Talk:Chicken Sickles

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[edit] Scant info

I realize this article's info is much smaller than the collection of photos I have. I actually have 2 or 3 more photos, but I don't have the copyright to them. I'm in the process of searching for more info and pictures to add. I've contacted a man who might be able to find more info about it in a large 5 volume book of Shaolin weaponry. He won't be able to look through it until next month when he gets back from Thailand.

When I get more material, I plan on separating the pictures and placing them under each weapon's info. This way, it will be less confusing. (!Mi luchador nombre es amoladora de la carne y traigo el dolor! 21:23, 24 October 2006 (UTC))

Good news! I have found a Xingyi master and his student who are willing to take a sequence of photos, with the "full-sized" Chicken-Saber Sicles", showing various attack and defense with the weapon. (!Mi luchador nombre es amoladora de la carne y traigo el dolor! 17:29, 25 October 2006 (UTC))

Thanks a bunch to Dr. Stephen Yan and his student Mr. Dyer for supplying me with these photos!!!

[edit] More Photos

I only have one photo of Shaolin Master Shi De Cheng playing the Chicken-Saber. However, there are probably 20 more pictures of him doing forms and actually showing applications of it--i.e. guards against staff, attacks to the throat, ribs, and leg--at russbo.com. "Doc" gave me permission to use just the one. I'm sure he wouldn't mind for me to use the rest of them, as he told me he had more in a letter, but I want to get full permission before I add them to the page! (!Mi luchador nombre es amoladora de la carne y traigo el dolor! 05:06, 27 October 2006 (UTC))

[edit] Lineage

Whilst a lineage of a style is sometimes given in wikipedia articles ( see Tai chi ), the individuals within that tree tend in the most part to be notable enough individuals themselves to have a biographical article about them. Whilst it is only polite to mention Dr. Yan in the article given his kind permission to use his photographs, including his lineage (with unverifiable portions) just looks like an advert for him. (As a side note, who are the Three Heroes from Zhoukou, and should there be an article about them? Is Lu Songgao notable enough for his own article, or should he be covered by the 3 heroes?) I suggest removing the lineage section entirely, it wouldn't hurt the article overall. -- Medains 10:13, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

I got the "Three Heroes" info from Jarek's page on Muslim Xinyi. It says, "Yuan Fengyi's four most famous students were: Shang Xueli, Yang Dianqing, Lu Song'gao (these three were called "Three Heroes from Zhoukou") and Song Guobin." (Link) Lu Songgao is supposedly the first person to teach Xinyi Liuhe boxing outside of the Muslim community. As far as the lineage thing, I know it seems like an advert for him. I'm afraid part of the stipulation for using the pictures was listing his lineage. His lineage is given on his martial arts page, which I have previously posted a link to. There are other lineages of this weapon, as you can see from the Shaolin monk playing a single sickle at the bottom of the page.

Once "Doc" at russbo.com gets back from Thailand, he said he will look up more detailed info about this weapon in a huge 5 volume weapons book from Shaolin. Hopefully he can give me some cited lineage info as well.(!Mi luchador nombre es amoladora de la carne y traigo el dolor! 11:14, 7 November 2006 (UTC))

Did he stipulate that you had to list the lineage on the page? If so then that's a real shame, since the information really isn't appropriate as part of the article at the moment, and the pictures are really good. If not, why not just list the lineage in the picture description page so anyone looking at the larger version of the image gets the lineage? You should add his full requirements to the image pages - since they currently only mention that it must be attributed to him and linked to his page. -- Medains 10:11, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

One more note about the images, you've tagged them with {{Attribution}}, whereas it might be the case that {{copyrighted}} is more representative of the actual situation (permission given only for use in wikipedia, though WP is deleting images with this tag), or perhaps {{Fair_use_in|Chicken Sickles}} (only wikipedia article named) -- Medains 10:27, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

No, {{Attribution}} is the correct tag. He said I could use them just as long as I attributed it to him and his site. The lineage thing was more implied (many times) by his student than actually stated I had to imput it into the article. I know that if it was the other way around (him giving me permission ONLY for wikipedia), then the pictures would be deleted, since people would no doubt copy them and use them on other sites, which might cause a copyright problem. I guess I could list the lineage on the pictures themselves. This would count, since the pictures are linked to the article. (!Mi luchador nombre es amoladora de la carne y traigo el dolor! 18:31, 9 November 2006 (UTC))