Talk:Caledonian MacBrayne

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This article is within the scope of the following WikiProjects:

Scottish Islands WikiProject (Rated B-Class) This article is within the scope of the Scottish Islands WikiProject, a collaborative effort to improve Wikipedia's coverage of islands in Scotland. If you would like to participate, you can visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks. B This page has been rated as B-Class on the quality scale. Top This article has been rated as Top-importance on the importance scale. Article Grading: The article has been rated for quality and/or importance but has no comments yet. If appropriate, please review the article and then leave comments here to identify the strengths and weaknesses of the article and what work it will need. WikiProject Scotland (Rated B-Class) Caledonian MacBrayne is within the scope of WikiProject Scotland, which aims to improve Wikipedia's coverage of Scotland and Scotland-related topics. If you would like to participate, visit the project page. Scotland Portal B This article has been rated as B-Class on the quality scale. High This article has been rated as high-importance on the importance scale. Article Grading: The article has been rated for quality and/or importance but has no comments yet. If appropriate, please review the article and then leave comments here to identify the strengths and weaknesses of the article and what work it will need. WikiProject Scotland To-do: edit  Peer review — general community input. Featured Portal Candidates — our ultimate short-term goal is to achieve Featured status for the portal. Featured Portal Candidate — 23 April 2007; result, Featured Portal Status awarded, 14 May 2007 (UTC) Transport in Scotland WikiProject (Rated B-Class) This article is within the scope of the Transport in Scotland WikiProject, a collaborative effort to improve Wikipedia's coverage of transportation in Scotland. If you would like to participate, you can visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks. B This page has been rated as B-Class on the quality scale. Top This article has been rated as top-importance on the importance scale.

If I'm reading the Scottish newspapers correctly (I was in Oban last week), it's not so much that the Scottish Executive want to go to competitive tendering, but more that the European Commission is requiring them to do so, and the Executive are maybe not doing all they can to persuade the EC that Cal-Mac is a special case. Loganberry (Talk) 12:08, 25 July 2005 (UTC)

I confess to not fully understanding the to-ings and fro-ings of the tendering scheme (which is why the article is suitably vague about it). I believe you are correct in saying the EC wants them to put it out to open bid. I'll see if I can dig up some more definative info and try to clarify matters. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 12:31, July 25, 2005 (UTC)

I'm not sure you are entirely correct about the "Cal-Mac" (for short) merger. The Caledonian Steam Packet Co was owned by the Caledonian Railway Co so both would have been Nationalised at the same time (shortly after World War II); hence both were owned by British Rail. I suspect that Caledonian-MacBrayne was formed before 1973, although the name "Cal-Mac" may have been invented at that time. I'll try and find a reference, but it may be the end of August before I have time. Pyrotec 21:41, 29 July 2005 (UTC)

My brain melted somewhere through the corporate history. If you live through that, feel free to make any change you find necessary :) -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 21:56, July 29, 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the reference and the invite. I might have a go in Sept & fill in the Cal. Railway stub at the same time, if no one else does. I think "Mac" went bust whilst doing the Postal (Royal Mail) Runs and the LMS Railway got them. The "Cal." railway also became part of LMS in the 1920s. However, you are right about the date of the formation of "Cal-Mac" (1973). There's one famous quote that perhaps should go in (but I've forgotten it) The Lord owns ..... but David MacBrayne owns the Western Isles.Pyrotec 08:15, 30 July 2005 (UTC)

Tendering update added, and poem from different source seems more credible as I'm sure the doggerel goes back to days when CSP had the Clyde. ....dave souza 07:44, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

The poem is known but dates from the days when David Macbraynes existed as a seperate privately owned shipping line. As Dave souza says, at this time the Clyde traffic was dominated by the Caledonian Steam Packet and the G&SWR. Adding lines to the old poem is just creative licence and doesn't belong here. If the company had made it part of their official identity that's different. Douglasnicol (talk) 15:59, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

Just so. Like Pyrotec, I vaguely remembered all but the third verse, and from a bit of googling found the rather splendid version we have now, in a sort of Scottish chat website which didn't look tremendously authoritative so unfortunately I didn't note the url. Trying again, here are links for a few versions. But first, thanks to the joys of Google, I've found the original source – The Earth Belongs unto the Lord. Psalm 24:1. Scottish Psalter (1650). Retrieved on 2008-03-02., complete with a midi file of the music, St. Matthew, William Croft, 1708. Think we should add that info? Anyway, Skye by Derek Cooper (link to google books) has "... unto the Lord And all that it contains Except the Western Highlands And they are all MacBrayne's", Oliver Brown – Highland Lairds cites the paraphrase ""The earth, it is the Lord’s, The sea and all that it contains; Except the boats and piers, And they are all MacBrayne's". Panoramic photographs of Scotland has "The Earth belongs unto the Lord, and all that it contains; except the Western Isles alone, and they are all MacBrayne's." Lastly, Scottish heirloom.com Scottish Blog has the version I found earlier, but dated 04/16/07. However, in my opinion that's the best one – "The Earth belongs unto the Lord, And all that it contains; Except the Kyles and the Western Isles, And they are all MacBrayne's". .. dave souza, talk 17:36, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

Just for interest, the version of the poem currently quoted on this page is included in Alistair Deayton's book "MacBrayne Steamers" (ISBN 10 0752423622). Not sure that that counts as a reference (its mainly a picture book) but then I'm completely sure that the fact that my father used to quote the same verse to me is absolutely NOT encyclopedic. Similarly, on my travels in the western isles I've found people quite frequently refer to "MacBraynes" rather than CalMac (as they do in the Clyde). Just thoughts, really ... —Preceding unsigned comment added by GraemeE17 (talk • contribs) 23:33, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

I've got the fairly recent Kingdom of MacBrayne book and its a weighty tome. I'll see what it says about it. I must confess that most of my steamer interest is in the Clyde traffic which is usually covered in books regarding the CSP/G&SWR/LMS days. Douglasnicol (talk) 18:45, 3 March 2008 (UTC)