Talk:Charlotte, North Carolina/Archive 1

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User:Semolina Pilchard

Notes on today's Charlotte edits:

-- Reverted to "... provides the region's economic and cultural heartbeat." In terms of style, the word "lifeblood" is a cliche in this context; additionally, "lifeblood" makes an inexact metaphor here.

-- Removed these redundancies:
"... currently under construction ..."
"... tallest building between Philadelphia and Atlanta on the East Coast."
"... would later become ..."

-- Recast for clarity: "This crossroads, which sat atop a long rise in the Piedmont landscape, would become the heart of modern downtown Charlotte. The streets are Trade and Tryon, the latter named for William Tryon, a royal governor of colonial North Carolina."

-- Restored original casting of lead sentence, for style purposes. ("The Queen City ...") Accurate factual presentation in an encyclopedia can be achieved without dry and repetitive prose. - Semolina Pilchard 15:51, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC)


World's 2nd biggest financial centre?

The first sentence claims that Charlotte is the world's 2nd largest financial center. Tokyo, London, Frankfurt, Singapore, Shanghai, Hong Kong, Paris and a host of others would probably disagree.

I've never heard a claim of the world's 2nd largest, but it's a known fact that in the US we are the second largest banking center

As far as financial assets, yes Charlotte is number two in the United States to NYC. There are a lot of banks headquartered here, including Bank of America and Wachovia. Charlottes banks now hold over nearly two trillion dollars in assets due to recent acquisitions by BofA and Wachovia. Here is an article from a non-Charlotte source so it is not biased:

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/06176/701039-28.stm

I think based on this information as well as other info, we can say that Charlotte is the UNITED STATE's 2nd larging BANKING center.

Nicknames

I'm not the one who deleted the nicknames but I don't think what was put back in

By most measures, Charlotte is likely not the 2nd largest financial center in North America, New York and Toronto both definitely being larger. Neither is Charlotte likely 2nd even in the US, Los Angeles outstrips it by most measures, and is generally held to now surpass Toronto as 2nd in North America.

Italic textActually, yes Charlotte's banks possess way more assets than LA. Charlotte is without a doubt 2nd to NYC in terms of a financial center (how much money all of the city's finacial institutions hold).

These kinds of rank comparisons are difficult to define much less measure and therefore easily come into dispute. They should not be made unless held obviously true, which is not the case with Charlotte. It is fair to say that Charlotte is one of the major financial centres of the United States, but possibly not more than that. MinorRoadsKill 6 Jan 2005

Actually, it says Charlotte is the world's second biggest BANKING center. Is there a distinction to be made between "banking" and (your) "financial"? (I cannot attest to the validity of the assertion either way.) -- anon

Evidence for Charlotte's status as #2 financial center in USA, maybe NA (Certainly not world). Facts of top 2 banks headquatered in Charlotte

Two major bank headquarters (Bank Of America and Wachovia) Combined assets of: $1,137 Billion (BAC: $736 Bil -- 2003 Annual report) (WB: 401 Bil -- 2003 Annual Report)

Approx Employees Total of both Banks: BAC: 144k, WB: 95k. Charlotte Based Employees (Approx): BAC: 65k WB: 70k (Wachovia is considerably more consolidated in Charlotte than Bank Of America is).

There are a few other banks/financial institutions that I know of with significant employee presenses in Charlotte:

Visa, American Express, GE Capital, BB&T

"Heartbeat"???

"It is the Carolinas' largest city, the region's economic and cultural heartbeat and the county seat of Mecklenburg County."

I find the term "heartbeat" to be more sentimental than informative... Also, I don't think that everyone would agree that the sentence is totally true. Obvously Charlotte is the county seat of Mecklenburg County, and it's pretty clearly the largest financial center in the Carolinas. But is it the Caronlinas' #1 cultural center?? That's more a matter of opinion I think.

When I lived in NC, many people I knew spoke of Charlotte as being relatively devoid of culture for a city of its size. One could argue that Metro-Raleigh was the number #1 cultural city, being the state capital of NC and home to so many universities and such. The case could also be made for Greensboro/Winston Salem - home to Wake Forest, the NC School of the Arts, and a number of other notable schools, and to RJ Reynolds Tabacco (tabacco is certainly a major part of the history of the Carolinas. And of course we can't forget about Charleston SC, the starting point of the Civil War and one of the cities that was left most intact by that war - and to this day a large percentage of Carolinans still see that city as a major site of their heritage. So yeah - I don't think there's any concensus that Carlotte is the #1 cultural center of the Carolinas.

Metro-Charlotte isn't even the definative leader in terms of population - the 2000 census has all of Mecklenburg coming in at just under 700,000 Gaston has 190,000, Cabbarrus has about 130,000, Union about 125,000, and York Co. SC around 165,000. So that all adds up to around 1.3 million. By contrast, in the Raleigh-Durham-Chapel Hill Triangle we have Wake County at around 630,000, Durham Co. with about 225,000, Orange with about 120,000, and Chatham with another 50,000. And that all adds up to around one million. And for the Triad: Guilford has around 420,000, Forsyth about 305,000, Randolph about 130,000, and Davidson around 145,000. Also around one million total. The Carolinas are actually noted for having a spread out population that's not centered around one or two large metro-areas, though I'm sure many of Charlotte's leaders aspire for their city to gain that status - it still hasn't quite happened yet.

--Blackcats 03:45, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I looked through the history, and traced back the origin of the "economic and culutral heartbeat" statement. An annonomous contributer, with the ISP 152.10.151.21, changed "Charlotte is a major city in North Carolina near the border of South Carolina" to "Charlotte is the larges city in North Carolina near the border of South Carolina, and is the economic and cultural center of the Carolinas." [1] Notice the shift from "a" to "the." Another annonomous user, 38.211.17.44, then introduced the emotive word "heartbeat" [2] (think "heartbeat of america, chevrolet!") Anyhow - since neither of these annonomous users offered any reason for their changes or cited any sources, I'm gonna go ahead and change that section to be more npov.
"One of the fastest-growing and most prosperous American metropolises, Charlotte, North Carolina is the country's second biggest banking center. Nicknamed the Queen City, Charlotte is located near the border of North Carolina and South Carolina. It is the Carolinas' largest city, the region's economic and cultural heartbeat and the county seat of Mecklenburg County."
will be changed to:
"One of the fastest-growing and most prosperous American metropolises, Charlotte, North Carolina is the country's second biggest banking center. Nicknamed the Queen City, Charlotte is located near the border of North Carolina and South Carolina. It is the Carolinas' largest city and the county seat of Mecklenburg County."
I think that Charlotte being an economic center is pretty self-evident when the paragraph already said it was "the country's second biggest banking center." And we can maybe add back in that it's a (not the) "cultural center of the Carolinas" when/if the article is expanded to address metro-Charlotte's culture in a little more detail. Hopefully this will work for everyone, if not then we can discuss it some more here... --Blackcats 06:29, 5 Apr 2005 (UTC)

-- In response to the topic creator, from an anonymous user: Charlotte's metro population is much higher than Raleigh-Durham's. According to the most recent census estimates on Emporis.com, Charlotte's metro is 2,124,013. Raleigh-Durham's is 1,405,868. Quite a difference. There are more counties in Charlottes' metro than the ones you listed, including Cleveland, Lincoln and parts of Iredell and Lancaster counties. Admittedly population has risen much in both metros since 2000, but I believe those counties I listed were part of the metro then as well. I don't know who edited Charlotte's main page to show 1,474,000 metro population recently, but it was very incorrect, so I took it upon myself to edit back in the amount listed on Emporis, since it is both a respectable city database website and is closer to the general concensus that Charlotte's metro is just over 2 millon. And Charlotte is indeed the inarguable center of the Metrolina area. Charlotte's in-city population is around 650,000, since the latest estimates after the recent land annexation. The closest to that in the metro is Gastonia, with just under 70,000. Raleigh and Durham are similar in size, and even have a suburb (Cary) that is almost a third of Raleigh's population. there are similar situations in the Triad with Greensboro and Winston-Salem both vying for status as the center of their metro. All three metros are very suburban and spread out in nature, but compared to Charlotte's, the Triangle and the Triad are incredibly decentralized. Before you would say that Charlotte being the undeniable center of its metro "hasn't happened yet", I would politely urge you to go down to Metrolina, check out Charlotte and then check out the outlying suburbs and exurbs. There will be no question as to the fact that Charlotte has the best control over sprawl and decentralization of all of the NC metros, even based solely on the amount of people it has contained within it and how they are dispersed among its "sphere of influence". I won't even bother to defend Charlotte as being a cultural capital of North Carolina... In opinion that's Asheville. But in all other respects it is the closest to a major city NC can hope for right now. And I'm done.

According to the US Census bureau's official definition for the Charlotte-Gastonia-Concord metropolitan area, it does seem like the area is only 1.4 million. Maybe this has changed since the 2000 census. And yes, Charlotte is the inarguable center of the Metrolina area. As for being a cultural capital, that would require Charlotte have some culture. ;) (I live in Concord, I know what I'm talking about! :P) However, I'll double-check the figure for the metro area. --Golbez 16:24, 31 March 2006 (UTC)

Actually, the census has two "official designations" for Charlotte's Metropolitan area. One of them is the Metropolitan Statistical Area, which is roughly a million and a half and there is the Combined Statistical Area, formerly known as the Consolidated Metropolitan Statistical Area or CMSA which is now over two million. I personally prefer the CMSA, as I think it more accurately reflects the extent of Charlotte's influence. But that is just me. --Dinobrya 27 April 2006

Mediterranean climate??!!!

"Residents of Charlotte enjoy a quasi-Mediterranean climate"

I don't think that before the advent of air conditioning too many people would use the word enjoy when talking about the climate of the Southeast in the summertime. But at any rate - the humidity in that area is way to high to be considered Mediterranean, ore even "quasi-Mediterranean." The proper designation would be humid subtropical, on the cusp of humid continental. The Mediterranean climate article informs us that: "They are never on the east coasts of continents."

--Blackcats 04:05, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I went ahead and corrected this section. --Blackcats 05:37, 5 Apr 2005 (UTC)

A Cozy Place -- Or Is It?

I would first like to start off this comment by saying... Blackcats, If you have such an obsession over Charlotte that you would go to the point of asking them to change the article about its "Economic and Cultural Heartbeat" and "Its Climate", than you shouldn't be bashing it! It sounds like you live near Raleigh, Durham, and Chapel Hill because you said "we" when reffering to it, which sounds a lot to me like your jealous because you live in the North-Carolina-city that doesn't get as much credit as Charlotte. Just because Raleigh, Durham, and Chapel Hill are all smaller than Charlotte doesn't mean that you need to bash it. If your that obsessed, move there! You need to recognize that Charlotte is the 2nd Largest Banking Center in America, behind NYC! What more do you want for Economic Heartbeat? Secondly, the averages for race in the Raleigh-Durham-Chapel Hill triangle is 62% White, 27% Black, 6% Hispanic, 4% Asian, 3% Other, and 2% Interracial. Where as in Charlotte, it is 58% White, 33% Black, 7% Hispanic, 3% Asian, 4% Other, and 2% Interracial. There almost exactly the same! The only thing different is, the "triangle" has more white people and only 1% more Asian People! Charlotte has more Black People, Hispanic People, and People whos race is unknown (other). If your complaining that Charlotte isn't as diverse as the "triangle" than your wrong because you just read the facts! To prove my point even more, go to (www.fedstats.gov) . Go to NC, and then all of the cities you want to check out! Average the "triangle" together and see what you get! The same thing I did! So that solves your "Cultural Heartbeat" issue. If you think about it, since Charlotte has more people than the three cities/towns combined (again, use the website for reference) that means that there are even more people of each race (in number form) than the Raleigh-Durham-Chapel Hill area. You need to look in the mirror and see that none of the other cities in NC even come close to Charlotte's population (notice I said cities not metropolises). So your comment that says, "The Carolinas are actually noted for having a spread out population that's not centered around one or two large metro-areas, though I'm sure many of Charlotte's leaders aspire for their city to gain that status - it still hasn't quite happened yet." is wrong. Look in the mirror once more! Charlotte has gained that status! Being the 23rd largest city in America... I think it's obvious it has. Charlotte's 2000 population was 540,828. The next closest city was Raleigh with 276,093. Charlotte is almost exactly double that! Get over it! Charlotte is one of the fastest growing Cities in the USA. Go to (http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0763098.html) for proof. It shows that Charlotte grew 36.6% of its population in 10 years. That is the fourth highest for the 50 Largest Cities in America. That means that if the rate stays the same, Charlotte's population in 2010 will be 738,771. If you multiply through all of the cities, you will find that Charlotte will be the 19th Largest city in America! So, has it gained its status yet? We all know that answer... YES! The leading race in Charlotte is decreasing, while the not much smaller races are increasing rapidly; mainly the Hispanic and Black Population. So in 2010 and Present Day you should look back at your comments and my comment and you will realize that you were wrong for accusing Charlotte of issues that don't apply to it. Now about it's climate... First of all, the air conditioner was invented becuase we live in the 21st century. So there's no need to live in the past and say, "I don't think that before the advent of air conditioning too many people would use the word enjoy when talking about the climate of the Southeast in the summertime." Second of all, I don't know where you're from but unless you live in Los Angeles or some other Southern California City, your not gonna find an area whos climate doesn't have a problem. Let's take a look all around the United States. The Northeast (NYC)-- Wet and Cold. The Southeast (Charlotte)-- Wet and Hot. The Mid-Atlantic (Washington DC)-- Wet and Temperature is usually Warm. The North (Minneapolis)-- Freezing and Usually Dry. South (Dallas)-- Dry and Really Hott. The Florida Region-- Really Hot and Non-stop rain. The Mid-America Region (Nebraska)-- Dry and Average Temperature. The Northwest (Seattle)-- Cold Winter and Cold Summers. The Southwest (Pheonix)-- Dry and Super Hot! The Southwest (Los Angeles)-- Practically Perfect besides the occasional dry spell. That covers all of America. There is a problem with climate no matter where you live (besides southwest) so you sound like one of those people who complain with just about anything they can. In conclusion, (to all the people who read this to know what Charlotte is really about), Charlotte is, diverse, economic, fast-growing, beautiful landscape (mountains and beach), warm weather, and entertaining-- all of the factors that make up a dazzling city.

(In response to the annonymous tirade above) - Someone may have an obsession with Charlotte, but it's certainly not me. I simply stubled upon the article and found its intro to be very biased and sentimental. Great for a chamber of commerce brochoure, but not so good for an encyclopedia. I'm not from the Triangle or anywhere else in NC. I'm from up north, though I did spend some time in the mountains of NC, where I could tollerate the climate ;-) I often use the expression "we have" when doling out statistics, but maybe that's just a Yankee expression - I dunno. I still stand by my assertion that Charlotte is not the definative leader in terms of population. As for growth, Cary and other towns in the Triangle have been noted for their high growth rates. Anyhow - I'm sorry if I offended you by recounting how people said that Charlotte was relatively devoid of culture. I wasn't talking about ethnic diversity, but about how people felt that Charlotte was more of a sterile, corporate city. I also got the feeling that some saw Charlotte as less southern than other parts of NC, due to the large influx of "bankers from New Jersey" and other folks from elsewhere in recent years. And yes, people could complain or brag about just about any climate - there's not agreement on which is best or most "enoyable," which was my point in the first place. The point is that all these sort of things are subjective, and we need to present the facts, not assert sentiments. We need accurate, verifiable information, such as "Charlotte is in the humid subtropical climate zone." That's great that you love Charlotte, but this is an encyclopedia, not an advertisement. I may have missed something in that rant above, if so, you can point it out and I will respond. I'm going to continue to montitor this article and make sure that it maintains its Neutral Point of View. --Blackcats 08:01, 26 May 2005 (UTC)
You wrote: << people felt that Charlotte was more of a sterile, corporate city >> and <<people said that Charlotte was relatively devoid of culture>> THIS IS VERY TRUE -- if you are thinking of moving to Charlotte, think twice because it is boring, nay, EXTREMELY DULL here. I was born here in 1982 and have lived in the Charlotte Metro region my whole life and let me tell you, this place is absolutely devoid of ANY and all culture outside of the University Area and NoDa and maybe a couple other areas; the suburbs are even worse unless you count Wal-Mart and McDonalds as cultural centers. Other than that, it's all strip-mall shopping, bad TV-shows, hours in traffic on lonely highways populated with mean drivers, bad urban planning, and NASCAR. And even the 'cultural areas' of the region are nearly devoid of zest and vitality, though at least they TRY; there is a tiredness here, an utter lack of exuberance and liveliness...morale is low, "same old, same old." BTW: if you think Charlotte is bad, you should experience Monroe or Gastonia...[shudders, cold chills up and down my spine, cold sweat beading on my forehead]
Now, there are some positives about the area, but in my opinion they don't stack up to the negatives. The positives: generally nice populace (except on the road), relatively safe/not crime-ridden, decent climate, greenspace/natural greenery (rapidly disappearing), many jobs (albeit low-paying), brash (but muddled) economic expansion in a growing area, etc. There is also a lack of so-called 'natural disasters' such as tornados, floods, volcanoes, landslides, fires, earthquakes, blizzards/ice-storms, tsunamis, terrorist attacks, etc., but there is the occasional hurricane that reaches far enough inland to affect the area. But for myself, these positives are not worth it and I want to move to a place where things are actually happening and I'm not simply sitting around watching people get fatter while they continue to buy, and buy, and BUY SOME MORE! Sales and specials on every corner, CONSUME, CONSUME, CONSUME! -- they practically force-feed you crap that you don't need here, bad food and plastic goods that break after you use them for a few months (then lumbering/slumbering back to Wally-World, YAY!). People just 'live' here, that's all they do, stuck in their lil' bubble and ingrained routine that destroys the uniqueness of the human-spirit -- I've noticed that there are major problems with drinking/drugs here because of the boredom in the region (get high = something-to-do) and also because it is equidistant between Florida (where all of the drugs come in) and the heavily populated Northeast (where drugs are consumed in vast quantity due to the sheer number of people living there). Drug-runners and dealers can easily keep a low-profile here (just like 'good' (i.e. creepy) John and Jane next door) while their poison naturally filters into the community surrounding them and wreaks havoc on families, children, schools, etc. If the people only had stuff to do they wouldn't need drugs and alcohol -- theaters, block-parties, poetry-readings, discussion-groups, neighborhood sports, artistic events, festivals, museums, libraries, open-forums; all of this is sorely, SORELY lacking in the 20th largest city in the USA. It's a sad, soul-crushing sight to behold, and I've put up with this crap for 23 years -- though I've heard that Ohio is worse. At least most everything here is shiny and new and not old and worn-down like in brown, tarnished Ohio...right?! Just give it a few years people...
Don't get me wrong: the Charlotte-region is a wonderfully pleasant place to raise a family or retire if you prefer a calm, quiet, and unexciting atmosphere/environment, but if you seek to actually challenge yourself artistically and intellectually then you should definitely look elsewhere. I can certainly see why some Northerners might like the dullness and slow-pacedness of the area after growing up in an arrogant, superficial, and "fast-paced-city" that 'never sleeps' -- but let me tell you, Charlotte doesn't sleep, it blacks-out every weekend and brings new-meaning to the phrase "Sleepy Southern Town." It's a good thing that I love to read and write and challenge myself...otherwise I wouldn't have anything else to do but watch endless hours of TV and be a good lil' American consumer like everyone else here. But it's terrible that I have to retreat into my imagination or hang-out with a few like-minded friends just to have a little bit of fun and enjoyment around here -- where are the artists, actors, playwrights, writers, feminists, philosophers, eccentrics, professors, weirdos...WHERE?! Is it khaki-pants and a Polo-shirt everywhere that I look, especially right there on the corner of Queens & Queens? This sameness depresses me, makes me hurt for the town that I was born and raised in. I would "pray" for this place but I'm 'spiritual' (not fanatically religious) like all of the other close-minded Bible toters 'round here.
Charlotte is the quintessential American city ("Anywhere (or Nowhere) USA") due to the extreme normality, banality, and blandness of the place; things just press-on, insipid people working and spending, working and spending, working and spending. If you want to move somewhere halfway interesting in NC try Asheville or Chapel Hill -- I'll be moving on myself here very soon, leaving the leaden, stuffy place of my birth and early-years so that I might find new-lands of splendor and interestingness...
[Now end this scathing indictment of Charlotte's "culture"] (I'm going to try and publish this!)
--205.188.117.68 00:44, 22 December 2005 (UTC)

I came from Asheville my dads work moved to Charlotte i hate this place A LOT there is A LOT of CRIME and ROBING'S here its DISGUSTING don't move to CHARLOTTE!!!!!!!

Re: artistically and intellectually

On a quick note....You cannot blame Charlotte for someone not challenging themselves artistically and intellectually. I was born and raised in Charlotte since 1980 and since then I have seen my city grow in numbers, become well known for raising great singers and artist and maintain a sense of "well being" and "family". Living in Charlotte is what you make of it. Being a producer of music, alot of interesting and talented people have recieved inspiration from the city of Charlotte to do great things so if you want to challenge yourself artistically and intellectually then Charlotte is a place to do it.

Cities and Towns within the Charlotte Area

These are not all of the cities, towns, and CDPs in the Greater Charlotte area.

County Seat

Pineville is not the county seat of Mecklenburg. Charlotte is the county seat. The administrative units of the county are in Charlotte. Every listing that I could find had Charlotte as the County Seat. Why did this page change it to Pineville?

Charlotte's Size

I think it is a bit complicated to think of Charlotte as the third largest city in the Southeast. Charlotte's city proper population is larger than that of Miami and Atlanta even though these two cities have larger metros. The Tampa Bay area and the Hampton Roads Metro also have larger metros even Charlotte is more populous than any city in either conurbation. Also Louisville, Jacksonville, Fl and Memphis all have larger proper populations than my beloved hometown of Charlotte but smaller conurbations. Also, am I the only one who thinks that the introduction is a bit fluffy? Can this be verify As of 2005, census estimates show there are 710,949 people living within Charlotte's city limits.


--In response: Notice it said CITY not METRO!!!!!!! If it said metro than I would agree with you! But it didn't. It's bigger than Atlanta, it's bigger than Miami, it's bigger than Jacksonville, Tampa, Louisville, etc. Don't hurt your brain trying so hard to find something to argue about!

--In response to your response-- City often indicates metro as well as indicate population within a city boundary. Number two, there are now more people in Louisville since they recently merged most of the cities and towns in the metro (the Kentucky side of it) into one official city. The population currently stands at 703,282. Jacksonville (population 777,704) has been larger than Charlotte for quite some time. {Struck down my own harsh comment} Dinobrya

Education

I'm the one who revised the educational part of the article to include Davidson. You can't leave that great place out. -Amit

Well I Understnad that, but What about the traffic flow in Charlotte? It is gets preety bad, but I think Atlanta and Miami is worse, but not that close! Charlotte population is at least 651,000and when you right add the 12 nc counties and 3 sc counties that a part of metro Charlotte and none of these place are over ahour of 45 mins from uptown Charlotte you have Charlotte's true metro population which is at least 2,500.000.

Metrolina?

Is Metrolina a real place or is it an invention of local TV newscasters and weatherpersons? If "Metrolina" is another word for the greater Charlotte area it's obvious that Charlotte is included in it. I went ahead and deleted the reference to Metrolina in the introduction.

 And I went ahead and put the reference to Metrolina back into the introduction.  Just like Chicagoland is a well known and widely used term for the Chicago metro region, the Big Apple for NYC, etc.  The term is made up by local personalities and media, but is a widely accepted term, and those that live in the Charlotte region are fully aware of this.

University City

Please stop removing the references to Lowe's Motor Speedway and Concord Mills in the University City blurb. The Charlotte Observer printed a map of University City one time showing that University City included Harrisburg, Concord Mills, and Lowe's. It gives people who aren't familiar with the area a better idea of the area. Thanks. Wikipedianinthehouse 19:05, 1 October 2005 (UTC)

Population Estimates

Throughout this page, I am seeing conflicting updated estimates on Charlotte's proper and metropolitan populations. We need to come to some kind of consensus. Dinobrya 09:09, 2 October 2005 (UTC)

Why a whole subheading for sports but not culture?

I have no problem with the substantial section devoted to Panthers, Bobcats, etc. Should there not also be a similar-sized separate section discussing the cultural overview of the city? The funding structure, i.e., Arts & Science Council? The CSO, ballet, theatre groups, gallery scene, development of NODA, so on and so forth?

Culture in Charlotte? You could have fooled me! --205.188.117.68 23:23, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

Charlotte city-651,000 metro-2,500,000

why was poverty info removed?

Why was poverty info removed? I'm going to replace it.

LegCircus 22:15, 19 November 2005 (UTC)

No skyline pics?

I am absolutely DUMBFOUNDED to see no skyline pictures on this page! Charlotte has a very photogenic skyline; I would imagine the citizens of the city would want it showcased. Akhenaton06 12:17, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

  • Word. LegCircus 21:31, 1 December 2005 (UTC)

Charlotte

Charlotte is a growing city. It may be a bit dull at sometimes. Its like a big city with a small town feeling except come rush hour on the interstate. Charlotte IS the 2nd largest financial center in the U.S.(just look at the skyline, their all banks). Charlotte deserves a bit of credit from Atlanta because essentially they're just alike. Charlotte does not rely heavily on NASCAR. I've seen more panthers and bobcats fans than anything. The NASCAR fans are in Concord, Gastonia, and other places. The weather is HOT in the summers and its heaven compared to many northern cities. It rarely snows, and when it does its around 3-12 inches. Then it all melts the next day. The nightlife relies on parties, concerts and other things. Most people go to parties within their communities.

Facts about Charlotte

Charlotte is a growing city. It may be a bit dull at sometimes. Its like a big city with a small town feeling except come rush hour on the interstate. Charlotte IS the 2nd largest financial center in the U.S.(just look at the skyline, they're all banks). Charlotte deserves a bit of credit from Atlanta because essentially they're just alike. Charlotte does not rely heavily on NASCAR. I've seen more panthers and bobcats fans than anything. The NASCAR fans are in Concord, Gastonia, and other places. The weather is HOT in the summers and its heaven compared to many northern cities in the winter. It rarely snows, and when it does its around 3-12 inches. Then it all melts the next day. The nightlife relies on parties, concerts and other things. Most people go to parties within their communities. The crime here in Charlotte is growing, but overall it is a safe city. Charlotte is bigger than any other city in NC. It has an attractive skyline for a southern city. Whoever said that comment about Charlotte being a city where all you do is buy, this is America pal. Charlotte will soon be the talk of the south. It has all the things Atlanta has except maybe the clubs and the MARTA rail, but Charlotte's light-rail system will be completed in 2025. Charlotte is somewhat diverse. The Hispanic race is rapidly growing. The 3 main ethnic groups are whites, blacks, and hispanics. To me Charlotte is more of a suburban city(not a lot of congestion except during rush hour).

Crime

Many of the other large cities have at least some problem with crime, and many of their wiki articles touch on that point. What about Charlotte, does it have a crime problem? Wouldn't it be useful to take note of it in the article? J.B. 2/07/2006

According to local radio, it does. --Golbez 19:42, 7 February 2006 (UTC)
I've added some information on crime in Charlotte pulled from the Uniform Crime Reports. It seems Charlotte is a bit high for cities in it's category (cities 500,000 - 999,999 pop) but not totally out of line. Feel free to re-write and re-organize this section as it's probably a bit dry. If anyone has any ideas for how to better present this information, go ahead and fix it up or let me know and I'll give it a try. I pulled all the crime info (National and Charlotte, as well as Raleigh which I'm going to add this section to as well) and put it in spreadsheet, so if you need some numbers but don't want to dig through the UCR to find it, let me know. Treznor 21:18, 7 February 2006 (UTC)


Crime is very bad recently in Charlotte. www.crimeincharlotte.com

Nicknames

I'm not the one who removed the nicknames on May 12, 2006 but the revert back to previous is poorly written and inaccurate so that shouldn't stay either. I'm about to make the following changes but I decided to put my rationale here.

A crown logo appears on many of the city's street signs, perhaps accounting for its nickname, "the Queen City". ' - it was already mentioned in the paragraph above that its nickname is the Queen City. This is redundant. The fact that the crown symbol is on the streetsigns is of little significance at all but more importantly it is just ridiculous to write that the city got it's nickname from symbols on the streetsigns. (As if it were an unknown mystery how the symbols got on the signs) It is positively known where the city got it's nickname and that should be added to the fist mention of Queen City.

Other nicknames include the "Hornet's Nest" and the "Chicago of the South". It has also been called the "San Francisco of the South," because it served as the center of the popular gold-mining industry until the Gold Rush of 1849 attracted miners to California. - Hornets Nest is well known and once again, the stroy behind it should be added. As for "Chicago of the South" or "San Francisco of the South", I've lived here for many many years and have never ever heard either of these phrases before in my life. The gold rush is extremely important bt it is already covered in the history section.

Fair enough & makes sense to me. I had just been trying to clean up the mess that had been there in the prior edit (before the original deletion) -- a lot of the phrasing was awkward/odd. Had no idea as to the accuracy of the names used.--Grinning Fool 01:56, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
THough now that I re-read what I had put in there to clean up I see some cut and paste material that I thought I'd trimmed out... --Grinning Fool 01:57, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

Population 2006

There are two other conversations on population but they're old so I started a new one. The estimates of

seem high to me but citations were needed and here they are. City Population is 651,101 according to the official city website [3]. According to Charlotte Chamber of Commerce: Charlotte is 648,139, Mecklenburg is 850,178, Charlotte MSA (Metropolitan Statistical Area) is 1,594,799, and Metro Region is 2,371,645.[4]

So there are the stats but the only question is "what is a metro area" as listed in the article? Is the metro area the Metropolitan Statistical Area or the Metro Region. Most people define "metro" as the official MSA and not the larger "metro region" which includes 13 counties - most of which don't even border Mecklenburg. Further supporting this statement, if Charlotte Metro Area really had 2,533,000 as the article currently states, it would be listed as #20 in this article which ranks the top metro areas in the US

I switched the article back to 1,594,799 as I believe that is the number that should be there based on these facts. Please use this area if you wish to rebut. Fife Club 14:04, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

Once again I added the Combined Statistical Area. The Census felt it appropriate to give Greater Charlotte a CMSA population and I do not see why we cannot use both the CMSA and MSA. Several city pages use the CMSA as their metro population. I think it is extremely reasonable to make the public aware of both estimates. Dinobrya 19:32, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
That sounds fine to me. I just know that other people were debating the stats (thinking that they were both "metro" stats) so I dug out the references. As long as we're careful distinguish the differences between the stats I think it's okay to use both types. Fife Club 14:07, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

Boo Hoo

It seems to me the irrelevant, spiteful attacks on Charlotte rise depending on how many NFL teams the Carolina Panthers leave broken and battered throughout the season.

NoDa

NoDa is a term of contempt and revisionism. North Davidson was a center for the arts before this term was coined. The area has seen development within the past few years, and any historical aspect it once had was stripped. The new crowds and the new arts are empty and cold.

Whoa there unsigned IP 71.75.208.179, I totally disagree. I will yield to your comments about the arts community not being a new thing, but the term NoDa is in no way a term of contempt and revisionism. Perhaps that's your POV but that would be a vastly insignificant minority opinion. NoDa is by far the most common term for the area and it overwhelmingly embraced by the surrounding community as well. They're the ones that came up with the name in the first place and they use the term NoDa for community identification and self promotion. Just look at www.NoDa.org! The area is known as NoDa and the name is not offensive and the name shouldn't be removed from the article.
Whoa there. Whoa. Do you know what gentrification is? Doubt it.
Honestly, no I didn't until just now. (I wiki'ed your post.) Thanks for the vocabulary lesson but what was your point? Are you suggesting we shouldn't use the term overwhelmingly used by both NoDa community leaders and the general population and as well, just because a minority of old-time resident don't like modern "progress"?

City (boundries of this article)

There's no disputing that this is an article on the city of Charlotte. Not an article on the Charlotte area (or metro, region, or other synonym.) Reinforcing this fact, see the example that there are articles for Minneapolis and St. Paul plus a seperate article for Twin Cities (the greater region beyond the boundries of either city). So my question is why do we have so much content for things that are not in Charlotte? Belmont Abbey is listed as a college in this Charlotte article when it's neither in Charlotte or Mecklenburg County. And something that makes no sense to me at all, University of Phoenix is listed as a Charlotte college when it's an online university with no physical location here. And going further, somebody just added Gaston County Schools to the list of public schools in Charlotte. WTF?

I don't believe this sort of stuff belongs in an article on the city of Charlotte and I'd like to remove "stuff" like that. Can I get a consensus on what others think on this issue, and/or any existing Wikipedia policies that may apply here? Whatch'all think?

P.S. My gut tells me that sports may an exception to this "boundry" rule (Lowe's Motor Speedway (in Concord), Charlotte Knights (in Fort Mill, SC)) but I can't quite put my finger on a justification for why sports should be okay while schools and other things wouldn't be.

Sports are different because of the naming issue. You would go to New York City and expect a mention of the New York Giants - even though they play in New Jersey. Likewise, until a few years ago, the speedway was Charlotte Motor Speedway. I say nuke all the other stuff. --Golbez 05:56, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

Charlotte's "Notable Residents"

I removed the list of "Notable Residents" because it only makes Charlotte look even more pathetic artistically and intellectually for a city of its size and age. I copied/pasted it here to expand until it reaches a halfway respectable status; better to just leave it out until a few people who are actually notable can appear on the list. --64.12.116.197 16:38, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Notable Residents

I just want to chime in that I agree. "Former American Gladiator"? WTF. There's got to be a threshold of notability (it that's a word). The only slam dunk here is Billy Graham. Fife Club 18:51, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Uptown or Downtown

Ok, is it downtown Charlotte or uptown Charlotte (referring to the area with the skyscrapers)... or are those two different parts of the city? If it's uptown, then all the "Downtown" words should be changed. Are there any Charlotte locals who know for sure? I know in my nearby town of Lexington, NC the center of the city is called "uptown". --TinMan 00:58, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

The area with the skyscrapers is called uptown. --Shizane 06:52, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

In Charlotte, Uptown and Downtown are exacty the same place. They are definitely not two different places (like in NYC and other places). For as long as there's been a city the area has always been known as Downtown. In the mid to late 80's city officials began a campaign to rebrand the downtown area as Uptown, thinking that it sounded more upscale and desirable. Both terms are technically acceptable but the city has done a good job of consistantly branding the Uptown name for well over a decade so the Uptown is more commonly used by residents. It should however be noted although city-financed signage says Uptown, the Federal government has never given a damn about local branding campaigns and refuses to change signs on Interstate 77 (and possibly 277) that still direct drivers to "Downtown". Fife Club 13:27, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

I for one deliberately refer to it as downtown. I am a native Charlottean and it was always "downtown" until pretentious yuppies decreed it should be "Uptown" in the late 80s. --SquareWave 03:33, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

I refer to it as "center city Charlotte" or "the city center" to alleviate any confusion. My understanding that the center city was called uptown because it was uphill from the rest of the city, though I suppose that's not true, at least today... --SQFreak 04:40, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

It is called Uptown because it's the highest elevation in Charlotte. It's referenced in another article Charlotte center city

City Wiki for Charlotte

I am considering starting a local Wiki for Charlotte.

This is not intended to compete with Wikipedia, it would be a community resource for use by current residents and newcomers alike.

Restaurant information, menus, reviews could be posted.

Information and experiences with local vendors and service providers would fit, a community driven "Angie's List."

Not only arts and entertainment sections but a space for local performers and artists to write about their work.

Everything else that community demand decides to supply for itself.

I am asking anyone who has ideas, opinions, criticism or support for this idea to write me at wiki@blueant.us

Thanks.

Relationship with the state of North Carolina

Historically there has often been animus between Charlotte and the state, which I think deserves special mention. The "Great State of Mecklenburg" gets no love from the state. To be the economic engine of NC, you would think they could at least keep the highways around here in halfway decent condition. I-485 has been in the works for how long now?

Absolutely agree. The state gives equal priority to all counties, regardless of economic need or impact. And the state simply doesn't like Charlotte. I was driving south on 85 from Virginia, and it wasn't til I was nearly to Greensboro that I saw a "Charlotte 50 miles" or whatever sign. --Golbez 08:55, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
This sounds like WP:OR. Make sure to provide sources for these contributions. Morphh 13:26, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
No one's contributing yet. --Golbez 01:39, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
Get off your Wikipedia high-horse, as stated above no one has contributed to the main article yet. There is no "original research" to the phrase "Great State of Mecklenburg". Look it up. The state of NC hates the fact that Charlotte is larger and more economically influential than the capital, Raleigh. Also I suggest you research DOT funding by county, if you truly believe this is idle speculation. You will see that counties in the Charlotte metro area are consistently underfunded in proportion to their population, growth rate, and economic contribution to the state's coffers. What we seek here on the discussion page is some consensus on how Charlotte's relationship vis-a-vis the state of NC should be described. I have my opinion but don't presume to speak for everyone, and invite such discussion here.

Neighborhoods

I'm a lifelong resident of Charlotte and I've personally never heard of Starmount, Steele Creek, or Derita. Am I safe in assuming that most would prefer the "neighborhoods" section should cover culturally and historically relevant areas of the city? I'd hate to imagine a visitor reading this article and hiking out to West Sugar Creek road to see the sights.

I've been here a decade and have heard of all three (though I think of Starmount as a road first). Steele Creek, in particular, is booming these days. I tend to think that "sights" should be in the sites of interest area, though. Jdb1972 14:26, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
All you have to do is listen to the news on either television or radio, or read it in the Observer and these areas are mentioned often. Actually,other than Starmount, I'm surprised you could live here more than a few years and not hear about the Derita or Steele Creek areas of town. Personally I've lived here for a decade and never ever heard of Biddleville but I didn't remove it. And as for "sights", I consider this to be an encyclopedic article of significant factual information, not a positive-only sight-seeing guide for tourists. If that were the case you'd have to remove blights like Eastland. Fife Club 19:19, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
No offense.....but to end this argument here and now, I found a website that will prove an interesting fact about: Starmount. It states that starmount is the largest established neighborhood in South Charlotte(fact).[5]. Even though I do not live in Charlotte, Im sure that this large neighborhood should be mentioned. I took the liberty of adding this, quite interesting fact,to the page. Dragan101 15:00, 16 November 2006 (UTC)
Biddleville and Derita are both historic areas - Biddleville was one of the historic centers of the African-American community, roughly centered around JCSU; Derita was (along with Paw Creek, Newell, Oakdale and Hickory Grove) a small unincorporated 'town' gradually absorbed into Charlotte through annexations in the 1980s and 1990s.
Derita has lost most of its' identity as a place during the last decade or two, but technically it still exists - until the late 1980s N. Graham Street became Derita Road at I-85, and the portion of Sugar Creek Road north of Mineral Springs was also Derita Road, until the mid 1990s. --Davidals 01:15, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

North Charlotte

Is North Charlotte, North Carolina part of Charlotte or is this a separate city? This may need to be a AFD nom. Morphh 02:41, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

It's part of the city, and I agree and will do the AFD for you if you want. -- Omicronpersei8 (talk) 02:41, 4 September 2006 (UTC)
Go for it! :-) Morphh 03:19, 4 September 2006 (UTC)
Perhaps a redirect may work better Morphh 03:26, 4 September 2006 (UTC)
Good idea. The fact that I always think of deletion first probably says something not so good about me. -- Omicronpersei8 (talk) 03:27, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

GA Drive

I've listed this article for the Good Article drive for Wikiproject North Carolina. Morphh 16:42, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Also, please take the time to vote for North Carolina on U.S. Collaboration of the Week. Please Vote!!! We need more votes! Thanks, Morphh 16:42, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Fair use images

I removed the fair use logos in the sports section. The use of those logos violates rules #8 of the fair use criteria. If you have any questions, please let me know.--NMajdan•talk 22:57, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

"Hezbollah Cell" in Charlotte?

What a joke, just another example of post-9/11 hysteria running rampant. Fox News recently ran a story showing the millions of American federal tax dollars spent on convicting a few harmless Lebanese people living in Charlotte of "terrorist activities," accusing them of being a "Hezbollah cell" and supplying money to 'terrorists,' planning 'terrorist attacks,' being 'Islamic radicals,' etc.; a few federal prosecutors in NC ended up sentencing a Lebanese-American man to 155 years in prison for smuggling cigarettes from North Carolina to Michigan. Other people he was associated with received years in prison and were subsequently deported.

Here's some quotes from the 'report':
"One of those operations is the subject of 'Smokescreen: Hezbollah Inside America,' an exhaustive FOX News report about a Hezbollah cell that was operating for several years in Charlotte, North Carolina. FOX followed the many tentacles of this cell, which extended far beyond Charlotte — to Michigan, to the West Coast, to Canada and to Beirut, Lebanon, where most of the members were from. FOX News spent months tracking this story to all these places and more."
"An FBI agent who refused to allow the taunts and skepticism of his colleagues to dissuade him from tracking the connections that linked a group of Lebanese illegals operating in Charlotte to terror cells in Canada and Beirut. An alert sheriff’s deputy, working part time at a tobacco wholesaler in Charlotte, who spent his own time tracking down a suspicious group of Arabic-speaking customers who were trading wads of cash for tons of cheap tobacco. A young prosecutor willing to bet his reputation on a case that had to leapfrog over terrorist laws that were either antiquated or hadn’t even been written yet."
"While arrests were made in this case a year before 9/11, the case was tried just after 9/11, and that brought with it a whole new set of questions that we examine."
"According to the U.S. government, Harake was a military commander in Beirut and received money from Mohammad Hammoud, Cohen's client. Harake was the alleged conduit connecting the Charlotte cell to the military wing of Hezbollah. Cohen argued that Harake was just a used car salesman, who ran a humanitarian aid group for Hezbollah. But the night before the assassination, it appeared Harake knew that something was up. He called Cohen to say he couldn't make the interview the next day. "Things are about to get ugly," a nervous Cohen told me after speaking with the sheik."

SOURCES: [6], [7], [8] --172.145.6.40 10:19, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

Well known in the region for some time, kinda weird it took this Fox News story for anyone else to hear about it. Yeah, there was supposedly a group of people in Concord, North Carolina (just outside Charlotte) who bought large amounts of cigarettes, drove them out of state (to Michigan, I believe) and profited off the tax differential, then sent that money back to the Middle East. However, since it didn't happen in Charlotte itself, I can't see how this is relevant to the article. --Golbez 11:31, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

Malls?

The shopping section is a list of malls replete with flowery advert-like descriptions. No other major city has a list of its malls any more than it has a list of its McDonalds. A city of 600,000 people doesn't need to mention these things. If there are no objections, I'm removing the section.--Loodog 05:10, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

In most cities, you'd be right. However, in Charlotte, many neighborhoods are named after, or chiefly referred to by, their shopping centers. SouthPark in particular, Eastland, the Arboretum... however, I agree that we don't need this list, as only three of the malls mentioned are actually in Charlotte, and they can easily be merged into "Neighborhoods". Merge the SouthPark section into the SouthPark neighborhood section, maybe move Northlake into that section, definitely move Eastland there (and in fact, it already is), and give Concord Mills an honorable mention as one of the chief tourist sites in the region, five feet from Charlotte's border. --Golbez 14:33, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

Keep in mind all that there is a Charlotte metropolitan area article where regional malls are typically listed. As for on this city article, I agree, if at all, only list the ones within the city limits. --TinMan 19:48, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

Okay, which ones are within city limits? I won't remove those.--Loodog 00:03, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

The ones that are listed now :) --TinMan 06:18, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

I thought we reached a consensus to delete the shopping section

It does not really make sense to me to leave Eastland and SouthPark malls on the list. Besides articles on other cities don't even have a section for shopping malls. It makes more sense to delete the section entirely, and list major shopping centers on the Charlotte MSA article. Just an opinion. --Cardozo 17:09, February 2007 (UTC)

I could really go either way. I don't know if we've reached a consensus yet or not. Maybe need more input from others. The malls (in the city limits) are a significant part of the city just like local business employeers and hospitals. I know some city articles have shopping sections, but only if they have important info to cover. For example, the Cary Towne Center article was merged into the Cary, NC article because it wasn't notable enough for its own article. I think there needs to be some "shopping" section on this city article or somehow merge it into another section... whether it has a link to the MSA Shopping section or has brief descriptions, I don't really care. It would make more sense to me to just link to the mall articles directly here instead of sending people elsewhere to get to them though. --TinMan 00:21, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
I wanted to delete the whole thing since no other cities have mall advertisements, but Golbez made an argument that the nature of Charlotte and its neighborhoods was necessarily inextricable from that of its malls. Since I've never set foot in the state of North Carolina, I didn't feel qualified to argue, and contented myself with removing the peacock words from their descriptions.--Loodog 00:22, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
We reached a consensus to remove the ones not in Charlotte and non-notable ones; however, SouthPark and Eastland (much more SouthPark) are indeed notable. Perhaps they should be merged into the sections on their neighborhoods, but I wasn't aware if that had yet happened. This phenomenon is probably not unique to Charlotte, but in the other places I've been, usually the mall is named after the area; in Washington, people know White Flint and Tysons Corner, but these (at least I think, in the case of White Flint) were towns or neighborhoods before the mall came along. SouthPark is 100% named after the mall it surrounds. --Golbez 00:51, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

If thats the case, maybe I should add Northlake Mall back to the list. The mall has a Charlotte address and development there is booming. --Cardozo 12:54, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Popular culture

This section looks like a sprawling list and should be rewritten into article text. Discuss the popular culture and the examples in paragraph form, not in bullet lists. We don't want this to be a triva section. Morphh (talk) 13:50, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

External links edit war

OK, STOP EDIT WARRING! Now both sides explain your case why these (or some of these) links should be included or removed. Do they pertain to the article itself or a vital quality of the city? Are they encyclopediaic (or have a good reputation)? I personally know city-data is a bad website for information, but some of the others may need a second look. I mean, what kind of article are we trying to build here? What guidelines are we going by? --Triadian 22:38, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

The person adding the links is using two different IPs to add these links. 208.53.183.165 and 24.172.118.10. The second IP I listed reverted-warred with several users, including myself, just over a month ago, and were blocked. They also reverted-warred yesterday and were blocked. The links added are not appropriate, and other users besides me have removed them. Links to websites like forums and relocation websites not appropriate. This page was semi-protected about a month ago due to the second IP adding those links. Acalamari 22:47, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
208.53.183.165 has now been been blocked for continually adding the external links. Acalamari 22:53, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
Fair enough. --Triadian 22:55, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

I am sick of people who don't live in Charlotte taking articles out who do not live there and live in Raleigh, I will edit—Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.104.231.252 (talk • contribs)

It doesn't matter where we live; I don't have to live in Charlotte to edit the article about it. Acalamari 23:40, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
And there is already a generous quantity of links to fill the needs of any casual viewer. I count 12, which is twice the number that Atlanta has. Wahkeenah 23:50, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
That seems like a reasonable number for this article. An additional 5-10 just bloats the list and will be removed as spam. Acalamari 23:55, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
Well, I've been to Charlotte. I know what the Charlotte Observer is and I can even pick up Charlotte news out here. All of that is almost completely meaningless though. It still does not explain why you believe links like city-data.com and Charlotte Real Estate are encyclopediaic enough to remain in the external links list. I actually happen to agree with you that some links could remain, just judging by the external links sections of other cities... like Raleigh, haha. The Charlotte Observer is the city's main newspaper and the GIS link could be helpful. Yet, to keep the list from going overboard, we don't need opinionated blogs and restaurant reviews. --Triadian 00:00, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
It might be useful to list the current links and the delete ones, and have the IP address argue as to why they are encyclopedic. I'm guessing he simply doesn't care about the rule that wikipedia is not a link farm, but this would at least give him a chance to explain. Wahkeenah 00:16, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
Looking at the links removed, I'd say we should bring the one about the newspaper back, but links about real estate, property tax, and the forums/blogs are unencyclopedic. As for the links about relocating to Charlotte, do we really need them? Wikipedia is not a travel guide or a moving agent, after all. Acalamari 01:43, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
  • Agreed - I 2nd Wahkeenah's proposal. Some of these links are obvious commercial spam. Some of them look more useful to the reader. It'll take some editing space - and we may want to create a new subpage to host the discussion - but I think it's worth doing. Rklawton 01:29, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
I seriously doubt any worthy debate will result out of this. I agree, Wikipedia's it's not a travel guide; I say only list the links that back up the info in the article or provide further info on the subject. --Triadian 01:48, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

!!!PLEASE UPDATE SKYLINE PICUTURE!!!

I think Charlotte's skyline picture at the top of the page should be changed because it is not up-to-date. It doesn't even have the Hearst tower behind BofA Corporate center. I would change the picture myself but I can't because I am a new user...I also think it is not a very good angle :P. I uploaded a better picture of Uptown charlotte and the filename is "Charlotteskyline.JPG" the current is "Charlotteskyline.jpg" The only difference is the "jpg" is in capital letters. Change it if you can please!!!....(Doesn't have to be the picture I uploaded).


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