Talk:Caste system in Kerala

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Contents 1 Aryan/Dravidian 2 Merging 3 No. That article to be merged with this 4 The one who edited the article before I did today 5 Topics of debate 5.1 Position of Ambalavasis 5.2 Covering upper part of body 5.3 Four fold Varna system 5.3.1 Kshatriyas 5.3.2 Veenu Nairs 5.4 Sambandams 6 61.1.233.246 ... reverted without any discussion 7 Article to be deleted 8 Caste in Kerala

[edit] Aryan/Dravidian

I deleted the following para as it didn't make much sense.

Kerala was initially a Dravidian country and Aryanaisation started here only in the 7th or 8th century AD. Initially the Aryans found Kerala uninhabitable and so went away. Later by the above mentioned time, a much smaller group entered Kerala, which was under the rule of the Chera (Nair) emperors. The people of Kerala, which was a flourishing centre for Buddhism and Jainism, converted to Hinduism and the slow and subtle Aryanisation of Kerala started.

Few points that I found illogical; 1. I wonder what the author wants to say with those words. It looks like Kerala was Buddhist/Jain before it became "Aryanized". As far as I know, even Buddhim and Jainism are also "Aryan" religions in the sense both these religions also spread by Indo-Aryan speaking people in South India. Therefore, Kerala was Aryanized long before other Aryans bringing Vedic culture migrated to Kerala. Anyway, I suppose since Kerala still is a pure Dravidian speaking area, I feel Aryan here means merely culture of North India. 2. The term Nair is not very clear here. Does it mean just a title or a caste identity? Considering, Nair, a caste identity is stupidity as caste system in Kerala was much a later phenomenon. Title makes sense. However, did Chera kings have "Nair" as titles?

Manjunatha (14 Aug 2006)

Incidentally Buddhism and Jainism were anti aryan....i had a sociology student tell me that buddha and mahavir were actually the revolutionaries who attacked hinduism when it was at the peak of its power manu

Both were anti-Vedic(but not always) and not anti-Aryan because "Arya" existed meaning only "noble" in those religions. Buddhism and Jainism used Prakrit and Sanskrit and both are Indo-Aryan languages. This is the reason you can find a lot of "tatbhava" words(Prakrit forms) in Kannada and Telugu. The initial literature in these languages was the works mainly of Jains(not yet heard of Buddhist works). At least in Karnataka, Brahmins started writing in the native languages only after 11-12th century. I think in Kerala it was a much later phenomenon as they were strongly against "little tradition".

I must say, the period between 7-12th century in South India is not much understood. We have to understand that even Buddhists considered the term Brahmin has a very noble meaning though they might have opposed the hereditary Brahmins. Again, Tantrik Buddhism and Saivite Vedikism had a lot in common. Also, Jainism and Vaishnavism did not have turbulent history and in fact many Jains in Karnataka converted to Vaishanvism. In my native place, Mangalore, a curious cult called "Natha Pantha" emerged from Tantrik Buddhism which later had Saivite look. We need to know how much Buddhist Tantriks in Kerala merged with these Saivite sect. There is a legend that a woman ruler "Mangale" from Malayala region became disciple of a "Natha Pantha" guru and moved to the region of Tulu Nadu, ultimately meeting a tragic death and also giving the name Mangala Ooru(Mangalore) to the place.

Our history is more complex than simple Aryan/Dravidian model.

Manjunatha (14 Sept 2006)

[edit] Merging

The Caste system in Kerala article should be redirected to Jati system of Kerala, for one main reason.....there are no concrete "castes" (Varna) in South India apart from Namboothiris, and it only serves to heighten the confusion. In Kerala the Jati system holds sway, so any reference to south indian and keralite social heirarchies should refer to Jati not Caste (Varna) Kshatriya knight 07:40, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] No. That article to be merged with this

It is true that there is no varna in south India. Varna is a classification. It is referred as class not as caste. However in south India, there were so many castes (Jatis). You must first understand the difference between class and caste ie. varna and jati. Ambalavasi 04:59, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

The following castes are considered Avarnas:# Kammalas: Carpenters, Sculptors etc.# Ezhavas: Toddy Tappers# Mukkuvars: Fishermen# Pulayas : Peasants# Pariahs : Dalits Only nampoothiris, Ambalavasis and nairs form the savarna castes in Kerala. I think the Veena nairs like Villakkithala nairs, Veluthedathu nairs, Chakkala nairs etc formed the topmost strata of avarna jatis in Kerala. Many castes are shown as in the article as belonging to both the savarna and avarna jatis. Such articles would create confusion. Ambalavasis are composed of many castes wiith theirown hierarchy. Samanthas like thampis, Unnithans etc are nairs their title inherited maternally. Their father could be a nampoothiri, Varma or any caste of Nair (excluding the so called fallen nairs). Diwan velu Thampi's father was a Nair-Pillai. RAMS (9-9-2006)

[edit] The one who edited the article before I did today

Make yourself clear about the following 1.Do you mean to say that Thampis, Unnithans and Valiyathans are not nairs??? Don't tell ME (stress is on me)!!! Then better get your facts right!!!! 2. What do you mean by Lower caste nairs??? nairs like Pillai, kaimal, Menon etc. with titles given by rajas and were serving as Diwans and commanders? Or the so called Veena nairs like Veluthedathu nairs, Chakkala nairs etc.??? 3.Ambalavasis are not considered nair. they are considered..what else Ambalavasis. No Ambalavasi would write in his SSLC book, 'Nairs' in the column specifying caste. And that community is not going to be pleased if you try to bracket them with nairs. 4.What you call oil monger nairs must be Chakkala nairs are fallen nairs enjoying the benefit of being in OBC List. NSS, the premier organisation is one of the most vocal critic of reservation system. In addition, Chakkala Nairs, Velluthedathu nairs etc. have their own community organisations are not members of NSS. And Nairs generally do not have matrimonial alliances with them. 5.Don't you know that their are no indigenous Vaishyas in Kerala caste system?? And what do you mean by Vaishya nairs??? 6.Pulappedy- the system was applicable to any upper caste woman.

I thought a debate would be worthwhile and productive. Pl. everybody, mention the corrections made in the discussion page. I'd corrected (or recorrected) the part about Pulappedy and included some info about so called Fallen nairs. I'd not edited other part of the article. Your article is fine otherwise.... RAMS (10-9-2006)

Hey the basic classification of the article itself is wrong..there is no such thing as kshatriya nairs and vaisya nairs n sudra nairs....not when all nairs were anways considered sudras excepting perhaps a few samanthans....and ambalavasis are indeed nairs...they are also lesser and lower in caste than kiriyathil nairs...read books like travancore state manual which clearly state that ambalavasis are nairs who later started keeping untouchability due to their work in temples....also the article mentions women below the nairs not being allowed to wear blouses...incidentally even namboodiri antherjanams got the right to wear blouses only in 1932 in a conference presided by Parvathy Antherjanam in Guruvayoor...and also ambalavasis were never pushpaka 'brahmins'...incidentally even poonool wearing ambalavasis had a status only equal to the non poonools...they were never included in distribution of alms by rajahs as brahmins..just like some of the kammalans, due to their work in temples, got the poonool right these ambalavasis also got it as a special privelage since they had to clean the steps of the shrine etc..and RAMS as far as i know, the Samanthans ie Thampi Unnithan and Valiathan till about 50 years ago didnt mingle or marry or touch nairs, be they kiriyathil or menons or kaimals or anything...thts y they were called Samanthans...ofcourse they are also nairs, but have been accepted or rather they accepted themselves as nairs only after the coming of the NSS in kerala...you will often hear old people saying 'he isnt a nair...he is an unnithan' etc..basically its all coz of royal descent manu

Hallo Manu You may be right. I don't know. Velu Thampi's father was a Pillai. He inherited the Thampi title from his mother. Remeber it was mid 17th century. And if you read the novels of Cv Raman Pillai like mathanda Varma, dharma Raja etc, you do not find any distinction between so called samanthans and nairs. The nephew of 'Chandrkaran' Pillai is an Unnithan. You get a feeling that in the nobility of Travancore Pillais, Unnithan, Thampis all formed the melange which constituted a Tharavad. In my own Tharavad, all the three existed. I think the father of rahmohan Unnithan the politician is a Pillai. And remember that all these titles for royal progeny existed only in travancore. In Cochin and South malabar, the son of the raja and a nair woman inherited his mother's title, be it menon, nair or kaimal. VK Krishan Menon is the grandson of raja of Kadathanad and son of a 'Nair'. I am not trying to prove or disprove anything. But trying to set facts right as i understand it. I see it as a part of a debate rahre than a statement. Incidentally, if you had not rread, Indulekha and the novels of CV, read them. Cv's novels are considered those with all lakshnams of a novel. And he is still considered one of the greatest novelists ever in malayalam. RAMS (12-09-2006)

I did secure an online copy of marthanda varma...is dharmaraja also available online fr free by any chance? and in english please (cant read malayalam)...if u know the site please temme..thanks...yes i know that royal progeny were indeed nairs only...and i myself believe that samanthans could be considered the upper layer of the nairs only...and as for their being higher than ambalavasis, i guess no women of affluent families would be given in marriage to ambalavasis , considering that till about 150 years back they had no landed areas or wealth on a general basis...

one doubt...thampis are also seen only in travancore???? and whts pillais gotta do with royalty? i always thought that was a title..but i seem to have heard that there is sum similarity between thampis and pillais or sumthin...do u know anything on that? Manu

MANU Thampis are found only in Travancore. Pillais were generally nobles in Travancore. For that very reason they are potential tharavads of royal consorts. eg; ettuveetil pillamar effectively ruled Venad for centuries, leaving the raja a mere figurehead till Marthanda Varma's rule. RAKS (September 13, 2006)

[edit] Topics of debate

[edit] Position of Ambalavasis

Most of Kerala society structure is the replication of Tulu society. The Ambalavasi section is similar to Devadiga in Tulu society. Though it must be said that Devadigas didn't have much exalted position in the society. In fact, many were bounded to landlords(Bunts, whose equivalent is Nair), so clearly were lower than Bunts. I believe the position in Kerala society was higher because of Sambandhams. However, it should be noted that system was peculiar to Kerala society and a later phenomenon whereas this temple worker section predates that in Tulu society and so must be the case in Malayala society. Curiously, Billavas(Tulu equivalent of Ezhavas) consider Devadigas as one them(Veerappa Moily belongs to that community).

if u read the malabar manual (i think) or travancore state manual, why even search on google book search..u will find all saying that there are certain temple serving nairs who generally consider themselves above the nairs proper...they were called ambalavasis and later became an independant caste...manu

If you observe the situation of Devadiga(also called Ambalavasi) and that of Ambalavasis in Kerala, only "son of a Namboothiri" could claim higher position and still remain unquestioned in the old Kerala society, I suppose. However, the point remains that it was not a caste created exclusively from Namboothiri Sambanthams. I was wondering if these Ambalavasis were one of the priestly communities of South Indians. If you observe in old South Indian society the position of priest was low(not only in Tamil society I believe) as such many traditional priests became part of lower castes. However, I think some of these priestly families might have survived as temple workers under Brahmins. At least their position in Tulu regions might show their original position in the society.

[edit] Covering upper part of body

This is another not much understood topic. I have read that in South Indian society mostly the upper levels of women never covered their upper part of the body. It's true even for the queens of Karnataka before 15th century. I wonder about Kerala society. As far as I know, Kerala never had much of cotton cultivation. When did the transition from leaf covering to cotton covering occur in Kerala society? Were clothes imported before?

Also, if we say non-brahmin castes were not allowed to cover their upper parts of the body implies that they used to cover it before. Does that mean the women of lower classes started covering the upper part as a protection from heat and dirt, as they used to work mostly outside unlike the upper classes who were not exposed to such a life style? Just imagining wildly.

Also, whether the rule was the lower classes must not cover their upper body all the time or just in front of Namboothiris?

Any thoughts? Thanks.

Manjunatha (14 Sept 2006)

Well from all that i could collect, even namboodiri antherjanams were not allowed to cover their torso in the strict sense of the term. They were given a thorthu which they took over the shoulder of one arm and tied below the underarms on the other side...when in 1932 Parvathi Antherjanam wore a blouse it was considered heretic...

My grandmothers mom wore that mola kutcha dress...but she says inside the house they moved about after tying a particular type of blouse that exposed the stomach n shoulders...at the same time while lower caste women went about in public without anything on top till as recently as the 1960s, upper caste, mainly nairs n ambalavasis, covered themselves by wrapping a mel mundu like a shawl....thts all..they didnt have to take it off or anything when a brahmin passed...its just that they didnt have the right to wear a 'blouse' as such...

in my grands family, her mother n all never went before the men of the house...they never left the house....if they wanted to talk to their brothers, they wud have to stand in another room, behind the door in such a way that nothing, not even a finger is exposed and then talk...so there was no chance of any men seeing them..

ive seen pictures of old tamil pattees and while they wear the tamil saree, they too donot wear blouses...this system was prevelant all over south india...manu

The situation during/after 19th century does not give proper picture. Blouse has nothing to do with covering upper part of the body(I think it must be a 19th century invention). The problem is account of covering of upper body differs. From an article I came across on the web( I didn't mention because I was afraid that it could be muslim propaganda).

Another social custom imposed by the aristocracy was that except the Namboodiris no men and women should cover the upper half of their body. Shaikh Zainuddin gives interesting details of this mode of dress; only a single loin cloth is girdled round the waist leaving the upper part exposed. In this respect males and females, rajas and nobles, rich and poor are equal.”30 None of the Hindu ladies except Brahmins thought that the breast was to cover; and to them to cover the breast was an act of immodesty. “The caste law prohibits a Nair lady to cover her breast.”31 There are instances of cruelties inflicted upon the ladies for violating these laws. An Ezhava lady who happened to travel abroad and returned well dressed was summoned by the Queen of Attingal and her breast was cut off for covering them.32 In Travancore a riot occurred when a group of upper caste men assaulted a lady of Ezhava caste for wearing cloth below her knees.33 In 1859 another riot took place in Travancore and continued for several days, when the ladies of Channar caste started to cover the breast. The revolt was called chela kalapam (cloth revolt). It became very important that later scholars regarded it as a part of the struggle for independence.34

From this article

What puzzles me is that if indeed except Brahmins all other castes were tribals who became castes then there was no need for such a law as South Indians(both males and females) never covered their upper part of the body. It should be the case in East India also. And for that matter I am not sure when North-West Indians started covering the upper part though chilly winter of North India might have ensured full clothing long back unlike South and East.

When I hear about the old traditions I find it difficult to understand if covering the breasts were considered unlawful because of caste rules or if there is some kind of aversion to change(as mentioned in the article above). I mean I have heard my community women from Tulu regions(where I believe such rules didn't exist) married to males from Malayala region, to their horror, were asked cover their upper part with only a cloth(torth) or leave it bare by their mothers-in-law.

If anything, we need chronological order of these rules. I mean if the rule was made in 17th-18th century when men/women thought they should cover their upper body for some unknown reasons then we can't apply it to the centuries before it when covering upper body was in fact considered "immodest".

[edit] Four fold Varna system

I am going to delete all Brahmin/Kshatriya/Vaishya/Shudra categories. Please discuss here.

[edit] Kshatriyas

I have read that Chirakkal kings invited Brahmins from Tulu regions as Malayalee Brahmins refused to declare Chirakkal kings as Kshatriyas. I would like to know about Cochin and Travancore families. Somebody mentioned somewhere that Travancore kings underwent Hiranyagarbha to become Kshatriyas. Was that performed by Tulu Brahmins(Embanthiris) or Namboothiris?

Manjunatha (14 Sept 2006)

Manju You've got a point there. Caste system in Kerala never strictly followed the Four-Fold classification as in North where they orignated. Still, i don't know whether putting a word 'Rulers' could effectively bring the correct picture. It was all entangled and mixed up. I corrected it with the word 'Kshatriyas' with an implication that it meant members of royal families. But it is not completly explanatory. Rulers could be Varmas or Nairs (Rajas were varmas, but the feudal lords (naduvazhis) were generally nairs. Pl remember the Ettuveettil Pillamar.). But then, atleast one royal family was Nampoothiri (Ambalapuzha) before its annexation to Travancore. Palakkad royal family is Nair and so is Zamorin. Royal (Varma) families had a lot of nair members. Consorts of Rajas used to be nair women, but their children would not be rajas, but part of the nobility. So you see it is all mixed up and complex as it could be. But Kshatriyas is the best word i could think of. May be a better option may be possible. Now about a 'a section of Nairs' being Avarana. They are known as 'Fallen' or 'Veena' Nairs. these castes are thought to be formed to serve nairs and other forward castes. But the Nairs did not have any social contact (like marriage) with them. This seems to be true even today.Even now they do not form the part of Nair Service Society (NSS) the organisation of Nairs. Instead they have their own community organisations like Velluthedathu nair Samajam etc. They belong to OBC category according to government rules. I could not get a word to categorise them together. So i have mentioned the castes together. A debate would be welcome and is required RAMS

Yes, it is all mixed up. That's the reason it's just under heading "Savarna" :-).

I do not think these castes were created to serve the Savarna castes. If you read about other non-brahmin castes of South India(like Bunts, Gowdas in Karnataka) then you would know that barbers, washermen were integral part of the community life including marriage and death ceremonies. In fact, even Avarna castes employ them so these families had a very long existence. Certainly, before caste system. Curiously, oil mongers were equated with Ambalavasis in Tulu regions.

--Manjunatha

A correction: It is mentioned in the article that Christians claimed equal status with Nairs. I gather the people referred to must be the Syrian Christians. Nairs practised a limited form of Aayitham with Christians. Nairs were prohibited with taking food with Christians. You can find this in any authoritative work of or on ealier Kerala. Even during my grand mother's childhood, her father's Christian business partners or clients were allowed to sit on a chair on the sit out and not in the Sweekarana Muri. And many of them were rich land lords and personal friends. I am just stating what was the situation that time without being judgmental. I think mixing of religions were generally discouraged in all parrts of India. Maybe, this was to avoid inter religious marriages, which was thought as a threat for every religion. Remember the famous story of a young Vivekananda (then Narendra Dutta) tasting each hookah kept for clients of different faiths in his lawyer father's consulting room. On quizzed by his father Narendra told him that he was tasting whether the Hindu hookahs tasted different from Muslim and Christian hookahs. RAMS

It so happens that syrian christians claimed a status equal to ambalavasis while all other christians were aitham for nairs....infact as somebody had mentioned elsewhere, syrian christians had certain temple duties as well...

As for veenu nair samajams,,,they were never nairs...from what i have heard from the old people in my family they were avarnas only but just because all the nairs, which was a huge community, were involved in military and namboodiris were too wealthy to do menial jobs they did, these barbers were theoretically made nairs...this was mainly coz namboodiris were so orthodox that they cudnt stand anybody below nairs serving them...and so al who served them became nairs....manu

The Christians I mentioned were Syrian Christian. In Central travancore you wouldn't generally find other christians. The prohibition of taking food together were with syrians. Others were considered polluting. they never were allowed the previlage of ruling, civil adminstration. an exception could be Mathu Tharakan before his dismissal by Velu Thampi. however, relgious freedom was ensured. But forward caste Hindus were strictly discouraged from converting to Christianity. the punishments for breaking the taboo was death. The well known example is of Devasahayam Pillai (earlier neelakanta pillai)a high official in the Travancore Raja's court. He converteed under the influence of Admiral Delannoy the commander of Travancore army. Pillai was shot by soldiers and killed under royal orders. Even Delannoy's great influence could not save him. In temples and churches then as of now, Hindus had religious rights/duties and vice versa. That does not form the general picture. Similar features could be seen in certain dargahs and temples in North. RAMS

Okay. You can mention about Syrian Christians in the article.

--Manjunatha

[edit] Veenu Nairs

As for veenu nair samajams,,,they were never nairs...from what i have heard from the old people in my family they were avarnas only but just because all the nairs, which was a huge community, were involved in military and namboodiris were too wealthy to do menial jobs they did, these barbers were theoretically made nairs...this was mainly coz namboodiris were so orthodox that they cudnt stand anybody below nairs serving them...and so al who served them became nairs....manu

this was mainly coz namboodiris were so orthodox that they cudnt stand anybody below nairs serving them...and so al who served them became nairs

That is interesting. Any idea, when did it take place?

--Manjunatha

well i wud say that took place exactly as gradually as the caste system formed in kerala...ie these serving castes were also added as nairs in theory when it came to assigning them a position...again tht was just coz they needed to work for 'upper' castes and all manu

[edit] Sambandams

I would like to know if Namboothiris practiced Sambandams with Nair women only. I mean I watched a movie named Perunthachan. And I noticed that every now then he would be called "son of a Namboothiri" with awe and to his great pride. I suppose, he is a Kammalan. And generally Kammalan women were treated as sexual objects. Did Namboothiris strictly followed religiously sanctioned Sambandams with only Nair/Kshatriya women or had illicit relationships with Avarna women too. Thanks.

--Manjunatha

About sambandam. You can call it quasi legal marriage. The women is appreciated as the wife of The nampoothiri. The sons were legally recognised. eg Swathi thirunal was the son of a brahmin. but they did not have any claim on the paternal property. It's different from keeping concubines. I read in menon's book on Kerala history that nairs were permitted to keep mistresses from castes like Veluthedathu , Chakkala Nairs etc. I don't know how. But the sentence above was part of my last but one post. I don't know how it appeared as a separate entity --RAKS

Anyway, I have read that Perunthachan, a Kammalan, had a Brahmin father, Tunjath Ezhuthachan, supposed to be a Chakkala Nair, had a Brahmin father. I was wondering if these were just legends because of the mindset during that period or really the case. --Manjunatha

from what i know yes sambandham in the proper sense of the term, as in alliance, which was usually not only related to sleeping at night but also had a political and money aspect to it. from what i have read, namboodiris had sambandhams with wealthy and powerful families and often these nair ladies were given residences at their illoms...same has happened in the case of one of my ancestresses...

as for lower castes and samabandhams, well i guess THAT would be more like concubinage...my grandmother mentions a building where our relations stay now where mistresses of all the obc nair castes were kept...as sum1 mentioned before...

as for being proud to be the son of a namboodiri..well this pride is in the case of lower castes to whom that meant a lot..most of the nairs too but since they were rather privilaged i guess it wasnt all tht imp...one of my relations long back had a kid thru a kaniyan lady...and the kid thru that even today takes great pride in saying tht he is ananthapadmanabha Panicker's son n all..Manu

most of the nairs too but since they were rather privilaged i guess it wasnt all tht imp

I am skeptical about that. But anyway, detailing the various kinds of responses to caste system would certainly helps us to make it a better article.

Manjunatha (15 Sept 2006)

[edit] 61.1.233.246 ... reverted without any discussion

Could the editor please give his reasons for reverting back? Thanks.

Manjunatha (15 Sept 2006) Manju Should we encourage edits without discussion?? About sambandam. You can call it quasi legal marriage. The women is appreciated as the wife of The nampoothiri. The sons were legally recognised. eg Swathi thirunal was the son of a brahmin. but they did not have any claim on the paternal property. It's different from keeping concubines. I read in menon's book on Kerala history that nairs were permitted to keep mistresses from castes like Veluthedathu , Chakkala Nairs etc. RAKS (Sept 15, 2006)

Which edits you are talking about? Everything is being discussed here. And I have not read a single opposition for deleting four fold Varna system in Kerala.

--Manjunatha MANJU I was talking about the edit of the friend who reverted back to his own brand of classification with out discussion and not to yours. I personally thik the Chatur varna system does not apply much to kerala. This is more or less true of South India, in particular Tamil nad and Kerala RAKS

Hello The one thing evry historian points out about caste system in Kerala is the absence of indigenuous 'Vaishyas'. Read any book on Kerala History by Sreedhara menon's or Kerala through ages. Chettis are from Tamil nadu and exists so today. RAKS

[edit] Article to be deleted

I think this article should be removed. What's other's opinion? It's time to forget our dirty past. But people are trying to dig in and create stories in editor's favor to attain better status in the society. User: Pallathottath

This should be categorized under RACISM and should not be encouraged. Looks like it's mainly aimed at Ezhava / Thiyya community. Ezhavas and Thiyya always revolted against caste system and there is no mention about that in the article. Secondly all castes except Brahmins were not allowed to cover their breast and it was Ezhavas who fought against this under the leadership of Velayudha Panicker. But article is twisted. Yes, this has be removed. There is a limit for tolerance.

Dislike of an article or its content is not enough reason for it to de deleted. See WP:IDONTLIKEIT. Please discuss the inaccuracies of the article here on the talk page and arrive at a consensus—one that is neutral in its views. Also, if you disagree with the present article, please add {{disputed}} (or any other relevant template) to the top of the page. Thank you.--thunderboltz^(Deepu) 06:10, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

From 19th century onwards Ezhavas/Tiyyas were forefront in fighting against caste menace. However, we have to understand that common people before that time(from Nair onwards) did not have a common community identity. You can read research papers on how some of the national movements helped to build Nair community bond(author Dileep Menon?) in 20th century. So identification with one's caste past must take into account these factors. The caste system was a self-sustaining phenomenon once it was implemented. Therefore, you can read how one outcasts with higher ranking blocked another outcasts' struggle for their fundamental rights. But the fact remains how the people at the top viewed all others. Because that prejudice was not just a view on paper it reflected on the ground.

manju 07:02, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Caste in Kerala

(Taken from Dr. S. Omana's doctoral thesis honoured by the University of Kerala)

Even though Kerala is today treated as one ethnic unit, there are many caste groups and local customs in Malabar or North Kerala, which are not known to the people of the South, formerly called Travancore. Hindus, Christians and Muslims live almost as exclusive communities. Hindus had among them Brahmins and non-Brahmins. In the days of Narayana Guru, non-Brahmins ranged from the most touchable to the least touchable. No rational sociological norm is implied in this classification. These castes have evolved and crystallized in relation to hereditary trades and work opportunities. The caste in Kerala has nothing or very little to do with what is popularly known as the fourfold division of Brahmana, Kshatriya, Vaisya, and Sudra. Even among the Brahmins there were sharp divisions based on their linguistic origin. There were Malayali Nambudiris, Tulu Pottis, Telugu Iyengars or Vaishnavaites and Tamil Iyers. Each one claims superiority over others.

Until recently Malayali Brahmins practiced the most heinous sociological crime of keeping women of a certain section of the Hindu community as concubines, without having the obligation of a responsible husband or father. As Travancore, Cochin and Malabar were under theocratic rule for a long time, these Nambudiris managed to keep the Rajas of these states in a socio-political hypnosis and got large areas of land and temples under their undisputed hegemony. They used the land and the favor of the Rajas to give a social acceptance to their illegitimate relationships which were known as sambandham.

Certain powerful Nair chiefs were 'baptized' by the Brahmins with a hocus-pocus ritual of making them 'Raja-designate' to be symbolically born out of a golden cow. The priest's fee was the golden cow. Thus the Kshatriyas of Kerala are homemade products. Nairs were a martial class. They had gymnasiums conducted by Kurups, where they taught martial arts.

Besides Brahmins and Nairs, there were temple attendants such as Warrier, Pisharadi, Marar etc. All of them enjoyed certain social privileges that were not shared by the rest of the Hindu community. There was also a large community who acted as a buffer group between the touchables and the untouchables. They are known in Travancore as Ezhavas, in Cochin as Choyas and in Malabar as Thiyas. The common link between these three groups was their hereditary trade interest in extracting coconut and palm wine and running breweries. This factor does not exist any longer. Others now share this trade too. They show a definite left-wing protest in their attitude towards relating themselves to Brahmins. The price they had to pay was heavy. They lived more or less as outsiders to the Hindu Society. In the coastal areas like Tellicherry and Cannanore, they easily mixed with European adventurers and Arab pirates. Thus we can see there, many fair-complexioned and blue or brown-eyed Thiyas. Socially and economically they were under-privileged. In this group there are a number of families who remained as pockets of the last vestiges of the Buddhist culture. The Pali language, Sanskrit and Ayurvedic Medicine distinguished these families from others. Then there came the poorest of the poor, who were real children of the soil--the Bhumiputras. They were branded as untouchables. Kuravas, Pulayas, Pariahs and the tribals, all have their own traditions reaching back to antiquity. Perhaps the first Mohenjodaro drummer, Shiva himself, was a Pariah (para=drum).

In one of Swami Vivekananda's letters, he writes of the despicable caste system of Travancore as the most horrid experience he had in his wanderings in India.

It was into this dark chapter of Indian history that Narayana Guru came in the 1850s. His own caste is described as Ezhava. In his abundant sense of humor, he once described the Ezhava as an unrecognized weed in the garden of the caste scruples. Panikkar

is this possible for me to change my caste i given to school register(which is my fathers caste) in to my mothers caste? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.98.33.157 (talk) 06:08, 28 May 2008 (UTC)