Talk:Cebuano language

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Contents

[edit] Cebuano vs. Tagalog

This section currently delves more into culture instead of linguistics. This is better discussed in a separate article. And I think it is non-NPOV to say that "Cebu is virtually the capital of the Philippines."

I will be transferring culturaly oriented subjects out of the article.--Jondel 11:39, 7 Aug 2004 (UTC)
Cebu or bohol is really the capital!! lol not really, but we hate the 'superiority' of manila over the rest of the philippines Australian Jezza 23:01, 30 September 2006 (UTC)
The alleged superiority of Manila is a historical accident caused by the Spanish transfer of the capital of the colony from Cebu to Manila. If Cebu remained the capital, then for sure the revolution against Spain will have happened in Cebu and all our Rizals and Bonifacios would have been Cebuanos; the language of the revolution would be the Cebuano language and consequently the official language of the new republic would be Cebuano instead of Tagalog. Please be less emotional so you will see things objectively.
Would Cebu have been any better had they remained the capital of the colony? Or would they have developed the same 'superiority' complex that they complain so much against Manila?
Well whats he problem with leaving Cebu as the Capital? And if the national heros would be Cebuans? (which i highly doubt becuase Jose Rizal would still ba a hero, and the First national hero Lapu- Lapu WAS a Cebuano!!Australian Jezza 01:01, 28 October 2006 (UTC)


I strongly question the stress of the numbers which has been proposed here. They seem to be based more on Tagalog stress (at the end) than Bisaya. Maybe the author could explain.. Salamat ha! Kusgan

Please be bold, and correct the stress.--Jondel 05:15, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

>>The alleged superiority....

This really complicates the issue of which language should the national language be based on. What should Filipinos officially speak?--Jondel 05:15, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

For me, any Philippine language can be the basis of the national language. I'd rather have a native language than English or Spanish. Look at Indonesia or even Italy, who chose one of their languages to be their national language. In these countries it resulted in unity. Only in the Philippines will this result in infighting. I hate the regionalism of the Filipinos, especially of the Cebuanos. I am an Ilokano-Pangasinan and I love it that the Philippines has many languages used at home and one language used for national understanding.
Uhh, regionalism is everywhere, if you've lived in Manila and are Filipino, you probably know that it is awkard to talk in another language(English and Spanish speakers are elitist, Visayans are promdi's etc , etc ) other than Tagalog and NCR and Tagalog regions.(So Tagalogs too, not only Cebuanos can be accused of regionalism)About national language. It is also possible to develop the national language, I've seen a technical book on Physics in Indonesean from my classmates here in Tokyo. (The've developped their own satellite rockets with 'in-house' technology. ) It would hard to overcome language typecasts. Imagine books on Brain surgery, Tensor calculus, Quantum Mechanics, etc in Pilipino. The only highly 'technical' books I know are law books.--Jondel 04:40, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
Yes I too have seen technical books in Bahasa Indonesia, but I think we should develop all Philippine languages technically and not just Filipino and Bisaya. I even go further to suggest a common technical vocabulary for all Philippine languages. We only have to be fair to all. Intellectualization should be the goal of every Philippine language. The problem with Filipinos is that we try to put down other Philippine languages instead of finding a way to pull them all up and develop all of them equally. And while all are being developed, we should assign one to be an official language to serve as a second language to all Filipinos for purposes of understanding. This could not and should not be English because it does not belong to the same language family as the Philippine languages. The reason for the success of Bahasa Indonesia is the support from the popular culture in Indonesia (with over 700 hundred languages as opposed to the 185 in the Philippines!). In contrast the Cebuano speaking people are content with dragging Tagalog down instead of developing their own. This severe hatred of Tagalog is a purely Cebuano trait - it is definitely not common among Ilocano and Pangasinan people.
jst because you don't have the "trait" of the hatred(well i dont hate tagalog, it is just they way they think they are better) I am sure that some Ilocanos and Pangasinan people do dislike or hate the fact that their language is not considered good enough to be an official language just like Tagalog/ Filipino. Plus we have developed our language, it is just becuase you don't speak Cebuano and you dont know how it has been developed.Australian Jezza 01:04, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
What are you talking about? Only among the Cebuanos of Cebu have I encountered a hatred for Tagalog and the Tagalog people that is so deep-seated. Just for them to even hear Tagalog spoken in their streets and other public places elicits feelings of disgust and animosity; you hear them murmuring among themselves about "those Tagalogs" (in Cebuano, of course) with contempt. It sickens me, really. Never in Metro Manila has the common man ever viewed his Cebuano counterpart with the same contempt (given that Cebuanos along with other Visayans comprise the majority of the capital region's population), and now Cebuanos have the gall to accuse Metromanileños of "arrogance"? The hell? In Metro Manila, we accept everybody; Cebu should also do the same. (And giving the city of Cebu the status of national capital would...one could only imagine how much more arrogant and contemptuous Cebuanos would become. It would be unbearable.) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 210.213.174.51 (talk) 11:11, 3 February 2007 (UTC).
What the heck?! That is the most unfounded piece of writing I have ever seen. What do you mean 'only' among Cebuanos of Cebu have you encountered a hatred for the Tagalogs that is so deep-seated? On what national survey have you carried this out? Regionalism and rivalries are natural among many of the ethnolinguistic groups of the Philippines, even the Tagalogs. Maybe you only think that it's only the Cebuanos who are like that because we are the only people who have 'survived' the Tagalization of the country and because our numbers are as huge as the Tagalogs, it is only logical that we are at the forefront of resisting the centrist Tagalogs. It is pretty obvious that many other groups also have resentments against each other and the Tagalogs but because they are a)in much smaller numbers compared to Cebuanos or b)they already have been killed off or Tagalized, their resentment to Tagalogs would not be as widespread and would not be as heard of as that of the resentments the Cebuanos have towards the Tagalogs. I am pretty sure the many mountain groups of northern Luzon and the Muslim groups in Mindanao are as pissed off at the Tagalogs as the Cebuanos are.
And as for the comparisons made with Bahasa Indonesian in Indonesia. Whoever made the comparison failed to see the fact that Bahasa Indonesian is based on the Malay language (one which also is the base for Bahasa Melayu of Malaysia), and the Malay ethnolingusitic group DO NOT comprise the majority or ANY SORT of significant majority in Indonesia. Indonesia did not choose Javanese to be the national language but instead chose Malay, a (once) minor language in that country. If Indonesians looked up to the Filipino example and copied it, then Indonesia would have Javanese as the national language since the Javanese are the majority ethnic group and the Javanese homeland is where the seat of power, the center of government is located. So I think you should stop drawing too many parallels between Indonesian and Philippine language policy.. I hoped you all see the difference. The Tagalog (Wikang Filipino) situation is totally different to the Bahasa Indonesian situation. Si lapu lapu (talk) 20:40, 24 May 2008 (UTC)Si Lapu Lapu

210.213.174.51 says that Bisayan people comprise the majority of people in the capital region... i have NEVER heard this before, i know that bisayans all over (cebuanos, illongos, waray- warays etc.) comprise the majority, but NOT in Manila. Plus are you trying to make stuff up? I mean i don't like tagalog, but if someone doesn't know cebuano, most people (if they are Filipino) would revert to Tagalog to talk to that person, just so that they can be understood by the person they are talking to, and if someone can't speak cebuano, it isn't their fault, and we accept that Cebuano isn't spoken by all, but we think it's unfair that one language has all the glamour of being the "national" lanuage, if a FILIPINO language which wasn't just based on ONE language was made the NATIONAL language and OFFICIAL language, that would be much more fairer to other filipinos who aren't cebuanos or tagalogs, so then it would truly be Filipino. Plus by the way if you weren't cebuano, how would you know if the cebuanos where saying, "oh those tagalogs" in cebuano? And Cebu does accept everyone, if we didn't why would more chinese people live in Cebu, than in Manila? plus i quote from the Cebu article, Foreign ethnic groups includes Koreans, currently estimated to be the biggest group, followed by the Americans, Japanese, British, Germans, Australians, and other smaller groups of Asians and Western Europeans. I KNOW that we can be arrogant, but you have to admit, Tagalogs and Cebuanos are both arrogant. but every ethnic country has it's own tagalogs and Cebuanos. For exmaple in Spain the Castillians and the Catalans and the Basques. Just be thankful that we don't blow up buildings, at least we aren't that arrogant and want independence, becuase we know that the philippines should remin ONE country. Also i am a CEBUANO FROM BOHOL!!! NOT CEBU! CEBUANOS AREN'T ONLY IN CEBU! Australian Jezza 08:34, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Classification

I am reverting the Cebuano classification back to "Austronesian, Malayo-Polynesian, Meso Philippine, Central Philippine, Bisayan, Cebuan", as it is found on ethnologue.com. If anyone disagrees, that is fine, but please cite your sources.

[edit] Why the accents?

Um... i am like cebuano, who speaks like a bit (but i am mestizo) and i can write in cebuano... and so can everyone in my filipino side of my family, and no one we know, wether cebuano or even tagalog uses accents when writing, so why do we add them when they are not nessisary? Because all the sounds of the vowels are the same no matter what word like napulu, you don't need the ú.Australian Jezza 23:01, 30 September 2006 (UTC)
Um..like, um, like'um.... - - The purpose of the accents in Philippine languages is to specify the stressed vowels, the phonology, pronunciation and so on.. It is with accents that you are able to distinguish between 'Hapon' meaning 'Japanese' or 'Japan', and 'Hapon' meaning 'afternoon'..Si lapu lapu (talk) 00:28, 27 May 2008 (UTC)Vlag
Accents in Philippine languages are different from accents in English. In English and other Indo-European languages, accents are stressed syllables. In Philippine languages, accents are lengthened syllables.
HEllo who ever wrote above^^^ i am not stupid i speak cebuano you idiotAustralian Jezza 08:11, 23 October 2006 (UTC)
You'd gain more respect if you spoke with more modesty and restraint.

Who writes these comments without signing?Australian Jezza 01:01, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

You really make your country proud.
Seriously, they do the same with Russian- and Bulgarian-language samples, for educational purposes. In their respective Wikipedias, including that of the Cebuano, no one's forcing the editors to write with the accents. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 210.213.174.51 (talk) 11:16, 3 February 2007 (UTC).
i am Filipino- chinese- anlish, i don't live in the Philippines, i live in australiaAustralian Jezza 08:38, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
I was surprised why there are accents in the words in the article. I am a Cebuano writer and I had never encountered accents in any of the local publications of the language. OTH, if this is used for purely educational purposes, it is fine with me. --210.213.141.12 12:07, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
The comment above is mine. :) --Bentong Isles 12:08, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
Accents are not used in written Cebuano (likewise with Tagalog). They are, however, useful aids for pronunciation for people who do not know the language. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.189.203.191 (talk) 01:37, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] 2 duhá

The latin word for (2 duhá) is duo.--Jondel 05:19, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] espisyal (special)

i believe this word comes from the Castillian (Spanish) word especial, not special. Can anyone provide proof it didn't exist until the American colonization of the Phillipines, if not I don't think this is a great example since there is some contention over which colonizer implanted this word into the Cebuano language. 201.21.96.49 07:32, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

I agree espisyal is more likely to be spanish than english based, becuase of the es- part.Australian Jezza 08:40, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] CFL

I didn't get to explain using the edit summary feature the edit that I made, which had to do mostly with this. Anyway I hope no one minds too much. --Angelo 08:14, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] IPA

Does anyone know the representative IPA for "Cebuano?" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.189.203.191 (talk) 01:42, 6 September 2007 (UTC)