Talk:Carvin Corporation

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[edit] Delete

I am going to request this article be deleted unless proof is placed within the article establishing notability. WP:N states that "a topic is notable if it has been the subject of multiple, non-trivial, reliable published works, whose sources are independent of the subject itself." The only reason I am placing this here rather than requesting deletion is that I have read such materials about Carvin myself; but I cannot cite every article myself. CyberAnth 20:09, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

The numerous notable musicians playing Carvin instruments lend evidence as to notability. They all have published works, namely their recordings. As you say, sources should be added. Here's a quote that does not seem to me suitable for placement within the article: "Representative of the highest level of the luthier's art, and offering great playability and great tones, the CT6M is proof positive that Carvin does indeed deserve a place alongside the world's most respected guitar builders". -- Guitar Player (magazine) Dec. 2004 Does this help? Zzorse 23:48, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
The cite from the mag is exactly the sort of material that MUST be added to this article to establish notability. It needs several more such things now. NOTE: info from Carvin is NOT QUALIFIED as additions to prove notability per WP:N and WP:V. Also, you can include info about numerous notable musicians playing Carvin instruments IF that has been reported in reliable sources. Going to the Carvin site, culling names, and then placing album names violates WP:OR. CyberAnth 01:56, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
I agree the citation is of the type, I'm just not sure at the moment how to incorporate it into the text. I agree using Carvin as the source is not the correct approach, but also feel confident that the information can be verified. (I just looked and I have a couple Enanitos Verdes CDs where Carvin is specifically mentioned.) Hopefully other contributors will step forward and help this page out. Zzorse 02:59, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Well, it may require some re-working of the text to reflect the available allowable and reliable sources. I have personal recollection of extensive coverage of Carvin guitars and amps in Guitar Mag, and Musician Mag, starting many years back. So I know very quality, meaty, and detailed sources are out there. But overall, here is the exact policy for articles of this type: Wikipedia:Notability_(companies_and_corporations).

Does the Carvin site have scanned images of or pointers to coverage in such mags? They used to. Also, you can post stuff here and people can help work out how to work it in.

I MIGHT have time to help. I did work in the cite you have above. Maybe how I did that that can serve as a bit of pattern on how to go about clearly establishing notability to the average reader. We musicians do not need anyone to establish to us notability for Carvin. But we write for the average reader, not the specialist. Assume your reader has never heard of Carvin and is asking, "Okay, so why the heck should I care???" See what I mean?

Also, once notability is established via multiple external sources, WP:V#Self-published_and_dubious_sources_in_articles_about_the_author.28s.29 probably comes into play and you can use info from the Carvin site.

CyberAnth 10:35, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

I have a few links that may prove useful http://www.vintageguitar.com/brands/details.asp?ID=209, http://www.proaudioreview.com/musician_reviews/carvinC780.shtml, http://www.guitarplayer.com/story.asp?storycode=16259 |

There are also some Wikipedia pages referencing Carvin, for example Vinnie Vincent or Alex Lifeson. Gamiar 20:05, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Carvin is a well-established brand, not just a small-time guitar shop. They have a product catalog with national circulation, and have an article for their 60th anniversary in the February 2007 issue of Guitar World magazine [1]. Surely recognition in two of the most widely circulated American guitar magazines (Guitar Player and Guitar World) establishes Carvin as a notable brand. Endorsement from world famous musicians such as Steve Vai must also count for something.

Flypanam 19:20, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

To add to my comment before, it states on Steve Vai's own website that he uses Ibanez Guitars coupled with his signature Carvin Legacy amplifiers [2]. Also, there is proof in the form of concert reviews that, on top of his many stage decorations, Frank Zappa used Carvin amplifiers [3]. Bassist Greta Brinkman, touring bassist for Moby, plays and endorses Carvin basses [4]. Flypanam 23:16, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Advertisement

This article seems to be more of an advertisement for Carver, and although it seems to have a more or less NPOV, it sure reads like some sort of marketing brochure.