Talk:Brabham BT46
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[edit] Merge
Think I carried out the merge correctly - although sadly the process doesn't seem to carry any of the previous history across. Just to say anyway that although I missed the fact that there was already a 'Brabham fancar' article when I started on the BT46B article, I have actually used pretty much everything that was in that article before merging the two. Thanks to all those who had contributed to it. 4u1e 15:33, 11 March 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Uncertain elements
Two elements I'm not quite sure about:
- The sequence of banning, withdrawal etc. I think it goes: 1. Ecclestone withdraws the car. 2. FIA investigate legality of its win. 3. FIA allow Brabham to keep win, but ban concept in future.
- When and where the ban on 'moveable aerodynamic devices' came into effect. I thought it referred to the ban on the more fiendish devices introduced in F1 around 1969, which wouldn't have had the fan effect in mind - but there may have been a more general ban put in place after the Chaparral 2J came out. 4u1e 09:26, 12 March 2006 (UTC)
[edit] BT46
Noting that the material on the base BT46 is getting quite long. It may be better to split off the BT46 and the BT46C into articles of their own to prevent this one getting too long. Alternatively I could work it up into a longer single article on BT46 and variants (which would require renaming). 4u1e
- OK, so proposed structure would be:
- Lead
- BT46
- Concept
- Racing History
- BT46B
- Concept
- Racing History
- Aftermath (or something less dramatic, but nothing comes to mind at present)
- BT46C
- Concept
- Racing History
- BT46
- Lead
- 4u1e 28 June 2006
I ended up renaming the article to BT46 and rearranging the old material with a few new bits to fit the structure above. I've fixed all the pages linking here as well - some of them were already redirecting from 'Fancar' 4u1e
[edit] See Alsos
Nothing to get too excited about - I picked the original set of cars (Penske-Indy500 (pushrod engine), Lotus 88 (twin chassis), Mazda 787B (rotary engine) and Chapparal 2J (fan generated downforce)) as examples of cars that had used unusual technology successfully and then been banned.
The Tyrrell P34 meets the first criterion - using unusual technology successfully, but not the second one because it wasn't banned (well not at the time anyway - six-wheelers were banned in the early 1980s I think, after March and Williams had both investigated the idea of four rear wheels). The idea was abandoned because Goodyear couldn't/wouldn't support it any more.
I should perhaps have made that clearer on the page itself. I'm inclined to remove the P34 from this section - but am I being too picky about this? 4u1e
- I've removed most of these now. I'll try and work the Lotus 88 and Penske-Mercedes back into the text at some point. 4u1e 11:24, 2 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] GA passed
It just need one minor adjustment, the first image doesn't give its fair use rationales. Every thing else is good. Maybe working on the criticisms, reception of the monocoques and those kind of things would make the article better. Lincher 03:01, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Alfa Romeo links
Note that "Alfa Romeo" is deliberately linked to the redirect Alfa Romeo (Formula One) rather than to Alfa Romeo in motorsport#Formula One. The idea is that Alfa Romeo (Formula One) is a single place to which to link all F1-related instances of "Alfa Romeo", so that if the place where Alfa Romeo's F1 involvement is described ever changes, we just need to update a single redirect, rather than updating all the individual links (of which there are many). -- DH85868993 01:34, 31 March 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Legality of the "fan car"... again
Hi. Having just read a superb interview with Gordon Murray it is interesting to note that his explanation of the technical aftermath resultant from their Anderstorp performance is somewhat different to that presented on the page here. Specifically, he states: "after the race the FIA sealed the car in the truck ... and then came to the factory with an anemometer. They got us to run the engine, and measured the flow of air through the fan and through the radiator. They found that 60 percent of the air was for cooling, and 40 percent for downforce ... So the FIA wrote to us and said, 'The car is legal, but it's using a loophole in the regulations ... you can use it for the rest of the season'." I realise that this contradicts the usually excellent 8W, and not having a copy of Alan Henry's book to hand I can't say what he wrote, but does anybody else have anything "fron the horse's mouth", that gives an indication one way or t'other? Pyrope 14:22, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
- It's not "from the horse's mouth", but page 186 of Henry's book says "Lotus and Tyrrell immediately protested the BT46B after its win, but the race stewards decided not to adjudicate on the matter and the whole affair was eventually referred to the CSI via the Swedish national club. Meanwhile, the Formula 1 Constructors' Association came up with a remarkable contra-deal whereby Ecclestone's team could use the fan car until August 1 - i.e. through the French, British and German Grands Prix - and then had to discard the idea. However, the CSI's special commission, which met on June 23, decided to reject this "consensus" approach and decreed that fans were banned from Formula 1 henceforth." DH85868993 15:20, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
- Ah, more contradiction. Hmm. I wonder if GM's memory is playing him false? As the CSI meeting was apparantly only six days after the GP, their decision would preclude Murray's recollection that the car was initially passed as legal. According to GM the cars were transported back to the UK, in a sealed container, and then run-up at the Brabham factory under supervision of the FIA. Allowing for a day or so to transport, and then a day for testing, a day to write the letter, and then three-four days to post that from France to the UK, it is possible that the FIA scrutineers acted before the CSI council. But I can't believe that they would have said anything like "you can use it for the rest of the season" without getting approval from on high, and that would have also take time. Case unsolved. Darn. Pyrope 15:35, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
