Talk:Chai Ling

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[reader] Regarding the interview:

Did anyone catch the part where Chai Ling cracked down and basically said, "even though being a Chinese, I shouldn't say bad things about the Chinese, but I really dont think the Chinese are even worth fighting for." When the reporter asked her why she won't be staying on the Square, Chai Ling said "I am different from everyone else. I don't want to die here."

She is basically an auto-racist, and hates other Chinese, and thinks she is special or something. It's sad that this June 4th movement was basically hijacked by her agenda to cause as much conflict as possible so she can get political asylum, and pursue her American dream.

Maybe someone should write more about how she single handed refused all attempts from other student leaders and government officials to de-escalate, including Zhao ZiYang's plead for the students to return the school before his exile.

Compared to the other student leader, Wang Dan, who were offered political asylum as well, but refused. Chai Ling was basically a traitor to the student movement, and a traitor to the Chinese people. If she had indeed come to power, China would be even more totalitarian than it is now.

And funny how her company keeps trying to delete this article, I thought she was pro free speech? Ridiculous.

Contents

[edit] qidai and NPOV

Saranyaforlag had added two comments to the article. I have moved them to the discussion page (where they belong). Here they are, with a comment of myself:

NB! Please note that the above quoted interview and the way it has been interpreted all hangs on one Chinese word that she used, qidai. It is the key word in the following translated sentence: "I feel so sad, because how can I tell them that what we are actually hoping for is bloodshed..." Now qidai has different meanings, one is quite correctly hope, but another is expect. Chai Ling most certainly had the latter in mind. (This paragraph has been written by Yan Friis.)

I disagree. The word qīdài 期待 can be translated into English as "hope for", "look forward to" and "expect", but to say that it has the meaning "to expect" is just a trick that works only with people who don't know Chinese, because qīdài 期待 always implies a desire, such as in qīdàizhe nǐ zǎorì xuéchéng guīlái 期待着你早日学成归来 or jué bù gūfù nín de qīdài 决不辜负您的期待.

This is also supported by the context, by what Chai Ling went on to say: "And what is truly sad is that some students, and some famous, well-connected people, are working hard to help the government, to prevent it from taking this measure", i.e. bringing about a bloodshed.

Chai Ling claimed in a letter to the New York Times that qīdài 期待 should have been translated as "to expect". She consciously tried to mislead the public.

Saranyaforlag's second comment:

NB! Some of what is being stated in this article is very tendentious. Please have in mind that this also goes for the above mentioned documentary "Gate Of Heavenly Peace" that she refused to take part in. And "The American"-dream quote is taken out of context, and should be read as such, and so should the comment about her alleged claims about being a 1989 heroine. (Yan Friis)

I agree that the article should be cleared up, but I think that quote makes sense here. And BlueShirts is right: She's a damn hypocrite. —66.98.206.97 05:23, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

The text in the article may well be correct, but I still don't think the article sounds balanced. It doesn't sound like an encyclopedia article to me. --Blue Elf 00:53, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
First, I would agree with Blue Elf but go on to ask how those focusing on the ridiculous notion that Chai may have Hoped for Bloodshed (including her own since she was there when it happened!)have fallen for the oldest political trick in the book. Instead of focusing on how the Chinese government should treat the great Chinese people they are drawn into a bald faced attempt to discredit the speaker when the message itself cannot be debated (even the Chinese Communist authorites state they are in favor of democracy and try to show it with local elections and statements to the U.S. media). --206.104.58.62 (IP address of Jenzabar, Inc SPRINTLINK) 09:15, 14 July 2006

[edit] Deleted text / revert

I've reverted changes made by 206.104.58.62 (IP address of Jenzabar, Inc SPRINTLINK). A user at the company run by Chai Ling herself and her husband deleted the whole article and replaced it with a text supposedly copied from the Harvard Business School Bulletin. That's vandalism - please stop. —Babelfisch 01:43, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

The anonymous IP registered with Jenzabar has vandalised the article once again. I've reverted the changes. If you want to contribute something, please do so in a way that makes sense. —Babelfisch 13:18, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
The same anonymous IP has once again deleted the link to the article about Jenzabar on the website of the documentary "Gate of Heavenly Peace" by Carma Hinton and Richard Gordon. I've once again re-inserted it. I've added a remark that this is not the company website. —Babelfisch 08:28, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Stubbed

I have removed most of the text from this article because it is unsourced and is drawing WP:OTRS complaints. Please rebuild the article with due regard to reliable sources and references. The Uninvited Co., Inc. 03:27, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

You've deleted almost the whole article. I've moved the original version to this talk page (see below), so it can be edited and referenced.
What are the OTRS complaints? Without details, those complaints can't be addressed. —Babelfisch 03:12, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Chai Ling kept coming back and deleting the whole section. I am not familiar with the formating, can someone help out here in reverting the whole article? - sarahsarah Oct 10, 06 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Sarahsarah (talk • contribs) 08:20, 12 October 2006.

They're vandalising the article about Jenzabar as well.
I see you've restored the article except for this link:
* Article on Jenzabar (link to company website below)
I would have waited for a reply from UninvitedCompany. —Babelfisch 01:42, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
The complaints are broad and appear plausible, which is why I stubbed. Without sources we can't contest even vague claims. The Uninvited Co., Inc. 03:05, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
What are the complaints? "Broad and plausible" is not enough to justify these attempts to censor Wikipedia.
It's not acceptable to immediately delete articles without any discussion because they are unsourced. There are tags and talk pages to solve such problems. —Babelfisch 02:38, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Revision as of 16:38, 18 September 2006

This is a Chinese name; the family name is Chai.

Chai Ling (Chinese: 柴玲; Pinyin: Chái Líng) (born 15 April 1966) was one of the leaders in the Tian'anmen Square protests of 1989.

Chai Ling was born in the city of Rìzhào in Shāndōng province. She graduated from Beijing University in 1987 and then undertook graduate study in Beijing Normal University concentrating on child psychology.

She emerged as one of the student leaders on the Square at a later stage of the movement, and although there was no official power rested in her post, for which she was constantly referred to as the icon fighter of democracy.

The most controversial aspect of her role in the protests was her uncompromising stand on the Tian'anmen Square. Her tactics centered on publicly shaming the communist Chinese government for its callous disregard for its people. She was argubly the main factor that resulted in the ultimate failure of Tian'anmen movement which ended with PLA's crackdown. The contrast between her high-profile in the movement and subsequent distancing from the democratic movement after the crackdown made her vulnerable to the accusation that she was an opportunistic and calculating fame-seeker only interested in improving her social and financial situation at the cost of others, in the name of democracy.

In an interview with American journalist Philip Cunningham on May 28, 1989, she stated:

"The students kept asking, 'What should we do next? What can we accomplish?' I feel so sad, because how can I tell them that what we are actually hoping for is bloodshed, for the moment when the government has no choice but to brazenly butcher us. Only when the Square is awash with blood will the people of China open their eyes. Only then will they really be united. But how can I explain this to my fellow students? And what is truly sad is that some students, and famous well-connected people, are working hard to help the government, to prevent it from taking such measures. For the sake of their selfish interests and their private dealings they are trying to cause our movement to collapse and get us out of the Square before the government becomes so desperate that it takes action."[1]

She was on the wanted list by the Chinese government. She fled from China in April 1990, with the help of Hong Kong-funded organizations, and completed a beautifying plastic surgery while in exile, claiming that this would help conceal her identity. After 10 months of hiding, she settled in Paris, France, where she immediately divorced her then-husband, Fēng Cóngdé (封从德), once she accepted a full scholarship to Princeton University. She later received an honorary Masters degree in Political Science from Princeton University. After this, she served as a junior consultant at Bain & Co., a leading strategic consulting firm, during 1993-1996 in its Boston office.

Then she moved on to acquire an MBA at Harvard Business School in 1998. She runs a software company with her current husband, Robert A. Maginn Jr., who was the vice president and partner of the Boston office of Bain & Co. Maginn was instrumental in the hiring of Chai into Bain, a controversial move fiercely opposed by Bain's Asian partners for the fear of provoking the Chinese government. After rampant rumors of an affair between the two, Maginn divorced his wife to marry Chai.

They now co-run the software company Jenzabar.

Chai and Maginn Jr. were sued by five former executives and Harvard Business School for "a number of illegal actions."[2]

"Today, I am living the American dream," Chai told Parade magazine in June of 2003. She also serves as a trustee to a few local education institutes in Cambridge, Massachusetts, where she resides.

She repeatedly declined an interview for the documentary film on the 1989 student demonstrations, "Gate of Heavenly Peace," released in 1995.

She reportedly made a trip to China seeking business opportunities in 2005.

[edit] External links

[[Category:1966 births|Ling, Chai]] [[Category:Living people|Ling, Chai]] [[category:Chinese dissidents]]

[edit] Vandalism

Anonymous user 206.104.58.62 (IP address allocated to Jenzabar, Inc, SPRINTLINK): Don't vandalise this discussion. See Wikipedia guidelines on Behavior that is unacceptable on talk pages. —Babelfisch 06:41, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Unsourced materials removed

I have removed material from this article that does not comply with our policy on the biographies of living persons. Biographical material must always be referenced from reliable sources, especially negative material. Negative material that does not comply with that must be immediately removed. Note that the removal does not imply that the information is either true or false.

Please do not reinsert this material unless you can provide reliable citations, and can ensure it is written in a neutral tone. Please review the relevant policies before editing in this regard. Editors should note that failure to follow this policy may result in the removal of editing privileges.--Docg 00:16, 24 January 2007 (UTC)