User talk:Cast

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[edit] Welcome to Wikipedia

Welcome!

Hello, Cast, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for adding a caption to the Voltairine de Cleyre image. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you have any questions, check out Wikipedia:Where to ask a question or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome!  Mike Dillon 00:46, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Eros + Massacre

I recently shelled some money to get the long version of this on DVD, but I can't find any English subtitles for it. I don't know if you watched it in the original Japanese, but if not I wonder if you might know where I could find subs? Sarge Baldy 20:28, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

I'm afraid I don't know where to find the movie "Eros + Massacre" in english, and doubt very strongly that it is available at all. I haven't seen the movie in full myself. I've only seen few screen shots and read several reviews. However, I am familar with the actual events of Osugi Sakae's life, and so I was able to construct the entry by cross referincing my knowledge with the aforementioned reviews. Realizing that my knowledge would be iffy, as the movie itself could have improperly portrayed some facts, I left the entry somewhat bare. However, I had neglected to include two important notes. Thanks to this little reminder, I've now added two stubs, "Japanese Films" and "Anarchism," respectively. My hope is that eventually the movie will increase in popularity and eventually be released in english, or that fan producers will take it upon themselves in the grand tradition of direct action and create a fan-sub. Cast, 2 March 2006 (UTC)
That's unfortunate. My hope was that someone would have translated the subtitles already on the disc, as is often done for films with no available subs. Maybe if I can find a way to rip them someone would take the effort. Getting an official release in English seems a bit wishful thinking. If they thought there was any real interest they probably would have included English subs on the Japanese DVD release. Also, if you haven't seen the film, are you sure it focuses around Osugi Sakae? I was under the impression that it was focused more around Ito Noe, as indicated by the cover, the pictures inside the box, and the film's cast listings. Sarge Baldy 16:49, 3 March 2006 (UTC)
In February, 2006, you contacted me regarding subtitles of the Japanese movie, Eros Plus Massacre, asking if I had access to unofficial english subtitles. I have in fact recently found files that serve that purpose, available for download through emule. The files themselves are intended for use with the extended version of the film, and is split into multiple files for use with the film in a ripped version, split into six sections. Assuming you still have your copy of the movie, and are at all interested in translating them, you could rip them to your computer and place these files within the same folder as your videos. They will then automatically play with English subtitles. However, you'll soon note that the sentences are not written with the best of grammar. I bet of effort may be needed to edit these files, and adjust them for your versions of the ripped files. However, I'm sure that as a wiki editor, it's nothing you aren't you used to. If you are interested, I've placed the files here for your convenience: http://www.mediafire.com/?eyymyn2tmmw --Cast 23:38, 9 March 2007 (UTC)
Thanks, though I actually found these earlier. I haven't tried matching them up against my DVD copy yet, though. I doubt I even have enough space to rip it at the moment... Owen 02:13, 21 March 2007 (UTC)
For some reason those files aren't downloading correctly on my computer or on my Grandparents' computer. Does anyone no how to save this properly or how to find this somewhere else. Thanks. User:Colvinis 11:16, 30 June 2007
Please pardon the lateness of this reply. I've tested the site and successfully downloaded the files. Please try once more, and if you continue to have problems, I'll upload them to a different site.--Cast 01:20, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
Sorry for the lateness of my reply to your message, Cast. I still can't seem to download them. If you know where else I can get them, it would be greatly appreciated. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Colvinis (talk • contribs) 17:26, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
I'm not sure of where else you could get them, but I'm prepared to upload them to multiple file sharing sites to see if you can access any of them. Alternatively, I could upload the text entirely onto your talk page, and then you could copy it onto a text file, save it as a .sub and then delete the subsection of your talk page.--Cast (talk) 04:18, 9 December 2007 (UTC)
It would be great if you could add them to my talk page (as long as it isn't any trouble for you). Thanks a lot as it would be greatly appreciated.--Colvinis 6:46, 15 December 2007 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.108.173.185 (talk)

[edit] Wow

I award this Comics Star to User:Cast for his great efforts on the article Anarky.
I award this Comics Star to User:Cast for his great efforts on the article Anarky.

That's impressive work there. Just a few more points. The images need fair use rationales, and they also need shrinking. Copyrighted images shouldn't be any bigger than they would appear in the article. Also, the trivia section needs to be worked into the article somewhere, trivia sections are frowned upon. I think if those happen, a peer review would be a bloody good idea, and then maybe if that goes well take it to featured articles. Steve block Talk 21:57, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

I thank you for your appreciation of my efforts, and for presenting me with my first wiki-award. I've made all of the corrections you noted. All images now have fair use rationals, and have been reduced in size. However, there were panels which held text I felt a reader could benefit from reading, so as to understand the context of the panel. These panels were not fully shrunk. I have also deleted the trivia section (I never knew how to integrate that last note, and to be honest, I never felt it should have been added. I just kept hoping I'd eventually get some citation to validate its inclusion.) Your suggestion that it might be FA worthy seems optimistic, but I only hope that now that these adjustments have been made, nothing stands in the way of the article at least receiving GA status.--Cast 00:56, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
Wow. I've just encountered your work on Anarky and I'm very impressed. This is just what I like to see in a comics article: emphasis on publication history, thorough citations, ulitlization of creator interviews to backup article content. Excellent contribution to Wikipedia. Thank you. ~CS 07:46, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
Thanks and congratulations for all the work you've put in on Anarky - it's great to see another WP:CMC article make GA! --Mrph 20:12, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] List of anarchists.

Greetings, SwitChar. As of a few minutes ago I only just learned of the proposition, debate, subsequent deletion of the Anarchists list, and thought to commend your arguments in its favor, and your creation of a sandbox version. In my opinion, your version is superior in various ways, not the least of which being by far more coherent and organized, and hope that you will eventually be able to use it to recreate the list.

I would also like to add a few to this to help you, but being your project, I hesitate to do so without your permission. I shall simply explain my additions and allow you to consider them. Note that all of them have self identified as anarchists to the best of my knowledge, as I would not wish to repeat the same mistakes which killed the previous list. The first would be John Cage, an avant guard composer (I sadly cannot recall my source, and so I would not add him immediately, but he is known to have written a book comprised of poety inspired by Anarchism, as well as to have composed music intended to be "non-heriarchial" in the sense that there were no dominent instruments/performers;) Grant Morrison, an author who wrote The Invisibles which explored anarchist themes and featured multiple anarchist characters; and Bob Black, an author and lawyer, (I noticed that your list lacked anyone in the "politics and law" section, and while he might be best placed in the authors section, I thought to suggest him. He is also a highly controversial figure, but I do not doubt he is a self-identified anarchist;) and lastly, Shusui Kotoku, Sakae Osugi, and Noe Ito, all three important japanese authors and publishers.

I hope your project continues steadily, that these additions will help along this long process, and that you will eventually be able to restore this list. Until then, you have my thanks for your efforts. --Cast 07:31, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

Thank you. I'm a little worried about the recreation of the list because some admins will delete recreated articles out of process regardless of content difference. If the list is well cited, organised and tidy though, I think there will be less problems with that. As it is, once the sandboxed list is big enough I'll move it to article space and defend it if anyone tries to delete it again.
Any help would be greatly appreciated. It's in my namespace, but it isn't "my" article, so if you have a suggestion or addition, feel free to make it. As I mentioned, I'm not especially worried about finding citations for people known mainly for being anarchists (though it always helps), but people known in other fields who are anarchists need citations as soon as possible. That's part of what got the first list deleted. Ideally, all entries (even Proudhon and Bakunin) should be cited by the time it's moved to article space.
I'll look into the people you mentioned; thanks for bringing them up. I hadn't heard of some of them before. I did briefly look into Morrison a while ago, but only to the extent of seeing if there was already a citation in his Wikipedia article, which there wasn't at the time. There's also someone whose name I can't remember; he was a filmmaker who deals mostly with LGBTQ issues in his work and identifies as an anarchist. Know of him at all?
There's also a copy of most of the original list in the talk of the sandboxed version, so anyone can try to go through that and add any missing entries.
I'm also not yet sure whether I want to add musicians to the list, because there is currently a list of anarchist musicians. I think eventually I'll try to organise it into musicians who are also anarchists (Like Lemmy or John Lydon) having a section in the List of anarchists, and bands or musicians who are anarchist in their music (Like Crass, Emcee Lynx etc.) having an article of their own, something approximating list of musicians with anarchist lyrical content. For the time being though, I'll leave out musicians and add them all to the list of anarchist musicians.
Anyway, thanks very much. Feel free to contact me about it or contribute any time. Cheers. ~ Switch (✉✍☺) 10:04, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
(PS - I see it was you who improved the Anarky article so much. Very good job. ~ Switch (✉✍☺) 10:04, 27 March 2007 (UTC))
I am also of the mind that a recreated list, should it be a large improvement over a deleted original, should be preserved. I feel that your list qualifies for this in several respects. Once this project has neared completion, I suggest contacting other editors who would be interested in preserving it and asking them to argue in its favor should problems arise.
I am also glad that you are not possessive of the article, but I would still defer to your opinion, as you clearly have an idea of what direction you wish to take the process in, and I respect that. I will however continue to make sourced suggestions in the future and hope it will prove fruitful. Unfortunately, I cannot help you with your first request, as I am utterly unfamiliar with most film makers, but should I hear of one which matches your description, I'll alert you immediately. I'll also take note of your recovered list and make use of it in my future suggestions. For ease of use, I would advise striking out any from that list once they have been sourced and added to the sandboxed version. This will become increasingly important as the project progresses.
I can see your point regarding musicians, and would suggest a compromise: the include a subsection listed as Musicians, which would provide a link redirecting the reader to the main article, the list of anarchist musicians. This will make searching for such people more user friendly. I would also suggest the inclusion of a Military subsection, for anarchists who are well known for their work during militant anarchist uprisings, such as Nestor Makhno, Buenaventura Durruti, Francisco Sabaté Llopart, and Kim Jwa-jin
At any rate, I'll make an effort to aid you in the future as best I can, though this cannot be my top priority (I am currently making an effort to improve Osugi's article,) and will certainly encourage the preservation of this list once it is properly uploaded.
And finally, thank you for noting my efforts on the Anarky article. What can I say? Anything for a fictional comrade! --Cast 18:02, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
(PS - I only just noticed that your list does include a link to the list of anarchist musicians, and so I retract my suggestion that it be included. --Cast 18:32, 27 March 2007 (UTC))

Hey, SwitChar. I'm sure you've noticed that I've been editing the List of Anarchists. I was just doing a little more editing to it today when I thought to suggest a new section for Former Anarchists, as there are two of people in the list of self-identified anarchists who later declared themselves to have retired, given up, or moved on from the anarchic cause. These include Kanson Arahata and Murray Bookchin. At the moment they are the only ones on the list I know to have stopped being anarchists, but it could come up more as the list grows in the future.--Cast 00:50, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Anarchism in Cuba

Hey, so I figured since I keep seeing your activity around, I may as well invite you to contribute whatever you can to this article. I've started it in my sandbox, and could use any advice towards improvement or whatever. In particular, making paragraphs flow into each other a little better, at the moment it feels like a big glorified timeline. Cheers! Murderbike 19:37, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

Hey, I couldn't figure out what the original source for that drawing of Roig San Martin is. Do you know? Murderbike 06:57, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
In response to your question, I do not know the source illustrator of the image, but I am aware that it is based upon this image of Enrique himself. A source or date for that photograph, however, is beyond my grasp.
Further, I thank you for inviting me to take part in the creation of an article detailing the history of Cuban anarchism. I've been holding on to this particular image with a similar intention myself. I had first planned on completing the article on Sakae Osugi, before creating an article on Anarchism in Japan, before tackling a Cuban article. I do wish this project the best of luck.--Cast 07:18, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
Well, the photo would have to be at least fair-use (historical figure), and maybe even PD, since he died in, uh, I think 1889, so the photo would have to be at least that old. Wow, Anarchism in Japan will be an interesting one. Is there much in the way of English sources for that? Anyway, I appreciate anything you can contribute. Oh yeah, It was you that added the note about Blackbird RAUM in the Raum article, right? Do you know them? Cheers! Murderbike 07:27, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
There are actually more english language sources on Japanese anarchism than you might at first suppose. Japan had a very vibrant anarchist movement at one point in history, with international ties to western, Korean, and Chinese anarchists. At one point, January was a memorial period as important as May Day amongst anarchists, due to the execution of japanese anarchists following the High Treason Incident. However, anarchists were crushed by brutal repression in Japan in the years just before WWII, and have still not yet recovered fully. There is a modern anarchist movement which is now slowly growing, due in part to the obsolescence of leftist alternatives, and with the aid of networking through the internet. English sources for early 20th century texts and post WWII incidents are also available through the Kate Sharply Library, which has several pamphlets available on the subject. Further, there is an english language biography of Sakae Osugi in print, and which I have in my current possession. It details a great deal of the events surrounding Osugi's life, and is also a valuable resource for information on Noe Ito. Japanese anarchist websites are also of use. Three of interest include Cira Japana, a japanese equivalent to the KSL; and Anarchy in Nippon, which provides an excellent timeline for anarchism in japan (although it is in need of an update); and perhaps of very rare importance is this image gallery, which contains pictures of items owned by famous anarchists, including the first japanese anarchist himself, Shūsui Kōtoku. With these sources, I hope to put together a fair article on the subject matter.
As for Blackbird ROUM, I was not the anonymous poster who first placed their information on the Roum article, but I did wikify it I am aware of the band, and know that their CD is presently available online, through Quiver Distro or Little Black Cart.--Cast 08:32, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

Wow, that's great. I'm kinda surprised I hadn't heard more about it. Western education, ugh. As to Raum, I just asked 'cause the band I play in is going on tour with them (again) this fall. Good friends, it was funny to see them get mentioned. Anyway, good luck on that article, I'm excited to see the finished product. Cheers! Murderbike 17:20, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Sherman Austin

Hey, if you're not too busy, would you want to keep an eye on this article? There's been some slightly contentious editing going on. Cheers! Murderbike 07:05, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Anarchism; template and category

RE:Labadie Collection, just wondering about the rationale you're using to include/remove Template:Anarchism and Category:Anarchism – shouldn't both go together? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Skomorokh (talk • contribs) 13:58, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Please allow me to explain my reasoning. The Anarchism template includes a number of subsections, the most pertinent to this article being History of Anarchism, as this article describes a collection of historic anarchist texts. However, the Anarchism category is not specific to this article. More appropriate would be the History of anarchism category, a subsection of the Anarchism category. This same rational would remove Emma Goldman from the Anarchism category (she is located under the Anarchists category subsection) but keep the Anarchism template located within the article pertaining to her (she is significant to anarchist Schools of thought, Theory and practice, and History.)
I hope this explanation is sufficient.--Cast 16:07, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
So, the template should go on all pages related to anarchism, whereas Category:Anarchism should be removed in favour of subcategories wherever possible? Skomorokh incite 16:12, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
This is my estimation, yes. But if you have an alternative that may serve better, I'd be more than happy to hear it out and implement it.--Cast 19:05, 9 November 2007 (UTC)
Would you mind looking at this recent comment on my talkpage re:anarchism template and category? I'm afraid I don't quite know what the fellow is getting at. Thanks again, Skomorokh incite 00:40, 14 November 2007 (UTC)


Need your help. Any idea how we can make text to wrap around both Template:Anarchism and Template:Forms of government on Anarchy page? As a side note: I have included Category:Anarchism on Template:Anarchism but now think it was a wrong move since category has many more sub-categories, and some articles where template is present may better fit into respective sub-category than just generic Category:Anarchism. Maksdo 22:25, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

I'm afraid I don't quite understand your initial question; is it that you want Template:Forms of government to automatically hide its contents like Template:Anarchism? Or rather that both templates have text that overlaps their boundaries? In either case, and with the template/category questions, User:Cast is the most knowledgeable and experienced Wikipedian; I'll direct your question to them and see if we can sort this out. Regards, Skomorokh incite 00:38, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
...how to make article text to wrap around both templates (it has nothing to do with any text inside of templates). When I use IE 6.0+ there is a gap between "For other uses..." and the intro blurb. Text "Anarchy (from Greek: ἀναρχία anarchía, "without ruler") may refer to any of the following..." doesn't wrap around Template:Anarchism at all. Text wraps just fine in Firefox. Maksdo 03:13, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
I'd hardly consider myself an experienced wikipedian, but being the user who reverse engineered the Scientology template (which doesn't seem to exist any more) to create the Anarchism template, I'll accept the description on this occasion.
I have checked the Anarchy page on both FireFox and Internet Explorer, and found the problem you're referring to. After a bit of experimentation, I found that the bug takes place if two templates, any two, are included above the first subsection. Placing either Anarchism or Forms of Government in the intro alone causes no problems. Placing them both together in any order causes that gap. However, by placing one under the first subsection title, Anarchy after state collapse, fixes the bug. I've taken the initiative to do so. I'm afraid I don't know how to fix the problem completely, as it seems to be a script error I cannot correct.
As regards Template:Anarchism and Category:Anarchism, I can see where you added the category, but it doesn't seem to effect the template page -- or the template itself -- in anyway. Perhaps you haven't formatted it as you intended? That said, I don't think the template goes in the Anarchism category itself. I think, if anything, the Template should be included in an Anarchism Task Force page, which has not been created.
I've been thinking about assembling such a group, as there seems to be a fair number of wikipediens such as ourselves who are interested in maintaining Anarchist related wiki content. But then, I remember that would require organization, and we all know "organized anarchist" is a contradiction in terms, am I right or am I right?--Cast 03:47, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
It goes without saying; that would be order, when of course anarchy means chaos. Sign me up! Skomorokh incite 11:34, 14 November 2007 (UTC)


[edit] Congratulations - Anarchism in Cuba

Congratulations to you, and those who assisted, for your work on Anarchism in Cuba. The article has turned out rather wonderfully, and is a great addition to the general collection of anarchist related wiki articles. Do you think you will be moving on to any new wiki-projects, or will you be taking a break for the time being?--Cast (talk) 15:37, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! for the kudoes! It was a long time coming, and I'm glad to be done with it. But also excited about finding something else to work on, though I've always got little things I'm working on (lot of photography lately), or planning on starting. How is Anarchism in Japan coming along? Oh, and to the discussion above, I believe that it is ALWAYS preferable to use subcategories when possible. This way, something is automatically in Category:Anarchism if they are put in Category:Anarchists and whatnot, Category:Rivers in Washington instead of Category:Rivers, etc. Murderbike (talk) 01:48, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
The Anarchism in Japan article is coming along slowly. I have created the bare foundations for it within my sandbox, which can be accessed here. Feel free to contribute to it at will. I would prefer to first complete the Sakae Osugi and improve the Noe Ito articles first, but that is merely because I will not always have access to information on them, and must take advantage of what I do have right away.--Cast (talk) 04:24, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] anarcho-project

Hey, so Skomorokh mentioned y'all talking about trying to get some sort of thing together to organize the interested-in-anarchy folks around here. I know there used to be a WikiProject Anarchism, but it died before I came around. I was thinking that if nobody had the time/energy to do a whole new project, we could just create an anarchism task force at WikiProject Philosophy, much like the commies have done here. What do ya think? Murderbike (talk) 02:06, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

That would be correct, I am indeed interested in creating a small organization for editors interested in organizing anarchist related wiki-articles. To be entirely accurate, a Task Force was my exact suggestion, having already noticed the creation of the Marxism task force. Below is an extract of the recovered conversation.

...I think, if anything, the Template should be included in an Anarchism Task Force page, which has not been created.
I've been thinking about assembling such a group, as there seems to be a fair number of wikipediens such as ourselves who are interested in maintaining Anarchist related wiki content. But then, I remember that would require organization, and we all know "organized anarchist" is a contradiction in terms, am I right or am I right?--Cast 03:47, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

It goes without saying; that would be order, when of course anarchy means chaos. Sign me up! Skomorokh 11:34, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

I've briefly researched the requirements for creating a Task-force, but have found myself with little time to prepare the foundation for it immediately. Perhaps you ought to follow through on your initiative. I would be prepared to join such a group.--Cast (talk) 04:22, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
Awesome. I moved the Marxism Task Force page to my sandbox, and started replacing all the marxist stuff with anarchist stuff. Now I'm gonna make a userbox, and check in with the philosophy project to make sure there's no weird hoops (bureacracy, ahhhh!!!!) we have to jump through to make it official. I'll let ya know when it's all sorted out. I'll be busy all weekend though, so I may not get much done after tonight, until monday or tuesday. Cheers! Murderbike (talk) 04:28, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
I can understand your anxieties concerning The Bureaucracy. This was the exact reason why I had to stop my initial foray into the task force creation process.
I'll contribute as much as I can to this process, within reason. I've already provided several userboxes, back-engineered from the Marxism box. I naturally chose symbols over a portrait of a Vaunted Anarchist Leader. Of course, we love our fallen comrades, but they'd blush to think we'd put them at the head of such a project. Each user box has a symbol taken from the Anarchist symbolism page, and one is in black, just to provide an examples of potential options. And of course, we should not neglect the possibilities offered within this collection of images.--Cast (talk) 05:11, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
Yeah, ye headed me off at the pass! I'm definitely partial to the black box, but not picky. Choices are what makes capitalism great, right? For some reason, the one box is sitting in a weird place on my screen, and I couldn't figure out how to make it drop down. It's the fourth one in there, and I was trying to make it so there would be two rows of three, but it wouldn't do anything. Alas. Murderbike (talk) 05:45, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
It's now taken care of. Hope it's pleasing to you. Of course, I would not expect that we will keep all of these as options; perhaps we might want to whittle it down to just one or two. But you know anarchists. Each one just insists on being an individual. It's crazy.--Cast (talk) 05:50, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
Splendid work, chaps. I'll just sit here by the pool mixing Margarita's; let me know when the work's done! Skomorokh incite 09:52, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Emma Goldman changes

Hello there. Thanks for your attention to Emma Goldman, which I'm rewriting to bring to FA status. I reverted the inclusion of "Suddenly" to the blockquote about her first public speaking experiences, since it's not part of the original text. I would also like to undo the change you made to the position of the image of her gravestone; the extra space currently between the end of "Death" and the beginning of "Philosophy" looks rather unsightly to me. I hope this is an agreeable reversion? (I didn't want to make it on my own without discussing it, since – unlike the quote – it's a matter of preference.) Cheers. – Scartol • Tok 16:34, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

I've now corrected these matters myself. When a sentence is quoted, but does not make sense out of context, words can be substituted or included, but must be placed in parenthesis. When a sentence is abbreviated, be certain to use three period points to note the cut words. I've substituted the word "Suddenly" with the abbreviation note. No further addition is necessary, as the text is understandable out of context. Alternatively, it could have been written as:
(Suddenly,) something strange happened....
Again, this addition was unnecessary. Abbreviation will be enough.
As for the space added to the end of the Death sub-section: I made this addition because the image of Goldman's grave was conflicting with the Anarchism template, causing bleeding in words in the Anarchism sub-section. As the template has been lowered, this problem is resolved and the space can be removed. I have resolved this myself.
I thank you for your consideration and hope you will have ease in future improvements to the article.--Cast (talk) 19:50, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Anarchism in Japan

Hey, so I randomly found a book at the library called "The Japanese Communist Movement: 1920-1966", and it's got a bit of stuff about anarchists in it. Do you have it? If not, I was gonna transcribe all the little sections mentioning anarchists, to have available for this article when it gets rolling. Interested? Murderbike (talk) 01:02, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

Most definitely! Please do this at your pace, as I will not likely have anything written immediately. And of course, when I do, there will still be ample time to rewrite as many drafts as are necessary.--Cast (talk) 02:16, 21 December 2007 (UTC)
Cool, I'll type some of it up tonight, some more tomorrow. I'll put it on the talk page of your sandbox if that's cool with you. Murderbike (talk) 02:24, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] After lengthy debates on Talk:Anarchism

I'm not sure if you were around for the debates, Cast, but for most of last year the main point of contention on the Anarchism page was the relationship between anarcho-capitalism and the (rest of the) anarchist movement. RJII — and his various socks — regularly contended the point that most anarchists (or something similar, the exact phrasing was very often controversial) are anti-capitalists, whether social anarchists or mutualists. It was one of these accounts that first introduced the citation from the Oxford Companion to Philosophy. After borrowing the book from a friend a few months ago, I noticed that it contained itself the assertion that most anarchists reject capitalism. Given that these were the accounts that alleged "intellectual dishonesty", I'm advising a heads-up from any more socks. I've included the citation in the article, but I'll also be raising it on the talkpage. Now that the vast majority of active anarcho-capitalist editors are reasonable and mostly NPOV, and the anti-partisan consensus has been established, the importance of the issue should diminish greatly. If not, this is just a warning of what may be to come. ~ Switch (✉✍☺☒) 12:37, 27 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] List of @ musicians

Hey, just wondering if the dispersal of band members is because of the concern about the title of the article, or it being easier to cite individuals, or some other reason I can't think of. Good job either way, gotta keep violet/riga at bay, eh? Murderbike (talk) 07:16, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

The dispersement is useful for both of the reasons you point out, but also because individual members of "anarchist" bands may not be anarchists, but merely sympathizers, or close friends of actual anarchist band members who just needed to fill out a space for a few months between gigs. Also, listing individual musicians gives an opportunity to give more information on each, by providing information on the instruments they use (they may play instruments other than those used in a particular band); the music styles they performed (as individual members may experiment independently of their band mates); and which bands they performed in (bands come and go, but anarchists are eternal... unless they're traitors.) All of this makes the list a viable and useful tool for researchers interested in finding out more about anarchist musicians of any stripe.
Further, not all members of a band may be musicians. For example, Crass has two "members" who's activity was mostly supplementary in nature. One was a film producer who made tapes of band performances; another was an artist who primarily created album art for the band (although she occasionally played the piano.) The film producer was not included in the list, though the pianist was primarily recognized for that contribution.
As for violet/riga... it's hard to not believe at this point that this person isn't just trolling. I mean, this administrator was very punctual about this deadline. I still don't buy into accusations of "systematic deletion" of anarchist articles, but this is silly. There are other articles that we're trying to give our attention to as well. We can't be expected to drop our lives just so we can clean up a list on the spot, or see it nominated for deletion. At a certain point, if Violet wants to see the article improved so badly, violet should just take care of it on his (her?) own. --Cast (talk) 07:34, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
Is there a two month break between deletion nominations or something? And agreed on everything else, well done! Oh yeah, know anybody handy with photoshop that wants to make an anarchist barnstar, the three folks that did the majority of the work on promoting Emma Goldman to FA would be good to get one. Murderbike (talk) 07:42, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
There isn't always a two month deadline set after AfD nominations. This was a special case, which took place off the AfD discussion. In the Deletion Review, there was a second discussion held by just a few editors.

The following is an archived debate of the deletion review of the article above. Please do not modify it.

While I accept that there is certainly no consensus for deletion here I do feel that the keep voters haven't provided a decent opposition to the arguments for deletion. The key points are:
1. There is no reason why this can't be a category and it would be easier to maintain if it were
2. The title implies musicians and not bands - it mostly consists of the latter
3. There are very few sources for most and this could be a BLP concern
4. Despite suggestions of sorting out inclusion criteria and looking into a categorisation system other than alphabetical nothing has progressed during the nomination.

The arguments for keep seem to comprise:

1. "I'd rather fix the problems", "Afd is not cleanup"
2. Claims of a "systematic attack on anarchist"
3. "This list may be improved" (emphasis mine)

I believe that a category would be better than a list and that the main arguments for keeping the article ignore that suggestion. violet/riga (t) 18:45, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

* Endorse - No consensus seemed to be the consensus. If things haven't improved in two months as promised in the AfD, list it for deletion again with focus on purpose of lists, the lack of criteria for inclusion and the failure to adhere to that criteria, and Non-encyclopedic cross-categorizations. -- Jreferee t/c 18:59, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
 * As the closer of the AFD, I don't see where the problem is - in my opinion, although a category would be a good option, there were few supporting it in the AFD explicitly (say two others). GDonato (talk) 19:29, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
* Endorse closure. The arguments weren't the strongest, but neither was there consensus to delete, so that defaults to keep (this is a feature, not a bug, despite a number of recent DRVs that have been essentially second-chance AFDs). I will take you up on the category question. A category should represent an inherent quality of a topic. I'm not sure that the political stance of a musician/band at a given point fits that ideal. Also, a list can be fully documented and structured, whereas a category cannot. Categories are too easy to add to an article without adding real support and bands are a really good example of where this is frequently abused. --Dhartung Talk 19:59, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

– Wikipedia:Deletion review/Log/2007 November 3, (emphasis added)

I read this when it was first decided, and which is why I made this particular post in the anarchist musicians talk page. You can literally see that this was the point when the Anarchist Task Force was conceived, even if it would take several weeks and your participation to see it born. I was already aware of the Marxism Task Force, but reading this deletion review discussion take place while we weren't looking just cemented the sense that we had to have a space to communicate with each other and organize our efforts.
As for photoshop; well, I am myself a little skilled with it, which is why I created the Anarchik Star. But as I am still unable to properly translate Roberto Ambrosoli's comments on the character, I can't tell if his comment about Anarchik not being copyrighted is correct (he seems to imply that he has not copyrighted the character, but placed the copyright symbol on it to discourage use he did not approve of; use by other anarchists should be okay). I'm feeling very confident about that translation, so I would be prepared to gamble and upload the Star, but I know that won't hold up before scrutiny. I suggest asking Switchair, as he seems to be experienced in creating .svg files for articles.
But if you'd happen to know some way we could get an Italian translation of a website, we could potentially get that Anarchik Star set up very fast.--Cast (talk) 08:13, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
Man, that's the first time I looked at the star, it's hilarious. I wonder, if copyright can't be determined, some other image of a "bomb" thrower would be just as funny. As to the creepy sideline discussion, that's really dissappointing that that would go on behind the scenes, but I suppose it makes sense. Well, more reason to jump on making the list less deleteable, though at this point, even though it obviously still needs help, feels fairly beyond all the presented arguments. Murderbike (talk) 08:26, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Anarky

I would like to nominate the article for featured status, but as you are the main contributor I wanted to ask if you would be able to help get the article through? I don't have the knowledge regarding the character that you do, nor access to all the sources used. Hiding T 14:47, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

I would certainly like to see Anarky achieve Featured Article status, and have been trying to build upon the article since it achieved Good Article status for just this reason. However, I have been unable to secure a peer review, which I understand to be an optional -- but important -- process prior to nominating the article for FA status. This was back in February of 2007, and I am growing quite weary of waiting. I have, in recent days, decided to contact other editors to specifically request that they peer review the article so that I may continue the process. Perhaps you would be able to do so. As this is not mandatory, you may begin the FA nomination process, but I cannot be certain it will be promoted successfully. Regardless, I will monitor the nomination process and assist you as best I can.--Cast (talk) 19:38, 10 January 2008 (UTC)
Hey, if you don't get any response from this, User:VanTucky has been very good about responding to requests of this type. Murderbike (talk) 08:13, 13 January 2008 (UTC)
I'll tap a couple of people to offer a review. Hiding T 23:57, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Edit Summaries

A request: could you add edit summaries when you make updates? With all the changes in List of fictional anarchists, for example, it was tough to see what you were up to. (John User:Jwy talk) 23:59, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

I just saw you discussed it on the Talk page, thank you. But that article changes appeared first. (John User:Jwy talk) 00:05, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Barnstar

The Original Barnstar
For your thorough research into article background, sourcing, checking, copy editing and coordination which brought Haymarket affair to WP:GA. Thank you. Gwen Gale (talk) 22:42, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

Thank you

Thanks for the barnstar. We couldn't have brought the article to GA without all the hard work you've put into it over the past few years. — Malik Shabazz (talk · contribs) 03:30, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

You're so welcome and thanks for the kind words :) Gwen Gale (talk) 20:28, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

I also thank you for your thoughtfulness, but would humbly stress that I was not nearly as significant to the development of the article as Malik, or yourself. Still, I accept your appreciation for what I did contribute, and hope to work with you further in the future. If you are at all interested in contributing to other articles of significance to the philosophy of anarchy, please feel free to join the Anarchist Task Force. We'd be happy to welcome you.--Cast (talk) 06:44, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

You're very welcome! The quantity of your edits wasn't high but their helpfulness was overwhelming, both on the talk page and in the article. Gwen Gale (talk) 20:28, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Template collapse

Yo, any idea why this edit didn't seem to change {{Anarchism2}}'s state? I can't figure out how to expand templates whose default state is collapse. Skomorokh confer 03:19, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

Well, that comes as a surprise to me. I've now tried to edit it to, and it isn't working out. Must be something specific to the html code of the template. We can remove the notice from the template page if it isn't working.--Cast (talk) 04:06, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Basic topic lists

I noticed the great job you did on List of basic anarchism topics. On behalf of Wikipedia, thank you!

I was wondering if you'd be interested in working on one (or all) of the following lists:

For a complete list of basic lists that we're working on, see Wikipedia:WikiProject Lists of basic topics. Most are not far enough along to present on Lists of basic topics. Any help you could provide to get these lists up to par would be great.

If you find the overall set of basic topic lists interesting, or you understand their importance for navigating Wikipedia (and making general knowledge more easily accessible to everybody), you may want to add yourself to the participant list at the WikiProject mentioned above.

Hope to see you there.

The Transhumanist 08:15, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for the invitation, but I'm afraid my commitment to the Anarchist Task Force leaves me with little time to give earnest attention to unrelated projects. Best of luck with the collection of Basic Topics lists. If I ever happen to have some knowledge of a given subject, and a bit of time on my hand, I'll make minor additions, but nothing as substantiative as was my effort for the Basic list of Anarchism topics. --Cast (talk) 01:49, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
You did an excellent job on that one. I thought atheism might be close enough to entice you to do another.  :) The Transhumanist 01:58, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
I'll grant that a list of basic atheism topics, as a philosophy, may seem similar in structure to a list of basic Anarchism topics. However, atheism is not a topic I have any experience with; quite the opposite for anarchy, which is why I was able to produce that article so easily. Again, if I should happen to have information on hand for use in a basic topics list, I'll contribute to it. I can make no commitment beyond that. Again, best of luck.--Cast (talk) 05:26, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
Interesting. Well, happy editing. The Transhumanist 05:28, 7 February 2008 (UTC)\

[edit] Harry Kelly

Hi Cast, I noticed you made a cut and past move today and turned Harry Kelly into a disambiguation page. I have no concerns about the title of the two pages, but please note that a cut and paste move causes GFDL violation; no worries, I know it's not your intention, just please take care to remember to use the "move" tab in the future (it's easier and quicker as you can move the article along with the talk page! ;)) In cases when the target page already exists, you can still avoid a cut&paste move by asking an admin to delete it for you. :) Happy editing, --PeaceNT (talk) 12:10, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

Oh, right, I forgot all about the Move tab in my haste. Thanks for the reminder.--Cast (talk) 15:41, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Anarchism cats

Yo, what have you got in mind with the Anarchism categories? скоморохъ 02:23, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

I assume you are referring to two categories I have recently nominated for speedy deletion. I have made no recent alterations to any other anarchism-related categories. I am merely completing the refining of the Anarchism by region category I began editing several weeks ago, and had delayed the deletion in accordance with wiki-policy.--Cast (talk) 03:22, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
Do you want to deprecate Cat:Anarchist movements by country with Cat:Anarchism by region? Did you depopulate Cat:Anarchism in Greece or was that something else? I understand that you're following the correct process, just wondering about your rationale. скоморохъ 03:31, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
I have no intention of making any further alterations to the category of Anarchism by region, or of any of its subcategories. Anarchism by country serves as the properly wikified categorization, and is part of a larger series of categories ... by country. It neatly fits within Anarchism by region, as anarchist projects have a tradition of operating outside or despite of national boundaries; which I am sure you are well familiar with. And I did depopulate the Anarchism in Greece category, as it seemed unnecessary and overly categorized.--Cast (talk) 03:37, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
Cool, sounds reasonable to me. скоморохъ 03:46, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
And on an unrelated note, have you any idea of what the relationship between the new Anarchist Manifesto book and the original pamphlet is? I haven't been able to find the name of the original publication or anything much at all about it. Thanks, скоморохъ 02:29, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
I presently possess the manifesto pamphlet produced by the Kate Sharpley Library. It is an original translation, copyrighted by the organization, and as such I am unable to upload it to wikicommons (they require fair use, original translations, or translations for which copyright has expired.) The Kate Sharpley Library has a policy of allowing free reproduction of material by activists for use in articles, pamphlets, or books, but with request. I will need to contact their organization to confirm the use of their full material in this situation. I may, in the process, also inquire as to what is the nature of their translation, and any information they can provide in the process of its production. Thought it will consist of original research, it needn't be included in the article itself. It may simply be used to confirm original features of the manifesto.--Cast (talk) 03:22, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
I see, thanks. If you could get any information from them it would be of great help; I only created the article out of ignorance to avoid the sight of a redlink of a major manifesto on your exceptional list of basic anarchism topics. Original research is not so much a problem when it is uncontested; if it were, every clause in every sentence in every article would have to have an inline citation after it. Anyway, thanks very much for your efforts. скоморохъ 03:31, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Thanks

Thanks for doing the Wikiprojects for Anarchism in Vietnam for me, as well as assessing and rating them. When the article includes everything that I intend to add, I'll ask for a re-rate. Hazillow (talk) 07:59, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Quick Question

When I'm rating the importance of anarchy-related articles, I should be assessing them based on their importance within philosophy, and not anarchism? Hazillow (talk) 08:30, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

This exact question has come up in the Anarchist task force talk page. The discussion, Importance rating ambiguity, went nowhere. I personally feel that the project template is in regards to Philosophy as a whole, and so I rate articles as such. The result is that many anarchist related articles receive low ratings from me, but this is not to imply that the subject of the article or list is unimportant. If it were, it would fail wikipedia's notability requirement, and so wouldn't be available at all. So long as the article confers useful information, I feel they may be of high importance to someone, somewhere. That's good enough for me. If you would like to push the matter further, I invite you to continue the discussion in the talk page, perhaps insisting that we come to some kind of decision this time. Again, this is entirely optional.--Cast (talk) 08:55, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
I too have been assessing them based on their importance to general philosophy. It seems to me that since the Anarchism Task Force is part of the WikiProject:Philosophy, they should be based on philosophy. If anarchism had its own WikiProject (or there was a sub-rating system, i.e. low importance in general philosophy, high importance in anarchism, etc.) things would be much more clear. I'll throw my two cents in to that discussion, because it seems pretty counter productive to have some editors rate on completely different criteria than others. Thanks. Hazillow (talk) —Preceding comment was added at 09:08, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
New discussion can be found here: Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Philosophy/Anarchism#Importance_rating_ambiguity_revisited Hazillow (talk) 09:34, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Anarky FA

Back in January you informed me that you wished to nominate Anarky for FA status. I've nearly completed the article to my preference. I should like to replace the anarchism navigational box with one more specific to anarchist fiction, but I realize several topics that should be contained within it are not currently in existence, and the current state of anarchist media articles is disorganized. The creation of such a navbox must wait for a future point. Until then, we may consider the Anarky article as complete as I am capable of making it. I invite you to nominate the article for Featured Article status, if you have no further reason to wait.--Cast (talk) 19:32, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

I'm not here much lately, so you are probably best taking it to FA yourself. If you don't feel confident in that, have a word with User:WesleyDodds, he has experience with the FA procedure and knows a bit about comics too. Hiding T 11:10, 7 March 2008 (UTC)
That won't be necessary. I've updated the article as best I can and have now nominated it. If you're not too busy, please do comment.--Cast (talk) 09:02, 9 March 2008 (UTC)
Wow, good job man, congrats all around. Murderbike (talk) 01:55, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Collapsable sections

Hi! You have done considerable work on the {{anarchism}}. There has been considerable discussion on the issue of the collapsable sections of templates like that one. I created a centralized place for discussion about this issue here. I hope you can bring your views to the discussion. - C mon (talk) 18:38, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Gandhi

Hi. I saw your post on the Mahatma Gandhi talk page and posted what I feel is a response. I hope that clarifies adding Gandhi to the category of anarchists.--Shahab (talk) 09:08, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for your response. I hope that you please forgive the tardiness of my response. As you may judge from the length of it, I was not always up to writing it in a single go. Upon re-reading the response, I feel that I may have presented my views in an overly harsh fashion. I hope that you will not take them in as a negative reproach of your views. I have been informed that my officious, and perhaps "prim" fashion of writing is at times off-putting.--Cast (talk) 06:40, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] LeGuin

Sorry about that, hangovers make for lazy reading. Incidentally, do you and Switch have any plans of re-introducing the list to the article namespace in the near future? It would surely survive an Afd. скоморохъ 17:58, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

Switch said he'd put it back out when the list was fully completed. I soon helped out, but we fell behind rather quickly. If we'd updated a name a day, we'd be done by now, but you can understand that such a pace was unreasonable. I would like to reintroduce photos, ala the list of atheists Switch based this list on. The photos would be based on just a few photos to each field, prioritizing two or three of the more notable figures. After that, I say we could take it live. If you'd like to push it ahead now, talk to Switch. I've always deferred to his judgement, as he started the project.--Cast (talk) 18:22, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Thanks!!!

For doing all that anniversary migrating, what a pain. I'm gonna try to get May all filled in in the next week or so, but after that I'll be done for awhile, so if you feel like picking up June or more, feel free. Cheers, Murderbike (talk) 18:57, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Henry Ford the anarchist

So, I'm sure we know he was a fascist, but in doing stuff for the portal calendar, I came across a thing talking about how he sued the Chicago Times for calling him an anarchist. Ya think it's worth putting him in the Business section of the people considered anarchists section of the list? Murderbike (talk) 03:09, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Well, sure. The whole point of that section is that it recognizes some of the more controversial individuals referred to as anarchist. Some of them will be more controversial than others. Add him. He denies it anyway.--Cast (talk) 03:16, 24 March 2008 (UTC)
Cool, I'll find a better source for it. Murderbike (talk) 03:18, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Anarky

Congratulations on getting Anarky promoted to FA status. I noted that you said you will no longer be maintaining the article - any reason for that? Does that mean you won't be watching it for vandalism or counter-productive changes? Many articles degrade after reaching FA status, and I'd hate to see that happen. I will try to keep an eye on it if you don't care to. --Laser brain (talk) 03:42, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

After having worked on the article for nearly two years, I am interested in shifting my attentions to other articles. To that end, I'd thought to cut all ties to the Anarky article. However, you are right to remind me that articles must be maintained. I will continue to watch the article in the future, though I will not likely make edits until new information surfaces. That isn't very likely, given the character's absence.--Cast (talk) 05:02, 31 March 2008 (UTC)
Ha, I understand. After my last FA got promoted, I barely want to look at it again. No worries, I have it on my watchlist. It's not a heavily trafficked article so it shouldn't be hard to keep an eye on. --Laser brain (talk) 05:08, 31 March 2008 (UTC)
  • Congratulations. You've worked hard on that article and I'm glad it was recognised and rewarded. Hiding T 08:36, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Ready for lift-off

Reply at my talkpage. I am ready to appall the overlords with my horrible, messy coding skillz. Skomorokh 04:12, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] TfD nomination of Template:AnarchismTF

Template:AnarchismTF has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for Deletion page. Thank you. — Corvus cornixtalk 21:55, 22 April 2008 (UTC)