis of Joseon would become more and more possessed by Japanese. Now this is a colonial exploitation in essence. 그런데 그런 식의 경제 성장이 계속 되면 결국 어떻게 됩니까? 조선의 토지와 자원과 공업시설은 점점 일본인의 소유가 되지요. 바로 이것이 진정한 의미의 식민지적 수탈이지요.
  7. I don't know much about Ahn Byong-Jik (안병직), a professor Emeritus(?) in Seoul National University, except that his name rhymes with mine. It seems he was once a prominent leftist thinker, and then he became one of the "new rights." My 30-second googling didn't find anything that might make him earn the title of Chinilpa.
Now let's see, what do they have in common? Would Professor Lee Yeonghun consider his opinion as even remotely related to those of Kim Wanseop or O Seonwha? It is like creating a single article that covers Bush, Blair, bin Laden, Hitler, Ariel Sharon, and Kim Jong-il, named "people who are called terrorists."
Besides, I disagree with you on whether "the practical meaning of Chinilpa is actually the same as Japanophile." In South Korea there are hundreds of thousands of anime, manga, and J-pop fans. Go to any bookstore in Korea, you will find a whole shelf of Japanese manga, and another of Japanese novels. Japanese anime are broadcast on TV every day. Only the most hopeless trolls would call them Chinilpa.
If you insist, these guys might get lumped together in a section called "Contemporary usage of the term Chinilpa in South Korea". But I doubt its utility, and it might even be considered libelous for some guys... Who would want to be classified in the same group as Kim Wanseop, "the guy who called your mom a whore"? Yongjik 02:23, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
By the way, take an article by Chosun Ilbo with caution. It is the most ultra-conservative newspaper in South Korea, unfortunately also Korea's most popular newspaper. It has a vested interest in attacking the current Roh government, and also in derailing the government's attempt at cataloging and prosecuting Chinilpa --- its former CEO, Bang Eung-mo (방응모) was a Chinilpa himself. For example, he voluntarily donated machine guns to the Japanese colonial government. [4] Chosun Ilbo has a lot to gain by confusing the public and mixing the issue of prosecuting Chinilpa with general anti-Japanese sentiments. Yongjik 04:44, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for making my points, Yongjik. Yes, Chosun Ilbo represents conservative view but that means they are less critical on chinilpa compared to the left, while there is no difference in which medias (left or right) think what Korean people recognize as Japanophile. For example,

Again, if people think the person is taking side with Japan, they recognize the person as chinilpa, especially in the cases of controversy issues between Korea and Japan. I also think Cho Youngnam does not deserve chinilpa while he called himself so.

He just pointed out that Japan was one up on Korea and Koreans should behave cool on the Dokdo issue, however, he had to apology and quit his program. Following article even warns that persons in show business should avoid any Japanophilic behavior which pulls the trigger of rage of people.

If you want to release a movie in Korea, never positively describe the Japanese rule.

About Japanese anime, manga, and J-pop stuffs, people can enjoy them but they also need to be careful not to be recognized as Japanophile and need to excuse that "we like these stuffs but we do not like Japan".

Of course, when someone would open a web site in Korea that advocates "Dokdo is Japanese territory and Korea should return it to Japan", such Japanophilic site shall be shut down.


Kim Wanseop may be notorious bastard, O Seonhwa (오선화) might be writing sensational third-class books in Japan, and Ji Manwon may be political extreme-right nut. However, that is not the reason why they were designated as neo-chinilpa. People think they side with Japan. That is the reason.

Other peoples have points in common to some extent. They do not agree at claims such as 200,000 forced Korean sex slaves, 40% confiscation of land, Japan did not make any contribution to the modernization of Korea, etc, which oppose common Korean view. Their views can be represented by following:

Others are

In the above three articles, the fighting and kicked guys are professors Lee Yeonghun and Ahn Byong-Jik, respectively.

Actually, what professor Lee Yeonghun says is not so different from what Japanese rights say, including former Japanese PM Abe, since both rely on (the same) reliable sources without nationalistic speculation. Jjok 22:47, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Contradicting Statements in the first Paragraph

  • they were never properly put to trial; contadicts
  • It handled a total of 682 cases, 559 cases were handed over to a special prosecutor's office, which handed down indictments in 221 cases.
  • Even though the Chinese characters of Chinilpa (親日派) literally denote "people friendly to Japan," this word is never used as such. ;contradicts
  • Sometimes Chinilpa is used as a derogatory slang for pro-Japanese Koreans.

I erase these sentences to prevent confusions.61.24.95.4 15:33, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

Well, perhaps I wasn't making myself clear. They were never properly put to trial. President Rhee sabotaged and then dissolved the Special Committee (the committee members were even arrested by the police, which was being governed by a Chinilpa), none were executed, and their properties mostly (if not entirely) stayed with them and were not confiscated.
To summarize (and I'll admit this is my POV): those Chinilpa and their descendants continue to be a dominant power in Korean political landscape, although they did lose recent two presidential elections.
As for the second pair, again I will try to clarify the issue: consider "terrorist." It is frequently used as a slur for Muslims... any muslims.  :( Therefore, it is an (unfortunate) fact that the word "terrorist" is used as a slur. However, the word "terrorist" does NOT mean "Muslim" and no respectable scholar or reporter would (or should) confuse these two terms. The situation is similar with "Chinilpa." Retracted---see below.
Could you please tell me if you are satisfied with my arguments, or still find it uncompelling? I hope we could reach an agreement. Okay, I'll try to find some more references to back up these claims... wait for somemany days... (drum roll plz...) Yongjik 02:47, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
Come to think of it, I realized that the word "Chinilpa" has a more complicated history than I initially thought. (Shrug... as my page says, I'm not a historian.) Anyway, I hope the following is a correct summary: In contemporary South Korea, when the word "Chinilpa" is used in an official context (e.g., not in an internet flame war) it almost always means Pro-Japanese Collaborators who helped the Japanese colonial government. Yongjik 02:04, 8 October 2007 (UTC)