Talk:Bugatti Veyron/Archive 2

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Second fastest now!

For crying outloud, can these Bugatti fanboys get along with the facts and stop reverting important edits? *NEWSFLASH* SSC Ultimate Aero's tests results were confirmed by Guinness World Records on Oct 9th 2007. SSC Ultimate Aero TT is now the fastest car on the planet with a speed of 411.707 kmh and ~1183 horse power. Bugatti is currently second fastest with ~408.4 kmh and 1001 horse power.

You're gonna need to cite it to say it... Gscshoyru 12:59, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
Veyron fanboys are annoying, ignorant little things aren't they? 70.112.86.215 02:20, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
lol, finally thanks putting up the facts and keeping them there, some people are too in love with this car to listen to any right or reason! (Wiki332) —Preceding comment was added at 13:24, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
yes, Tomthehand was the worst, this fanboy was straight in denial and kept on changing the article despite indisputable facts. I blame him the most for doing his best at keeping Wikipedia inaccurate. It's unbelieveable that someone would purposely make Wikipedia factually incorrect, especially in light of being presented with evidence which was done despite not necessary to satisfy 1 volunteer editor, and he kept on rejecting the facts because he did not want to believe his beloved Bugatti Veyron was no longer the fastest street-legal car in the world. Can you believe that?! What's he going to do next? Because he supports Ferrari, he's going to change the results of the F1 Championship?! This guy is dangerous. He's like power-tripping because he's a volunteer or something, and that he somehow is this "lord" over Wiki and what are facts and real, and he alone sets the standard for burder of proof. It's absolutely disgusting and these uneducated, unintelligent vandals like Tomthehand need to be kicked off Wikipedia ASAP! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 219.73.56.163 (talk) 16:04, 19 October 2007 (UTC)
Technically, the Veyron was never the fastest,a s it still doesn't have an "official" top speed. However, the source does say that Guinness regards it as the world's fastest production car. Good enough for me to feel that we should keep it part of the article. —Mr Grim Reaper (talk • contribs • email), 00:32, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

Don't get too smug, or you run the risk of sounding just like those you criticize. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.61.189.14 (talk) 20:32, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

There were already faster cars than the Veyron and probably even the SSC. It doesn't count for anything until there is a production number of 300 or so in development. "PRODUCTION" is the jey word when describing the Veyron which is why its still top dog. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.68.161.58 (talk) 02:57, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

Yeah actually there were a number of keywords that I forgot to mention while posting. Of course 'production' makes it important. Because there's the Thrust SSC with 750+ MPH :D and by 'Bugatti' I meant 'Bugatti Veyron 16.4'

I agree with the guy above me

As he said, There were cars faster than the Veryon before but they arent full production cars. Production is the key word.

Hey I didnt mean to change the Veyron wiki on anyone. I know alot about cars , And I am aware of the SSC Ultimate Aero TT, I do know it is the fastest car in the world. But being that only 25 Aero TT are ever going to be made, I dont think it can be called the "Fastest Full Production Car" Also the Veyron page says its the "second fastest, most powerful, and most expensive street-legal full production car" The SSC Aero is going to cost over $650,500 which makes the Veryon still the most expensive car.

It will now read " The Bugatti Veryon is the " Second fastest car in the world" But is the Fastest, most powerful, and most expensive street-legal full production car" I am also adding a small article about the Aero on the page.

If anyone has a problem with this, please let me know before you edit it, and we can work out what we both think it should say. Thanks Nate 687 01:05, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

This doesn't really make sense. If the SSC Aero isn't a production car yet then how is the Veyron the second fastest production car in the world? The Veyron in't even close to being second fastest if we count non production race and tuner cars. So it should read fastest most powerful and most expensive street-legal production car. --Daniel J. Leivick 22:56, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

I agree with you Daniel but this is what these guys think it should say.

This is the way I ended up editing it, as I said before if you have a problem with it let me know before you go and edit it. I think the way it is now is acceptable for everyone. Nate 687 01:05, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

The Bugatti Veyron 16.4 is currently the second fastest, most powerful, street-legal car in the world. Though it still is the fastest, most powerful, most expensive street-legal full production car made. with in excess of 1001 horsepower, in either the metric or SAE scale (see below), with its top speed of 253 mph having been eclisped by the SSC Ultimate Aero TT, which posted the “Fastest Car” world record of 256.19 mph on September 13, 2007, as verified by Guinness World Records on October 9, 2007. [4]. The Bugatti Veyron reached full production in September 2005. The car is built by Volkswagen AG subsidiary Bugatti Automobiles SAS in its Molsheim (Alsace, France) factory and is sold under the French Bugatti marque. It is named after French racing driver Pierre Veyron, who won the 24 hours of Le Mans in 1939 while racing for the original Bugatti firm.

We seriously don't need all that cruft at the beginning of the lead section! Just put it in another paragraph, but keep the first one short and to the point. -- intgr [talk] 00:14, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

I just cleaned up your edit to show the underlying message more clearer (got rid of a few run on sentences etc.) Hope you don't mind :) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.225.178.225 (talk) 00:41, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

Yeah its fine with me now. I dont mind at all if you cleaned up what I already put.

I hope everyone can now agree with what the Bugatti Veyron wiki says. Nate 687 01:05, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

Please don't edit or change other people's comments. And can we all sign our comments and indent? I feel that this discussion can be laid to rest. There is no denying that the Veyron is officially the fast street legal production car in the world. —Mr Grim Reaper (talk • contribs • email), 02:29, 20 October 2007 (UTC)

In conclusion we agree that it's pricier than and beats every other 'full production' car ;) And yeah I think we've come to a consensus over this.

Someone has changed the site again after a consensus was reached. If any change should be made, it should clarify that the Veyron is still the quickest car, with its' 0-100 kph and 0-150 kph times being considerably faster than the Aero. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.61.189.14 (talk) 16:00, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Ok, just one question, where would the John Hennessey Twin Turbo Viper 1000 (1000 hp/1100 ft.-lb of torque approx.) come into this? In a Road and Track standing mile test (youtube "Viper vs. Veyron"), the Viper records a 0-200 mph time of 20.3 seconds and top speed of 220.9 MPH, whereas the Veyron records a 0-200 mph time of 24.2 seconds and top speed of 204.4 mph. Motor trend has given similar numbers, and the DuPont registry uses Hennessy's own numbers for listings, which are as follows:

Power:

  1. 1000 hp @ 5000 rpm
  2. 1100 lb-ft torque @ 3800 rpm

Performance:

  1. 0-60 mph: 2.9 sec.
  2. 0-100 mph: 5.8 sec.
  3. 0-150 mph: 10.9 sec.
  4. 0-200 mph: 19.6 sec.
  5. Top Speed: 255 mph

I'm new to Wikipedia on the editing end of things, and I didn't want to go mucking around with an article that some people are very passionate about. I'd like to hear what people have to say first, then go from there. Thanks in advance for help! Mgraham1985 (talk) 10:21, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

5,000,000 pound supercar?

Where did this come from?

Each Veyron is being sold for £5,000,000 (net pay, without taxes), prices vary by exchange rates and local taxes (like value added taxes). As Bugatti, and therefore Volkswagen, are making such a loss, it has been likened by automotive journalist Jeremy Clarkson and his Top Gear programme team in their story on it to the Concorde, in that both were huge achievements, but the car will probably, like the plane before it, be discontinued after proving to be an economic failure.

I don't have much experience with wikipedia, but can someone fix this —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.85.160.161 (talk) 17:37, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

fixed. the net pay for 1 veyron is 1.1 million €. period. anything else varies by current exchange rates and local taxes. also this whole top-gear-investigation about the production costs and the win/loss calculation needs to be sourced properly or deleted.--BSI 13:23, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Although it wasn't stated explicitly, I believe the £5m figure was reached by taking the entire cost to VW since taking over Bugatti and dividing it by the number of Veyrons that are to be produced. Since VW has written off the development costs of the car (allowing them to claim that Bugatti is now profitable. Ha!) it's a rather meaningless figure. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.163.1.35 (talk) 09:42, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

# ^ Cite error 8; No text given.

  1. ^ Cite error 8; No text given.

Djcater 02:51, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Unneccesary?

"This speed and power was very close to the SSC Ultimate Aero TT, which claimed the “Fastest Production Car” world record with a top speed of 257.45 mph and an average speed of 256.19 mph on September 13 2007, later verified by Guinness World Records on October 9, 2007.[1] The Bugatti Veyron reached full production in September 2005.Even though Veyron might not be the fastest, it is still your "average" car compared to its design, speed(power), and price. "

Does this read strangely to anyone else? It kinda seems unnecessary to say that they came close to the Aero, I would think it would be easier just to mention in passing that the Aero was the car the beat it and then maybe link to the Aero article. I notice that nowhere in the CCR article does it say "The CCR was almost as fast as the Bugatti Veyron, the car the beat it."

Also the "Not your average car" part seems extremely unnecessary. The first sentence is "The Bugatti Veyron 16.4 was the fastest and most powerful street-legal production car in the world between October 2005 to September 2007." so I think it's safe to assume that they realize it isn't an average car.--Stealthsloth22 22:32, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

False lawsuit!

Keith Wood, a rabbit enthusiast from South Western Germany, has challenged Bugatti with the supposed use of rabbit hearts as a fuel additive. There is a 4.6 Million Euro lawsuit pending responses by Keith's father. Keith is extremely unorthadox and has resorted to recruiting an entire legal team which includes 3 minors and his eldest pet Rabbit. This Rabbit makes all the legal decisions for his counsel; the rabbit's language is deciphered by his eating habbits and eye contact.

This appears to be false. I have searched the internet for this, couldn't find anything. It was added yesterday at the middle of the night. I'm going to delete this, as it is most likely fraud. If someone finds evidence that it is true, they can add it back.

Dnlkk94 (talk) 05:23, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

I would had purged it immediately as this is nothing but nonsense dressed as vandalism. Willirennen (talk) 22:02, 19 November 2007 (UTC)
Yeah. Just wanted to post here though, to let everyone know. Hopefully, whoever did this won't try it again. "Rabbit hearts as a fuel additive?" Psh. Dnlkk94 (talk) 01:44, 20 November 2007 (UTC)
As much as I hate vandals ruining this beautiful sea of information... this one was pretty funny.99.225.178.225 (talk) 17:14, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Fanboys at it again

After much debate had above and even reaching a consensus, vandals have reverted all edits back to making the article state that Bugatti is the "Fastest and most powerful" street-legal production car, numerous times. For crying out loud... Wikipedia is not your thoughts' sandbox. It's a place to state facts. Stop ruining it because you're in love with the car. Grow UP!!! I also added a citation right in front of second most powerful and second fastest so that anyone in the dark can be enlightened to this fact. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.225.178.225 (talk) 09:41, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

I havent contributed to the Bugatti wiki since last time we all agreed that the wording of the start was ok with everyone. I do have to say though, the facts of the car are this.
It is the second fastest car in the world by top speed.
It is still the fastest accelerating 0-60 and 0-100 car.
It is still the most expensive production car in the world.
And it is still quite debatable about the SSC Ultimate Aero TT being a production or full production car.
Also as i've said before there are only going to be 25 Ultimate Aero TT ever going to be produced.
I'm not going to edit anything until somone comes to an agreement. But I do think it should say something about the Veyron still being the fastest 0-60, 0-100 and being the most expensive car made. Nate 687 (talk) 07:14, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
There should be a notice that the Bugatti's speed statistics aren't "official." —Mr. Grim Reaper at 23:30, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
but they are (at least the top speed). The Guiness brewery isn't the only company to approve top speed records.--BSI (talk) 00:59, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Revisions to article

Someone keeps inserting the '987 horsepower' rating in the article. This is ancient andinaccurate, as clearly explained in the article as one keeps readin it. Please stop messing with the site! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.61.189.14 (talk) 14:59, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Once again, to the knob that keeps revising this article, the 987 US horsepower rating was a preproduction number that has no application to the real numbers. The Chairman of Bugatti has stated, in many published articles, that the production engine has between 1006 and 1020 horsepower on the US scale and may be mich higher. The source you give for your numbers does not confirm what you think to be correct. Please stop changing the numbers to suit your own agenda. Do proper research! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.61.189.14 (talk) 21:46, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

read WP:V and WP:NOR. Then understand, that you need to cite sources for your claims. Currently there are sources in the article, that confirm the engine has a power rating of 736 kW / 1001 PS. Those numbers are directly from the official bugatti website, so I assume they are correct. Deleting sourced content (and the sources alike) and/or reintroducing deleted content without proper sources is considered vandalism. Please stop or you will be blocked from editing.--BSI (talk) 22:09, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

You want sources for the changes that I made to the Veyron horsepower ratings, so I will give you sources. Look at AutoMotoPortal.com, under '10 Most Expensive Cars In The World'. The first car listed is the Veyron. You will see the folllowing, and I quote:

"According to Volkswagen, the final production engine produces between 1020 and 1040 metric horsepower (1006 to 1026 SAE net horsepower), so the car will be advertised as producing '1001 horsepower' in both the US and European markets."

See also msn.cars.com, where the writer of the article is being driven around by the official Bugatti driver. That article states that the VW has 'quietly leaked' that the Veyron has 1050 horsepower, or "1035 to you and me." The article is Amercian. Also, a perusal of the articles about the Veyron will mage it clear that Bugatti will 'officially' list the car at 1001 horsepower, and they do. That doesn't alter the facts that they have released to the media.. I trust this meets with your satisfaction, Please amend the article accordingly —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.61.189.14 (talk) 16:50, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

as you might notice, the sentence you cited from automotoportal.com was obviousliy copied from Wikipedia. So how should this work as a proof? Bugatti officialy lists the car at 736 kW. Now you can do the maths and convert it to your prefered horsepower unit (SAE or PS or whatever you want).--BSI (talk) 17:13, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

What about the article where Henri from Bugatti was driving the vehicle? That is the other article to which I referred. Do you think he made the info up? You only reponded to 1/2 of my comments. I am sure that someone at Bugatti could confirm the information they are releasing to the public. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.61.189.14 (talk) 19:52, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

I didn't respond, because you didn't post a link. And I don't think the information from the bugatti website needs further confirmation. Btw please stop starting new sections everytime you edit the talk page.--BSI (talk) 22:36, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

With respect to your assumption that the sentence in the automotoportal.com aricle was 'copied from Wikipedia' you are wrong. The wikipedia article about the Veyron was revised by me after reading the automotoportal.com article. So, that and the msn.com articles are the source. It has already been pointed out that Bugatti is deliberately under-estimating the power of the car on their website, which is a maketing decision they have made. That does not alter the actual horsepower of the vehicle as confirmed by Bugatti. Please restore the article to the way it was. There is an old Hungarian proverb: When 2 people say you are drunk, lie down! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.61.189.14 (talk) 14:17, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

so what does it mean? are you drunk? you're lying down? Or am I getting you wrong? --BSI (talk) 18:24, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
Hi. I wish to support BSI in the debate with this boorish and ill-mannered editor (207.61.189.14), who cannot even be bothered to post in the appropriate place or sign his comments. To him I say, proof, verifiable, reliable proof; this is what the article requires and what you're unable to come up with. When you do, if by any chance it differs from the current content, we'll be happy to add it to the article. In the meantime, I suggest you abstain from insulting good-faith editors. ↔ Dennywuh (talk) 16:47, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

I put forward 2 sources and also corrected a mistake made by the person who revised the article and used old, inaccurate information that flies in the face of Bugattis' open pronouncements to the media about the true horsepower of the Veyron, despite the 'official' numbers. VW is known in the industry for underrating the horsepower of their engines across their entire product line. This is nothing new. The response I got was one incorrect statement about who quoted who, and no other response to the merits of the sources quoted. Do you have some reliable, cogent evidence that the statements in the articles are incorrect? If so, please put it forward and spare me the ad hominem attacks, which do nothing to advance your position. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.61.189.14 (talk) 17:31, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

Picture of the keys

In the article there is a picture of the keys. But in a wallpaper I saw these other keys in the Veyron, and they are much more modern looking and more stylish and there're actually in the keyhole in the production Veyron. Whereas the keys in the picture on here look kind of dated and very worn, so maybe they're the keys from the old EB110 or one of the old Bugatti concepts or from the original Veyron concept?


The picture of the key http://www.dieselstation.com/wallpapers/albums/Bugatti/Veyron/Bugatti-Veyron-065.jpg

The gallery it's from http://www.dieselstation.com/news/automotive/bugatti-veyron.html


--Dustin ॐ 20:45, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

Fair enough. What do you suggest? ↔ Dennywuh (talk) 21:00, 13 December 2007 (UTC)
I know the Veyron has a special key to unlock top speed, is it possible that one of these keys in the ignition and the other is the top speed key. --Daniel J. Leivick (talk) 21:07, 13 December 2007 (UTC)
That's true. As the caption says, "ignition keys," and in this other picture, it it obvious that it is inserted into the "Top Speed" keyhole. —Mr. Grim Reaper at 23:05, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

the key shown on dieselstation.com is the speed key - as can be seen on bugatti.com. The key shown in the article is the actual ignition key - as can be seen in the Veyron configurator on bugatti.com.--79.212.254.145 (talk) 14:02, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

I am under the impression that the ignition and speed keys are indeed one and the same. To set it into top speed mode, you start the car, open the drivers door, insert the ignition key into the speed keyhole, turn it from handling mode to speed mode, do the pre drive checks (though strictly speaking your advised to do these before driving any car) then start and drive it.
no you're absolutely wrong. they are two different keys.--91.10.217.202 (talk) 21:18, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

Performance Section

It is badly worded and makes a few fake claims, so I am going to have a whack at editing it, someone else should check my edits however. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.207.52.152 (talk) 11:15, 21 December 2007 (UTC)


Would someone mind reverting it back to normal, I have no idea what this peice of crap pc has done to it, but when I posted my edit it posted something different to the text that was in the edit box, so I used the revert function and it has reverted it to a different version than the version I chose. Fucking peice of crap (yes that refers both to me and this pos pc).

It wont let me revert (it says it will revert it but changes nothing), so I copied and pasted the text from a correct version, and that, while improving it, still isnt working properly (for what ever reason its not showing headings?! The preview function is useless as it showed the edit coming up the way I intended for christs sake —Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.207.52.152 (talk) 12:16, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

Hennessy Viper and SSC Aero

The Hennessy Viper is not a production car, Hennessy is a tuner. The Aero and Hennessy cannot even touch the Veyron's acceleration and deceleration numbers. Not even close. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.116.238.69 (talk) 04:29, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

Archive This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.