Talk:BMW M3

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[edit] Horsepower Discrepancy

I noticed a series of reverts regarding the E46's HP total. It's basically the same engine worldwide, but due to differing emissions standards, states of tune, location of catalytic converters, etc. the cited HP total varies depending on version. To clarify, I've added the SAE net HP total. I believe the Euro-spec E46 produces 343 HP as measured by the DIN method. If somebody wants to point that out, that's fine, but as long as one HP figure is called out as belonging to one standard or another, it should avoid the controversy.

Any suggestions are welcome.

Sirimiri 04:47, August 4, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] M4 talk

It's bothersome having to wait for BMW AG to figure out how they are going to market the E90-based coupe. Will it be the "4" or still be a "3"? Many people claim to know, but until BMW actually says it, and spits the vehicle out for the automotive press, it's just conjecture. So I've altered the supposed "///M4" paragraph to reflect this. Thoughts? --Sirimiri 01:24, 21 November 2005 (UTC)

IMHO, while it's conjecture, it has no place on Wikipedia: I wouldn't even bother mentioning possible names. Roddyp 09:46, 21 November 2005 (UTC)

Also, 2005 Frankfurt Motor Show has now passed without announcement AFAIK, and the only thing I see with a named source implies the E90 M3 won't launch (at least in the US) until Mid 2008. http://www.autospies.com/article/index.asp?articleId=5901&categoryId= Roddyp 12:14, 21 November 2005 (UTC)

-- Here's a recent M3/M4 entry: http://www.eurocarblog.com/post/72/bmw-m-news-m3-m5-touring-and-m6-csl I upped the hp in the entry to 425 -- I've seen 400, 425, and 450, so I just picked the middle one. "The M3 E90 is confirmed for 2007, with its 4.0 V8 (425 hp) derived from the M5/M6 V10". I don't know how accurate this is, but is is recent. And in german :-) Morcheeba

[edit] External Links

Is it me or are the links at the bottom beginning to border on spam? Especially with the long "informational sidebars" about each link? Opinions? --Sirimiri 22:21, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

I certainly think that the two that reference new paddles and a brake pedal are definitely spam and vote for their removal. BarnacleKB 04:27, 17 March 2006 (UTC)
I concur and am removing the two BarnacleKB mentioned. Dave Messina 00:48, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
Sorry about my "spam" I didn't realize what was going on until i got a message about it. Still new to wikipedia and all. Anyway, I realize that any site with ads is deemed as a "commercial site" and won't post mine there anymore. Furthermore i have removed another one from the extgernal links page because it had ads, just as mine did, however these ads were tricking users as if they were articles on the site. They were located at the bottom of the page. Sorry for any troubles and please forgive me. I will try and update this page without using links in the future. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.42.249.154 (talk) 05:50, 4 May 2007 (UTC).
Thanks for cleaning up the other link. One problem with the link you inserted was that it simply scrapped content from other official sources. Feel free to link to official sources when you update any details. References to official sources are great - external links, not so much. Nposs 13:37, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
Sure thing and thank you —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.42.249.154 (talk) 05:29, 7 May 2007 (UTC).

[edit] copyvio?

Is this the original or is the wiki article the original? BabuBhatt 22:33, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] M3 CSL

I'm almost 100% certain that there are more M3 CSL's made than stated in the article. I've seen 3 in Glasgow, UK and I doubt we own 1/40th of CSLs ever made. And they defo were not all delivered to the US. Anyway, far be it from me to amend someone elses article but I think you should take a look into this. Gart 17:59, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

If you're referring to the E36, no, the numbers are as correct as possible. (BTW, the E36 CSL was only imported to the USA, so chances of you seeing that car in Glasgow is remarkably slim...) --BarnacleKB 00:06, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] M3 GTR

I think there should be an article completely about the M3 GTR. If someone could create it, it would be wonderful. Ez5698 13:34, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

it is quite a different car, but I don't think there's enough stuff to go into a separate article.. and this article isn't that long anyways

The new E92 M3 GTR will have the S85 V10 engine fitted to it, producing over 507 bhp. However, speculation exists that it might be a superiorly tuned V8. The E46 M3 GTR borrowed the M5 engine from the E39 series and produced 400 bhp.--Samfisch 13:56, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] NPOV

This article is incredibly biased, and uses lots of statements that appear to be someones personal opinion. Also some of the facts and figures are questionable (all M3 CSLs were delivered to the USA?! I don't think so.). TiHead 15:55, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

All E36 M3 CSLs (model year 1995) were delivered to the USA. All E46 M3 CSLs (about model year 2001) were delivered everywhere but North America. --BarnacleKB 01:01, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

Jeez, this is one of those articles that is constantly being edited with junk along the lines of "everyone agrees that...". WHERE DOES IT SAY THAT EVERYONE AGREES! TiHead 16:05, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

Ti, can you point to the examples that are upsetting you? I can't argue with or against you, unless I know what you refer to. --BarnacleKB 01:01, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] M3 CSL

Can someone fix up the CSL article? I'm a new Wikipedian, and even to me it's obvious that the section on the CSL seems only to focus on the USA. There are CSLs in the UK and rest of Europe too.

The reason that the E36 CSL section only focuses on the USA is because the E36 CSL was only imported to the USA. However, the E46 CSL was sold everywhere but North America. --BarnacleKB 01:06, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] E46 M3 CSL

umm the article seems to be only mentioning about the E36 M3 CSL.

from what I've seen, there is an E46 based CSL too.

will someone please clarify  :)

Dstan 09:40, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] References?

Not a single reference for the whole page. This needs looking into. --Gavinio 09:28, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] This article should begin with the current year model

Casual readers who are not car buffs will come to this article wanting specs on the most recent models.. instead this article starts with the 1980s. I suggest you go in reverse chonological order starting with the most recent models. 71.139.53.239 08:47, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

i agree, but im not the person to do it cuz im pretty new to wiki
I have to disagree, every other car article goes in chronological order. Reversing it would be highly confusing. If anyone wants info on the E46 they can easily scroll down. Besides there is a picture of the E46 at the top. --Daniel J. Leivick 01:47, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
If keeping true to Wikipedia form wasn't a good enough reason, I really doubt that "casual readers who are not car buffs" would actually be looking for "specs," no matter for what model. Shawn D. 17:49, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] S2000?

"BMW gained fame for the ability to produce more than 100 horsepower per litre (333 bhp/3.2 litre) in a naturally aspirated automobile engine, while Honda had already raised the record to 120 hp /litre in the Honda S2000."

I don't think the last sentence regarding the powerplant of the S2000 is relevant info to this article. This is an article about the m3 not an article discussing which NA engines has the highest hp/l.

[edit] Evo

the lancer evo, or wrx, or skyline gtr r34 are in no way similar to the bmw e46 m3. whoever wrote that is a dumb shit becasue first of all those aforementioned cars are all AWD (all wheel drive) and are ricers. not superior german made automobiles.


BMW > all else

msc for life


can you try to be a little less bigoted and offensive please? ricer is offensive. calling someone a "dumb shit" is offensive. and stating that german cars are superior offends me, because of that statements stupdity. while the lancer evolution and subaru STi are based on WRC cars and are very different, the Skyline R34 GTR is very similar to a BMW E46 M3, they are both coupes derived from sporting saloons, they are both straight 6 engined cars. The main differences between the two are that due to its turbo charged engine, and 4WD, the Skyline has far more potential for tuning and racing.

I realise that using English is hard for you, why dont you stick to Yahoo chat, myspace or playing CS, where you can type "pwnt" and "OMGLOL" to your hearts content.Sennen goroshi 04:12, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] e36 m3

I'm a bit concerned about the top speed figures for this particular model, can anyone validate them? I've seen numerous sites that report it as roughly 137-140MPH as top speed. beastx 12:46, 30 December 2006 (UTC)beastx

Ridiculous. That's the top speed of the E36 328i. The M3 had +95-129 bhp and many performance-tuned components over the E36 328i. At 286-320 bhp (different years) and a lighter weight vs. the 343 bhp E46 M3, had about the same top speed. Aadieu (talk) 10:22, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Too many lists

This article has too many lists. While the information is sometime valid, it makes that page difficult to read and overly long. If there aren't any valid objections I am going to trim this page down significantly. Daniel J. Leivick 01:12, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

I would start with the lists of "appearance/performance modifications" for all the model variants. Deon Steyn 06:04, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
Just because you think there are too many lists doesn't mean you should entirely remove historically significant models. While I disagree with removing information from what is supposed to be an encyclopedia, I feel a good compromise has now been reached. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 199.243.115.234 (talk) 18:05, 12 January 2007 (UTC).
It is not because I think there were too many list, it was out of sync with the rest of cars pages. I tried to incorporate some of the relevant info into paragraphs rather then lists. Do not accuse users of vandalism when this is clearly not the case, every edit I make is good faith. Daniel J. Leivick 18:18, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The first M3 was based on the 1986s E30 range, and there has been an M version of every 3-Series since?

Is this statement correct? As far as I am aware there was no E30 M3 Touring model and there was no E36 M3 compact model.

It is correct that there was no official E30 M3 touring model. The only E30 M3 versions were the 2-door version and the cabriolet. Even the Baur Cabriolet option was not available for the M3 (since that would not have been compatible with the less steep rear window that is typical for the M3, compared with the normal E30 M3.
However, the statement that there was no E36 M3 compact is not true. The model was never commercialized, but there is at least one official E36 M3 compact (now added to the article).--GillesAmez (talk) 06:55, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Whilst the E36 compact is not considered by many as a true 3 series BMW it is still badged as either a 318 ti or 325 ti. This makes the above statement false and should be removed. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 196.44.229.201 (talk) 11:28, 8 January 2007 (UTC).

Statement is correct. 3 compact is a 3 series. BMW determines what cars are what series, not snobby Wikipedians. 24.123.235.43 01:49, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
Indeed. The correct internal chassis code for the E36 compact is E36/5 (E36/4 being the saloon, E36/2 being the coupe, E36/2C being the cabriolet, E36/3 being the touring, E36/7 being the Z3 roadster and E36/8 being the Z3 coupe).
Moreover, the models stated by 'unsigned', are incorrect. Yes, there was a E36 318ti compact, but no E36 325ti compact. The E36 compact model with six cylinder petrol engine was named 323ti, although it had the 2.5-litre engine (but all 2.5-litre engines were named 2.3 at that time, for two reasons: 1) it created psychological distance from the 2.8-litre models at the time, and 2) the 170 DIN-hp 2.5-litre engines (as in the 323ti) had less power than the previous 2.5-litre 24 valve engines (delivering 192 DIN-hp), and BMW estimated that the customer would react negatively to a power decrease (192 DIN-hp to 170 DIN-hp) of a model evolution, hence the fictional rename to 2.3
There was a 325ti compact, but that was the top of the line model of the E46 compact series.--GillesAmez (talk) 07:00, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] E92 M3

The article says that the new m3 will have either an automatic or smg tranny, indirectly saying that it wont have a manual option.. i find this very, very hard to believe.. the m5 has smg standard, but there is a 6 speed manual option at no extra cost, and i think it will be the same for the new m3.. and im not so sure about the x-drive on the m3.. why not put it on the m5/m6/m-coupe then? it will probably have rear wheel drive, like a real sports car, and like ALL current M-models

BMW will not offer the M3 in a Steptronic Automatic. It will be SMG III or a 6 Speed manual. BMW would never, ever offer the M3 in an Auto. Never. The E46 had no Automatic, to my knowledge or the article's apparent knowledge.


In response to the above, I'm curious if SMG III even exists, and if it does, how long it would be used for. I've heard from numerous sites that SMG is dead, and that BMW is working on DSG, though I'm not sure when DSG will be ready. Also, I wonder if the manual will be a 7-speed.


The E36 M3 had an auto tranny for a couple years. Luckily, they realized how stupid that was. Sooooo I guess the correct thing would be to say, "never AGAIN." =)

[edit] New Photo

User RN318 added a large photo and associated description into the article. I don't think the article needs to discuss a specific vehicle in such detail and have such a large photo of it. Any thoughts? --Daniel J. Leivick 21:45, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] M3 Pricing

This article states that the M3 will be priced over $100,000 in the US. That make no sense, whomever wrote that is definitively an Idiot. That would make it the flagship vehicle for BMW, exceeding both the M5 and M6 in MSRP. The person who figured that price plugged the UK price and then went through a currency exchange simulator and got a seriously wrong number. I would encourage no one to put definitive answers on this page without checking it. That price is absurd. I really doubt the new M3 will be twice as expensive as the E46 variant. --Samfisch 14:04, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Indeed. Brits get screwed on car prices because of the VAT. You can't simply plug UK prices into a currency converter to get US prices. Just look at the UK vs. US prices of the regular 3-series, for example. The British version is enormously more expensive. If the UK price is listed as £50,625, I'd be willing to bet the US price will be near to around US$55,000. In the meantime, I'm deleting this US price figure until someone can come up with something useful and cite it. RobertM525 19:52, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] rewrite e92 m3

alrite, this section can be much better.. theres a lotta new stuff on the new m3 that can be put in there... a picture for example... check out this site for starters [1]. i mean, just look at the rs4's article. come onnnn, everyone knows the new m3s gnna pwn the rs4. Sadartha 15:40, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Bmw e46 tuning 29 small.jpg

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[edit] M3 talk

sorry im just new to wikipedia trying to get everything down, carry on with your conversations

Imuhbeachbum 17:27, 20 July 2007 (UTC)perryImuhbeachbum 17:27, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] BMW M3

The resale value for BMW M3 is very low in UAE and for this reason many people do not buy the car and go for Toyota and Nissan as a better alternative choice and value for money. It is important for a customer to have a resale value for a valuble product such as a car. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 163.119.135.63 (talk) 17:52, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] BMW E36 M3 compact

I added the correct information concerning the E36 M3 compact today. I already did that some weeks ago, but user Hu12 deleted the changes i made, although all the information is 100% correct and can be verified on different sites on the internet. I included a foot note now, referring to the magazine where the said car is tested. I also edited the E46 M3 Competition Package section, since there was noted thet it was only available in the US and UK, which is incorrect (the Competition Package was available on almost every market). --GillesAmez (talk) 06:34, 21 April 2008 (UTC)