Talk:Battle for Caen

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[edit] Allied-centric

Decent article, but atm, is way too focused on the allies. All of the photos are taken from an allied perspective, how about some taken by Germans? user:Pzg Ratzinger

I've attempted to balance some of this up - i.e. providing a comparable order of battle for the German side to go along side the Anglo-Canadian one as well as naming as many of the Corps commanders along side the commander of higher level organisations and in some sort of order unlike it perviously was.
On top of that, i have removed a section were it said the "allied fallen are buried...." to "the fallen are buired..." and added in one of the German cemetrys, the largest iirc.
although this is only a start i agree it needs to be more impartial in places

--EnigmaMcmxc (talk) 20:06, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] War Crimes section (difficulties)

The account of war crimes by either side is confusing - I have been unable to unravel it at this time. Ballista 04:53, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Long article

This article is almost a history of the Normandy campaign. Maybe it could do with some trimming? DMorpheus 19:23, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

I trimmed it down. There was lots of good content but much of it was about the broader campaign. Tried to fix some translation boo-boos also. It still needs an ending/conclusion.DMorpheus 20:02, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Canadian Army

This was a significant battle for the Canadian Army in World War II, yet it's not mentioned as one of the combatants at the head of the article -- I can only presume that's because we don't know the exact names of the involved units. Can someone fill in the missing detail? I'm not qualified to. Rhombus 02:57, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tilly-sur-Seulles section

The dates for the fighting around Tilly-sur-Seulles are wrong I'm afraid. The present article says that the town was fought over from July 8th - 19th. However, the dates are one month too late and should read June 8th - June 19th.

Tilly was secured on June 19th by the 2nd Battalion, The Essex Regiment.

(I would try and edit it myself, but this is the first time I've ever posted anything on Wikipedia, and barely know how to post this) BobFish 13:18, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

You're right. I've looked in the literature again, which says June as well. Thank you for the information and the waiting becouse I had to correct it on .de as well. -- John N. 16:38, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The First Day

Me again (sorry). I think it might be worthwhile to explain why Caen wasn't captured on D-Day itself - eg the beaches; Strongpoint Hillman; the 21st Panzer counter-attack; the need to defend the Airborne bridgehead; the other tasks of 3rd Division etc etc

Let me know what you think, and if you'd like me to write it or not. Cheers.

Also, might it be good to cut down the Allied "Strength" list? Reduce it to "British 2nd Army, Canadian 1st Army, RAF, USAAF, Royal Navy" or some such. The current list is a bit too selective and to include every Corps, Division and Regiment that fought at Caen would take up a large amount of space. I'd suggest the same for the German "Strength" aswell.

BobFish 12:22, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] operation goodwood?

Can someone tell me why th word "meaningful" is used in this sentence? -- this is a battle, not a therapy group  :"This slowed the attacks down and prevented meaningful cooperation."Mdk0642 02:32, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Germany

The official name of the country during WWII was Deutschland (Germany), or Deutsches Reich (German Reich), or in speeches Großdeutschland (Greater Germany) or Drittes Reich (Third Reich). Germany was governed from 1933-1945 by the Nazi party in dictatorial fashion; the Soviet Union was run by the Communist party from 1922-1991 in the same tyrannical way, yet that country is not labeled in Wikipedia as the Communist Soviet Union. The Swastika flag clearly identifies the Germany of 1933-1945.--Gamahler 01:26, 30 January 2007 (UTC)


[edit] Consequences on Caen

Caen and the surrounding towns and villages were mostly destroyed; is perhaps a very short way of qualifying the effects on this town. For a start, no mention is made on the civilians during this battle. Hrcolyer 15:12, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Referances and footnotes

While i have sat and removed a large number of grammar and spelling mistakes from the article and added in numerous links to other wiki articles i have noticed there is hardly any footnotes to any referance material to back up what has been stated. Figuers and other information are presented as fact, and they probably are, however with nothing to support them how do we know?

Again, large ammounts of footnotes need to be added! --EnigmaMcmxc (talk) 20:10, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Pyrrhic Victory

I understand while one author has stated so, is his opinion backed up by other sources?

On the other hand does it really qualify as one? While the battle plan called for minimising casualties as much as possible – “Colossal Cracks” – GHQ expected that the invasion would cause them heavy casualties. They were expecting them, iirc they were much lower then anticipated. Therefore is it a Pyrrhic Victory or a Tactical one?--EnigmaMcmxc (talk) 15:10, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

I don't think you'll find many sources saying the Allied capture of Caen was a pyrrhic victory. The term strains credulity IMO. The 21st Army Group almost immediately went on to several very large-scale offensive actions (Totalise, Falaise pocket, the liberation of Antwerp and much of Belgium, Market-Garden,etc) without much pause. Not the actions of a post-pyrrhic victory army at all. Regards, DMorpheus (talk) 16:30, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Allied War Crimes

There is one line that doesnt seem appropriate. Right before the account of the account of the Canadian officer forcing the tired Germans to swim the river in which many of them drowned, the writer states the following:

"The Canadian company commander Major Jacques D. Dextraze said and to a certain extent confirmed the accusations by Meyer:"

Meyer stated that the orders said if taking prisoners was to slow down the advance then none should be taken. The example of the German POWs being forced to swim has nothing to do with the alleged orders Meyer found as there is no indictation they were slowing down the advance, only one officer was escorting them back and it seems it was the officer being sadistic rather then following the alleged orders. Either way the action and the alleged orders dont match, and it seems incorrect to assume that an example of one officer being sadistic confirms the entire Canadian Army was killing off prisioners to fullfull the alleged orders. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wokelly (talk • contribs) 04:57, 25 May 2008 (UTC)