Talk:Black comedy

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Contents 1 bad santa 2 wikiplagiarism 3 ok 4 Black humour? 5 Vandalised 6 Dead baby jokes 7 Difference between this and tragicomedy 8 Monty Python and the Holy Grail 9 New Addition 10 Films 11 Color metaphors? 12 Some films 13 Songs? 14 Real-life use 15 Courage the Cowardly dog 16 African American Humor 17 Television 18 Problems with the list 19 Removal of the List 20 Gaia Online? 21 hopscotch to oblivion 22 Applications 23 Is black comedy even a distinct genre anymore? 24 Why then?

[edit] bad santa

A guy drinking way too much and fucking around while stealing as a way of delivering comedy? This isn't black comedy, this is just another bad modern american crapfest. Does bad santa really need to be included in this article as one of the examples when timeless classics of the genre like who is afraid of virginia woolf or arsenic and oldlace exist?

[edit] wikiplagiarism

"topics and events that are usually treated seriously — death, mass murder, suicide, domestic abuse, sickness, madness, fear, drug abuse, rape, war, terrorism etc. — are treated in a humorous or satirical manner."

google define:black comedy "humor is derived from subjects which are typically considered "serious", or for which humor is usually considered as unsuitable: death, war, misery"

ok people, just rearranging words and using synonyms does not disqualify something from being plagiarism. stupid assholes.

Nothing is Original, even if you tried to be.

Information that is common knowledge and not the original idea of the author does not qualify as plagiarism. The google definition does not seek to provide additional insight beyond simply defining the term and such information is generally regarded as common knowledge. To paraphrase it is not plagiarism. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.79.205.208 (talk) 16:25, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] ok

Is there any reason for "etc" to be linked in the list of "controversial topics" near the top of the article? I dunno, it just struck me as strange.--Tossrock 11:51, 31 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Black humour?

Isn't Black humour a more accurate name for it? I've never heard anyone say black comedy, yet I've head black humour being used. -- Joolz 01:23, 12 Mar 2005 (UTC)

I've seen black comedy describing whole works like Dr. Strangelove, with black humor describing specific jokes. Lefty 02:28, 2005 Mar 12 (UTC)

Good point. I think black humour refers to the concept, whilst black comedy refers to a program/book/works with black humour in it. -- Joolz 14:26, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC)

And besides too, if we were to rename the article to "Black Humor" we'd have continual fights about how to spell it. Lefty 15:18, 2005 Mar 18 (UTC)

In colloquial German the terms "British humour" and "black humour" usually refer to the same thing.

Is there any historical basis for black humour being considered "typically British"? Is this kind of humour also referred to as British in English speaking countries (other than the UK)? -- Ashmodai 12:25, 26 July 2005 (UTC)

Have always heard it called dark comedy or dark humour. I prefer this term since it's free of racial connotation. My vote would be to rename the article and redirect "black humor/comedy" to that. Ckamaeleon 18:10, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

I dont understand your complaint. Jack Cain 00:26, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

Dude what do you mean you don't understand his complaint I was going to try to change the name and I think the name is racist--Yowiki 05:46, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

This complaint itself is racist. That anything titled "black" is racially based is very narrow-minded. The term "black humor" supersedes racial barriers and refers to something that has been around for longer than the terms "black" and "white" for race. The automatic assumption that anything with either color term must relate to race is a sign of one's own polarization and oversensitivity, which has become far to common in today's society. Black humor is a universal term to all English speakers as this article defines. Learn to think deeper next time before you start a racial debate where one never existed. Garnet avi 11:05, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

I disagree with that Garnet. It could be considered racist because people do refer to "black humor" as humor specifically tailored to African Americans. On top of that, dark humor is a much more common term. 24.15.230.144 02:36, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

No, Garnet is right. How on earth can anybody be so narrow-minded? The term "black comedy/humour" isn't racist at all! Are you going to say I'm racist because I refer to a certain bird as a "blackbird"? Or how about a certain cat a "black panther"? Or how about "blackmail"? Huh? Are you people going to call me a racist now?

"Oh, Mummy! Some kid gave me a black eye at school!"

"Shut up, you little racist hooligan, and go to your room!"

Please stop being so oversensitive, people.

Don't pay any attention to them, Garnet avi.

I don't know, I've always heard the term "dark comedy." Here in America there IS such a thing as black humor, which is quite different and refers to African-American orientated comedy such as Chappelle's Show, Chris Rock, etc which is obviously different than what this article is covering. I'm not trying to be overly sensitive or any hogwash like that, just throwing my opinion into the ring because they ARE two different things (over here). 72.154.13.23 08:47, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

i always belived that it was called black humour becuase it originally evolved from the film noir (black in french) movement —Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.165.56.13 (talk) 14:15, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

I agree that the name isn't right. It's not racist, but when I found a link to black comedy on wikipedia, I expected comedy typical of African-Americans. Chapelle Show as stated earleir is an excellent example. So it's not that the title is racist, but that it does not refer to what many Americans think of as black comedy. Dark humour is a term that I hear quite a lot more often meaning what this article attributes to black comedy. 71.120.201.39 19:31, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

The name would be racist to some people who never heard of this, it's just that some people would think that when you come to this article that you would find stuff like African-American humor because the name was BLACK humor and when I came here I thought the same thing and when I found stuff like dead baby jokes I'm not saying any body is racist it's just that I thought people on wikipedia thought this is what ya'll thought we joked about but this just going to grow larger so we should just change the name,oh and the person who put that saying stuff like blackbird, blackpanther, blackmail, and blackeye is retarded see black bird color of the bird is black no body thinks that is racist no body thinks any of the thing you put in your complaint is racist but I always wondered why they called it blackmail but its not racist to the new world neither are any of the things you put in your complaint. --Yowiki (talk) 16:56, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

The name isn't "racist"; it is not intended to insult anybody, and it isn't based on any racial stereotype. It is ambiguous and a little confusing, however, since "black" has two distinct meanings. - JasonAQuest (talk) 12:43, 29 December 2007 (UTC)

Black is a colour... There is NO other meaning for this word, and "Black Race" is called "black" due to colour of their skin. JUST STOP IT! We have Black Metal, Black Sabbath, Black Gold, Black Diamonds, Black Pencils and Ink and NO ONE in sane mind will rename them to Dark Metal, Ebony Sabbath and/or Afro-American Diamonds! Duh... Non-racist people usually associate colours with colours - Black, White and Yellow are no exeptions to it... As to offensiveness - calling a person Negroid and/or Mongoloid is usually presumed more offensive, while Afro-American and Asian terms are sometimes incorrect geographically. =\ You won't describe a Kenyan as Afro-American race? While some white-skinned North-African (example - Tunisian Arab) living in USA would technically be Afro-American, albeit never adressed to as. ;) So, just get that Afro-American shit out of this page altogether! Black is NOT an offensive word... Or you would suggest renaming British humour to somethng else, because some people would get offended by someone calling them Brits, huh? And as for humour - (here) it is always called "black", NEVER "dark", and "British humour" has a different meaning where I live. 195.238.190.248 (talk) 23:29, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Vandalised

This page has been vandalised; or someone has removed all the formatting. There is no paragaphing, or spaces. Could someone with the knowledge revert to a previous form; and perhaps a semi-protection is in order? Unconscious 21:44, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Dead baby jokes

I have a problem with saying that Black Comedy being like "dead baby jokes". I don't think they are in any way like each other, Black Comedy satirize important topics, not to trivialise them but to emphasise their importance. Dead baby jokes are just jokes in really bad taste. Thomas.mcmahon 13 September 2005

Sick humor. -- Fergdude33 23:40, 22 September 2005 (UTC)

I'm going to have to agree with that; the "dead baby jokes" example really takes it a bit too far, especially so close to the beginning of the article. Perhaps that could be modified to provide a better explanation of the concept behind black humor. Eccomi 06:53, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

Black humour IS about taking it TOO FAR! Duh! The genre (as all others) are defined stylistically, and NOT by just a list of topics... So, anything that is making fun of the things, which are usually presumed as sad/bad/otherwise negative can technically be considered black humour, including dead baby jokes, AS LONG as they fit the definitions of the genre. Of course they could fit other genres as well, but don't say that this is too much to be black humour. As to examples, no need to specify THAT precise, "dealing with topics, such as death" should be enought, absolutely not required to point out, whose death it might be. ;) 195.238.190.248 (talk) 23:35, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Difference between this and tragicomedy

The article on tragicomedy claims to be also about black comedy. I think the two terms are related but different, and need to be differentiated. 66.167.253.16 07:14, 22 October 2005 (UTC).

I don't think it's tragicomedy unless the audience actually sympathizes with and is moved by the "tragic" part. For example, Weekend at Bernie's's central joke is the slapstick humor of two guys abusing Bernie's corpse (as well as a commentary on the egotism of the 1980s, but that's another story). It would be a tragicomedy if we had a connection with Bernie and felt that dragging his body behind a speeding motor boat were cruel or disrepectful of his remains. But the movie establishes at the very beginning how much of a jerk Bernie was when he was alive. Consequently, we don't feel sorry for him--and we don't take his degradation seriously. It's a dark comedy. That's my take on it. Ckamaeleon 18:18, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Monty Python and the Holy Grail

Is that really considered black humour?.. I love the film myself, but hardly see it as being of that genre. Satires in general are not all black comedies. DrWho42 22:56, 26 December 2005 (UTC)

Sure it's satirical, but there are quite a few scenes where death and dismemberment are played for laughs. Tehw1k1 05:36, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

Are you serious? There is nothing "black" about that comidy utc such and such

"BRING OUT YER DEAD!" I'd think that piling rotting human corpses for laughs probably falls under this category. 71.120.201.39 19:33, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

Oh heavens NO! The whole tenure of Holy Grail is humour and that is exactly why it doesn't qualify as black comedy. A prerequisite for a film's being a black comedy is that the humour is implicit in the situation rather than overt. "Bring out yer dead!" is obviously so absurd and delicioulsly silly that it is meant to be funny. Dr Strangelove's qoutes like "Gentelmen, please! No fighting --- this is the war room!" is funny because it takes reflection to see that it's funny. Get it?

There should be some mention of MP in the subject matter because there are several scenes in several of their movies that are black. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.55.54.106 (talk) 16:08, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] New Addition

I am adding the Oddworld series to the video games section.

-TR

I added Snuff Box to the television section

- Northy666

I added The Job and Rescue Me to the television section. --IsItSafe? 05:07, 12 August 2007 (UTC) 1:06 AM 8/12/2007

[edit] Films

I added the Roger Corman films A Bucket of Blood and The Little Shop of Horrors to the films list. Extremely dark low-budget comedy. (Ibaranoff24 20:01, 9 March 2006 (UTC))

[edit] Color metaphors?

"(see also color metaphors for race.)"

This is at the end of the first paragraph in the intro. But I don't understand why it's there. Looking at the color_metaphors_for_race article, I don't see what it has to do with the paragraph. Ckamaeleon 18:21, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

I think that was stealth vandalism, Im removing it. Jack Cain 19:37, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Some films

Some of these films aren't really....comedies. Falling Down? A Clockwork Orange? And The Aristocrats is absolutely sick humor more than black humor. what're the criteria for being admitted to the list?

• I deleted some titles. I also added Ruthless People. If anybody is wondering why Shaun of the Dead and Ravenous were deleted, it's as simple as this: horror comedy is not black comedy. I can make a note that some horror/comedy films may be considered to be black comedy and then redirect to the list of horror/comedy films if anybody thinks these films should be mentioned. (Ibaranoff24 02:48, 25 May 2006 (UTC))

• • There are ton of titles left in the movie section that just don't make sense as black comedies. The Evil Dead series are horror comedy, and Sympathy for Mr. Vengeance and Oldboy aren't comedies at all. It seems like people are adding movies just because there might be a humorous scene in it. Having a scene or two that makes you laugh doesn't make a movie a comedy.

Is the Cable Guy really a Black Comedy? I've never seen it but just the trailers I remember, and the people I know who liked it, it seems more schlapstick. There's alot of films on here that do not seem like Black Comedy to me. Also, would early John Waters (Mondo Trasho-Polyester) films be Black Comedies?

I believe that Fun with Dick and Jane is Black Comedy and was wondering if it belongs on the list.

Yep I think that this one is a Black Comedy too, more to comedy, but Black Comedy.201.80.113.20 (talk) 12:54, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

Remember that these should be examples and not a comprehensive list. (also remember to sign your posts.) Slavlin 19:39, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

I think the TV show Dead Like Me is a perfect example of black humor. It's not a film, but I think it epitomizes the genre enough that mentioning it might be beneficial. Garnet avi 10:59, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

For Sure, Dead Like me is a Black Comedy, I think Six Feet Under is too, but a little more dramatic.201.80.113.20 (talk) 12:54, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Songs?

If there are lists of books and movies, perhaps there should be a list of notable songs that employ black humor. I may just add one if no one objects.--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back 02:16, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Real-life use

I recall reading stuff about how people use black humour to help deal with extremely stressful situations (such as helicopter pilots in the Vietnam War). Anyone know much about this?--SirNuke 06:34, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

I know of some (many) Jewish jokes that take some pretty depressing issues (persecution, etc.) with humour (sometimes pretty gross), and I suppose that most of them were created to enlighted the situation... You know, to take even the most depressing things more lightly will generally lead to less heart attacks, and, if they weren't created for this purpose - they were at least executed for it... And yes, heard something about guys in the war using humour to help overcome reality. Cannot remember precise, need to find some source in order to include it in the main page. 195.238.190.248 (talk) 23:41, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Courage the Cowardly dog

Is this really a black comedey? I didn't think it realy was :S

Yea, it was. Tree Hugger 01:29, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Yep, such as Invader Zim... I keep wondering, how many animations exist that is based on Black Comedy, and if it is really "Healthy" for the kids...201.80.113.20 (talk) 12:57, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] African American Humor

Whenever I have heard this term used it refered to stuff by the Waynes Brothers or Dave Chapelle. Dark Humor is more often used and is less ambiguous.

Go away. The term "black comedy" has nothing to do with negroes. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.59.9.52 (talk) 19:37, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

I just did a quick check on Google for the uses of "black humour/humor" and "dark humour/homour" and they came out about even (within 100,000 hits over a base of nearly a million, using both spellings). I, personally, have never heard anything except "black humour". Nothwithstanding that bit of OR, if there is any likelihood of confusion over such a politically hot word as "black' and there exists an equally acceptable and prevalent synonym, as there does in this case, then it seems the wiser course to choose the title "Dark Humor" and redirect from "Black Humor" instead of the other way around. As for the immediately preceding comment, "black comedy" does, sometimes have something to do with African-American comics and their works, but the more common use is as described in the article. Bielle (talk) 23:48, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Television

I removed a few television shows which are definately not black comedies, but there are still plenty more that need to be removed. Shows like The Daily Show and The Colbert Report aren't really black comedies, they're merely satirical. Right? --Kronecker 05:20, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

I agree, Kronecker, these two News shows are satirical - good, but satirical. Dennis Leary, on the other hand, is dark and funny. I added The Job and Rescue Me - some listings I've seen, categorize Leary's shows as dramas, but they also list Katie Currick and Anderson Cooper as journalists, so go figure.

Leary's Celtic/Queens/9th Avenue/Avenue "B" brand of humor is f'ing poignant and funny. In Rescue Me, he uses familiar themes, such as wrestling between dropping into a complete spiritual void and taking advice from his "passenger", Jesus Christ (Bernardo De Paula). He takes the advice, albeit reluctantly, but makes a point by flooring his pickup truck into traffic. --IsItSafe? 20:20, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Problems with the list

Some of the people on the list do not try to be funny, only black. Some people try to be funny, not black. Get rid of people on the list who do not try to be funny, and get rid of people whose humor is not Black. Also, I think that the list should include people or works that are more exclusively black humor. Seinfeld may have had possibly one black humor joke, but most of the humor was more lively. Charles Adams had most of his cartoons mock death or ghoulish things, so that is black comedy. Tree Hugger 01:28, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

I think the whole list has to go. It's pretty pointless just listing every piece of black comedy ever. ---- DarthInsinuate 11:09, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

I once contributed to the list, but now believe it's out of control. I will be bold and take it out. Please comment if you disagree.--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back 06:41, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

On the contrary, I endorse this removal. CovenantD 07:10, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

I say to hell with this list. Wiki doesn't really need any more useless lists. --86.145.53.30 21:12, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

How about "The Farside?" 66.91.114.73 17:24, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Removal of the List

The list should be removed. It's not pretty, jutting out the bottom like that, and it's terribly long. Just take one, maybe two, examples of each category and sprinkle them into the rest of the article. Right now, it seems as if people are placing their favorite satirical, not necessarily dark, comedies on the list. JDCAce 21:33, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

I think we need an article called "List of black comedy movies". Put the list there. As far as making sure that the movies are actually dark, we can put each movie to a vote Dav2008 01:06, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

We need to do something, this list is way out of control. DurinsBane87 16:47, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

I don't really think the list is necessary either. I don't see anything on WP:CLS#Advantages_of_lists that we're really doing with this list, though we are attracting some minor internet black comedy stuff that probably should go. I suggest removing it after checking that listed articles are in the appropriate subcategories. I'd be happy to do so if people support that course of action.--Chaser - T 20:22, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

I'm deleting the list. Again.--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back 15:15, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Gaia Online?

I think that including the internet section as Gaia Online's General Discussion board isn't really the best example. There are much better examples of black humour, such as sites like 4chan. Gaia Online always struck me as less black humour and more sexual humour.

[edit] hopscotch to oblivion

should this not be talked about in the article if the image is going to be used? --TimDoster 19:20, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Applications

Would Black comedy apply to satirical threats such as those made by Anonymous? A dipiction of these threats can be seen in this video. --HockeyInJune (talk) 02:08, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Is black comedy even a distinct genre anymore?

In the 60s, everybody seemed to think black humor was a big deal, but nowadays, satire seems to always have some kind of morbid touch. Would Scrubs be considered black humor, since it constantly deals with serious issues? Or the shows on adult swim? The Venture Bros and Frisky Dingo are good examples. In many ways South Park is true to the Stranglove/Vonnegut style, since it exaggerates serious issues as social commentary.

My point is that black comedies were originally very specific types of stories, but they've had such an effect on our culture, that their influence can be seen nearly everywhere. It seems almost pointless to try to classify something as black humor when the definition is so vague that almost anything can fit into it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.92.217.205 (talk) 22:05, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Why then?

Black comedy rose to prominence in the 50s and 60s. It would be nice if there was some discussion of why it was popular in the first place. With the beats in the 50s and the "don't trust anyone over 30" attitude of the late 60s, it seems only natural that comedy would take a more serious turn. People like Kurt Vonnegut and Stanley Kubrick probably wouldn't have been as popular as they were, if society wasn't so intent on redefining itself.

Chaplin's tramp character was popular primarily because of the depression. Despite the slapstick, people could relate to the downtrodden man on the street who was just trying to get by. As far as I can tell, the issues of the 60s (Cold War, Vietnam, Racial/gender activism, etc) were what attracted people to dark humor in the first place.

In my opinion, social relevance is what separates black comedy from morbid comedy. Can't prove it though. Damn. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.92.217.205 (talk) 22:22, 17 February 2008 (UTC)