Talk:Battle of Agincourt

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Archive 1

Contents 1 Primary sources section (original_research?) 2 The Campaign 3 Pronunciation 4 The French hoped to raise 9,000,000 troops 5 The account of the battle is confusing 6 Yes It's St. Crispin's day

[edit] Primary sources section (original_research?)

See Archive 1: Primary sources section (original_research?) for previous discussion.

[edit] The Campaign

See Archive 1: The Campaign for previous discussion.

[edit] Pronunciation

Currently the article says:

(pronounced a zhin kuhr, or /ˈeʤənˌkɔrt/)

What is the source that it is pronounced that way in English? I would have thought that the above was French pronunciation. --Philip Baird Shearer (talk) 08:40, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

This is from the English Pronouncing Dictionary, ISBN 0 521 81693 9, Cambridge University Press:

pronounced /ˈæʤɪnˌkɔːr , ˈæʤɪnˌkɔːt , ˈæʤɪnˌkʊər or ˈæʤɪnˌkɔːrt/.

I would include it, but it's so general it doesn't seem to get us very far.

--Old Moonraker (talk) 13:59, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Personally I've always pronounced the g like a French j, as in "jeudi", i.e. A je in Core. But a more British dge sound, as in Badge, is perfectly understandable, i.e. Adge in Core. I'd not really thought about it that much to be honest. I also can't read phonetic spelling, so the differences being described are not obvious to me. --Merlinme (talk) 14:16, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

I might insert something like "(pronunciation varies: pronounced /ˈæʤɪnˌkɔːr , ˈæʤɪnˌkɔːt , ˈæʤɪnˌkʊər or ˈæʤɪnˌkɔːrt/ )", followed by the footnote cited above, after all. Would this be too cumbersome for the lead? --Old Moonraker (talk) 14:39, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

It's a bit intrusive in the lead. Perhaps we could move the whole lot to a footnote? --Merlinme (talk) 16:36, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Good idea. As the English Pronouncing Dictionary only offers English pronunciations, the proper French version (as favoured by User:Merlinme) would also need to go in. --Old Moonraker (talk) 17:23, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] The French hoped to raise 9,000,000 troops

I think not.

The latter numbers of 12-36000 at Agincourt suggest 9000 to relieve Harfleur, later growing to the higher estimates.

90000 would have been extraordinary considering the numbers cited, and of course 9M men armies would not exist until the XX century.

Comments? If none I'll change it to 9000.

Ardipithecus Maximus (talk) 03:35, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Jumped in and changed it back. --Old Moonraker (talk) 06:04, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Its been 600 years, why are the numbers in the french article on Azincourt so different? http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bataille_d%27Azincourt —Preceding unsigned comment added by 162.84.225.238 (talk) 04:32, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

They weren't very different, a couple of months ago. Looking at the revision history, it looks like a couple of IP addresses came along and changed all the numbers (presumably based on Curry or similar), without actually citing a source, in March this year. There were endless arguments over the numbers in the English article until we settled on the current compromise. I imagine the French article doesn't attract the same number of eyeballs as the English version, so the numbers tend to reflect whoever last edited it. --Merlinme (talk) 07:44, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] The account of the battle is confusing

The section giving the details of the engagement is sometimes repetitious, and jumps back and forth in time and point of view (English perspective vs. French perspective) so often that it is hard to tell which statements apply to which side. Also, the quality of the prose is not quite up to encyclopedia standards.

24.59.0.76 (talk) 19:48, 6 June 2008 (UTC)Martin M. Meiss

Please improve it. --Merlinme (talk) 16:57, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Yes It's St. Crispin's day

But it's also his brother saint Crispian's day as well. They are jointly the patron saints of cobblers and shoemakers. Can we include him in the lead-in as well as Crispin? Jatrius (talk) 18:39, 11 June 2008 (UTC)