Talk:Chaac

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

	Mexico Portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Mexico, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to Mexico on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the Project's quality scale. Please rate the article and then leave a short summary here to explain the ratings and/or to identify the strengths and weaknesses of the article.
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the importance scale.

	This article falls within the scope of WikiProject Mesoamerica, a WikiProject interested in improving the encyclopaedic coverage and content of articles relating to pre-Columbian Mesoamerica, its civilizations, history, accomplishments and other topics. If you would like to help out, you are welcome to drop by the project page and/or leave a query at the project's talk page.
Resources and guidelines for editing Mesoamerica-related articles: Guidelines— Outline of suggested guidelines and editing conventions Resources— Selected resources and compendia of Mesoamerican sources and studies Citations— Bibliography and pre-filled citations for Mesoamerican sources Journals— Links to selected journals publishing Mesoamerican research, example citation templates Article listing— Inventory and watchlists of WP:MESO articles and their talk pages (Article Watchlist)—(Talkpage Watchlist) Worklists— Project worklists and activities
NB: Assessment ratings and other indicators given below are used by the Project in prioritising and managing its workload.
Start	This article has been rated as Start-Class on the Project's quality scale.
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the Project's importance scale.
WikiProject Mesoamerica priority open tasks: (click "show" to expand) WikiProject Mesoamerica Open Tasklist: a shortlist of things you can do to help out. Queries welcomed here. (Project Main • Activities • Catalogue • Guidelines • Strategy• Tools and refs) edit | watch | purge NEWS and ANNOUNCEMENTS: → Mesoamerica, Maya civilization, Olmec, Palenque are WP:MESO collaboration targets of the moment. → Pre-filled citation templates for Mesoamerican sources at Citations. → Recently promoted to GA status: Yuri Knorosov, Nahuatl language, Charles Etienne Brasseur de Bourbourg. PROJECT ACTIVITIES: Meta-tasks and subprojects: • add project banner to articles • document Strategy • assign article ratings per the assessment scheme • add to Project references • collate images and maps • More... Categorisation: • develop full Category scheme • reorganise Cat:Mesoamerica contents • More category tasks... Templates: • {{Mesoamerica site infobox}} (create) • {{Mesoamerica ruler infobox}} (create) • {{Maya civilization}} (improve) • {{WP Mesoamerica}} project banner (populate) • More... ARTICLE TO-DO: Requested articles: • History of Mesoamerica • Chenes (Maya subregion & architectural style) • 260-day Mesoamerican calendar • List of Mesoamerican cultures • Hermann Beyer • Huastec civilization • Valley of Oaxaca • More... Expand from stub: • Calendar round • Chiapas highlands • Chilam Balam • Chol language • Trecena • Veintena • More... Cleanup/attention needed: • Domesticated plants of Mesoamerica • Gender in Mesoamerican cultures • History of Mesoamerica (Paleo-Indian) • Gender in Maya society • Olmec figurine • More... Improvement drive: Start-Class • Mesoamerican calendars • Mesoamerican chronology • Mixtec • Monte Albán • Toltec • Yucatán Peninsula • More... Improvement drive: B-Class • Chichen Itza • La Venta • Maya calendar • Maya civilization • Maya script • Olmec • Quetzalcoatl • More... Prepare for Quality reviews (GA, PR, FAC): • Mesoamerica • Mayan languages • Spanish conquest of Mexico • Palenque • Chunchucmil • More...

---

I took out the below 2 sentences, as they seem to differ from the sources I've read. Might the last be a confusion between Chac and the Corn God Yum Kaax? -- Infrogmation

"Later, he replaced Kan as one of the Bacabs, a wind god devoted to the direction east and the color yellow."

"He was a very kind god and taught the Mayans agriculture."

---

East is mentioned twice in the article:

• "Chac Xib Chac", Red Chac of the East
• "Kan Xib Chac", Yellow East Chac

I suppose one of them should have been south, but which one?

- Kaare 13:54, 21 Jan 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Article rename

Hi there Drini, hope you had a good holiday back in Yucatán! While I agree that "Chaac" is a more faithful rendition of this deity's name than "Chac", it should also be noted that these days most recent scholars and works (ie, since the mid-90s) follow the orthography as standardised by the Academia de Lenguas Mayas de Guatemala, and transcribe the name as Chaak. At some point I'd like to update the orthography across the various Maya articles to follow this more contemporary practice, for greater consistency, and I'd suggest that "Chaak" becomes the preferred name for this particular article. In the meantime however, I'll add a little explanation re orthographies in the text. Cheers, --cjllw | TALK 01:36, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

Well, I'm from yucatan, and I've never heard before the deity being named Chac, as chac means red, and chaac the god (the pronounciation differs) that's why I put "chac xib chaac", the first one for red, the last one for the name (actually it wasnt' a god that splitted in four, Chaac is like the father god, and there are four "chaques" (helpers) assigned to cardinal points, all under Chaac power (this particular bit I just was reminded of 3 days ago while I was at uxmal). -- ( drini's page ☎ ) 07:26, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

Well, as it was pointed above, there was 2 chaques assigned to east. South correspond to yellow, so I went and fixed that too. -- ( drini's page ☎ ) 07:31, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

I'd like to help you with the ortography explanation. Here's a link to the mayan-spanish dictionary from the Autonomous University of Yucatan: letter CH, notice CHAK means red (rojo) (as you poined, the ortography used nowadays) and CHAAK means rain (lluvia).

However, although nowadays ot's been standarized as Chaak, I think the Chaac name should still be used as main title since it's the most recognized and used as of now (and thus it's more likely that a visitor would type that when looking for the article). But yes, an explanation of Chac/chak/chaak/chaac/... should be in the article -- ( drini's page ☎ ) 07:35, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the links Drini. I would still prefer however to use a consistent orthography for Maya articles in general, and to me the orthography which makes most sense to use is that of the Academia de Lenguas Mayas. This is for a couple of reasons: firstly, it is the first comprehensive orthography for which there has been a formal standard written, and it has been very widely adopted by scholars in the field, and the Maya communities themselves (or so I understand). The field of Maya studies has often complained about the inconsistent orthographies which have been in use, which lead to some confusion and inaccuracies (such as in this particular case; note also that kan should be k'an in this context as well), and while not (yet) universally adopted, most professional sources written in the past ten years or so now use it, a trend which will presumably continue. Secondly, even though (as you point out) other spellings may be more familiar to the reader (since used by earlier and popular works), it is not always possible to determine which is "most common". For example, I think that "Chac" is actually the most common spelling to have been used for this deity- this spelling appears in popular works by such noted authorities as Michael Coe and Stephen Houston. By instead using the contemporary orthography (even if it is not as yet the "most common"), we can avoid such debates and judgement calls. Of course, all alternate spellings should be referenced in the article, and redirects will ensure that the reader is directed to the article whichever of the variant spellings they may be more familiar with.--cjllw | TALK 22:53, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

I have reworked the article by removing unnecessary detail (such as the Yucatec words for the directional colours), and adding relevant information plus some references.86.87.62.150 14:44, 22 May 2007 (UTC)