Talk:Blowback (arms)

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Contents 1 Created new article, moved some content. 2 Paintball and airsoft blowback 3 Proposed merge from various blowback stub articles 4 schematics and images 5 Asams10 - CETME Ameli - roller-delayed blowback

[edit] Created new article, moved some content.

I've moved the section of this article discussing blowback as the vacuum evacuation of a firearm's barrel to a new article at blowback (forensics)

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[edit] Paintball and airsoft blowback

Maybe I should've discussed it in the talk page before editing, but I do think that blowback for paintball and airsoft guns does warrent at least a cursory mention here. It's exactly the same operation; pressurized gases primarily used for the propulsion of a projectile are also partially used to cycle the action. The only difference is that in firearms, the gases come from a chemical reaction, where in paintball/airsoft guns they come from a reservoir, be it the gas chamber in a pistol mag, or a bulk CO2 tank. --UNHchabo 20:54, 31 March 2006 (UTC)

I don't doubt you at all on how they operate. However, I don't think they belong in an article about firearms. They are, by definition, not firearms and therefore while the principle might appear similar, it is a totally different useage. It would be proper to list it under the disambiguation page instead if you deem it important enough. --Asams10 21:15, 31 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Proposed merge from various blowback stub articles

AGREE I think if we put all the little stub blowback articles into this we'd have one very nice article. Toggle-delayed blowback Roller-delayed blowback Lever-delayed blowback Gas-delayed blowback Blowback (forensics) Chamber-ring delayed blowback Arthurrh 18:52, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

• Agree, except the forensics one. Leibniz 20:59, 1 September 2007 (UTC)
• Agree, And I merged most of them, but I agree with Leibniz and will nog merge the forensics one with this one, as it is not abot a blowback type, but about a vacuum effect. If consensus about this is reached, we can remove the merge tag. --Boris Barowski 14:21, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

Ok, I agree with the logic. I've removed the merge request. Arthurrh 17:13, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

Based on the concensus expressed, Boris has merged the articles and fixed some redirects, I've gone through and cleaned up the resulting redundancy as well as tried to order and format the article for readability. I also added some references and a section on piston primer operation that is more a form of blowback than it is gas operation.--Asams10 16:54, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] schematics and images

This article could use some schematics, drawings or pictures to illustrate the different systems. --Boris Barowski 18:45, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

I've got the Pedersen Patent that I think would produce a fine drawing with a little coloring for hesitation blowback. I'd like to refine the other Pedersen patent drawing for toggle-delay for clarity too, take out the lines and numbers and color it in some. If there's a good 'lever-delay' one out there as well as piston primer one, that'd help out alot.--Asams10 16:57, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

I added the reqphoto template - ideal would be an animated GIF showing how it works. Tempshill 06:03, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Asams10 - CETME Ameli - roller-delayed blowback

Regarding the CETME Ameli light machinegun - I added this to the "roller delayed" subsection of "delayed blowback", but you reverted this, stating "rv: incorrect, roller locking and roller-delayed blowback are not the same thing."

I agree with you that roller-locked short recoil systems with moving barrels (for example, the MG42) are "not the same thing" as roller-delayed blowback firearms with fixed barrels (e.g. CETME Models A, B and C, HK G3).

However, according to the Ameli's manufacturer, General Dynamics Santa Bárbara Sistemas (sorry, I can't link directly, as that site uses frames):

"The machine gun has a CETME semi rigid bolt system using rollers permiting (sic) the use of any ammunition of the appropriate caliber." GD/SBS site, click on Products and Projects / Weapons Systems / Light Weapons / Ameli - Light Machine Gun

I interpret this as the Ameli using the same roller-delayed blowback system as the CETME rifles.

The Ameli may externally resemble an MG42 that shrunk in the wash, but it has a completely different operating system.

I respectfully request that you restore my edit.

GMan552 (talk) 05:41, 3 May 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for your thorough response. I stand corrected on the technical issue, however I have another issue that is more substantial. While true, there is no reason to have this example in the article as it's highly obscure. That's a subjective issue, however since I didn't know about it, it's probably not common knowledge. If you are using it as an illustrative example, you should use examples that are common, well known, etc. This weapon was made in limited numbers and issued only to the Spanish Army according to the Wikipedia Article. However, I'm not sure there is a better illustrative example of a machinegun available. Can we give it a week for other comments? --'''I am Asamuel''' (talk) 17:08, 3 May 2008 (UTC)

Fair enough - the Ameli isn't that well-known, although I still wish I could own one (and afford to feed it.)

GMan552 (talk) 17:17, 3 May 2008 (UTC)