User talk:Baristarim/Archive 2

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This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Contents 1 Foreign relations of Turkey 2 pan turkism , güneş dil teorisi 3 buyukanit 4 Turkish source 5 Turkey-related topics 6 Civility 7 Turkish Armed Forces Medal of Honor 8 Megali Idea 9 Hey 10 EU Turkey template 11 Constitution of Turkey 12 revert 13 5xRV 14 POV-pushing 15 "Civil penal code" in Gay rights in Turkey 16 Hey Baris 17 Turkic languages template 18 Azerbaijan Democratic Republic 19 Re 20 see also 21 Identity of the guy on the left 22 What are you talking about 23 'lut 24 Hemşinli

Foreign relations of Turkey

Ah, well thank you for your work on the article! As for your suggestion, I partially agree. I don't think that the view on the genocide by most historians and then the view by Turkish historians (in addition to McCarthy, Lewis, etc.) should be presented 50/50, becuase that doesn't go in according to WP:NPOV#Undue weight. As for the {{inuse}} tag, no problem. :-) —Khoikhoi 04:27, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Ok, that's an issue that I don't want to approach with a thirty foot stick :)) I was not saying to what degree the POVs should be presented.. I was just saying that a shorter paragraph needs to be written reflecting the concensus (whatever it is at the moment :)) on this issue.. that's all.. But, extreme caution has to be taken to avoid this descending to a POV-war since that section has to relate to its implications on the foreign relations of turkey at the moment.. In fact, I am completely against any POV argumentation on that section, just saying Tr-arm relations have been stranded because of the emotions surrounding the arm gen, and it is the biggest stumbling block towards a true peace in the Caucasus region, and, hop, go read the rest in other articles :)) - that sentence was one of the first edits that I made in the tr-arm relations article the second day I joined wiki :)) Something of that sort.. One of the worst results of POV-pushing in some articles is that the title of the article/sections end up having no logical relation to what is being discussed in the main body, sadly :)).. Baristarim 04:37, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

I understand. I get your points as well—so I have no objections. If the reader wants to learn more about the subject, they can just go to the relevant article. Ciao. —Khoikhoi 04:43, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

pan turkism , güneş dil teorisi

Güneş dil teorisi, Pan Turkism maddesinde yazıldığı gibi savlara destek değil tam tersi bir gelişmesi var. Aşağıda bu teori ile ilgili olarak derlediklerimi göreceksin. Bunu kısaltarak uygun bir şekilde maddeye yerleştirebilirmisin;
Güneş-Dil Teorisi , 1930'lu yıllarda Mustafa Kemal Atatürk tarafından desteklenen ve bizzat geliştirilen dil teorisidir. Bu teorinin kaynağı Atatürk tarafından not olarak hazırlanmış olan Etimoloji, Morfoloji ve Fonetik Bakımdan Türk Dili isimli kitabın 7. sayfasında da söylenildiği üzere Dr. Phil. Hermann F. Kvergić'in La Psychologie de Quelques Elements des Langues Turques (Türk Dillerindeki Bazı Unsurların Psikolojisi) isimli, Fransızca yazılan 41 sayfalık basılmamış eseridir. Bu tez, yazarı tarafından 1935 yılında Viyana’dan Atatürk’e gönderilmiştir. Bu teze kaynaklık eden diğer akademik çalışmalar;
“Langue etrusce, sa place pami les languages, etude de quelques textes Par, B. Cara de Vaux (Paris, 1911) “

“Etude oriental no:7.L’origine des languages, des religions et des peuples” I. Partie “ Les radicaux primitifs des langues concerves dan le sumerien ou lexque sumerien-français” ,Hilarie de Barenton,( Paris,1932)

“Etude oriental no:8.L’origine des languages, des religions et des peoples” II. Partie “ Les langues , leur demination du sumerien, les religione, lear origine dans le sacrifice; Le peuples, ils se diferencient par leurs ritesç” ,Hilarie de Barenton,( Paris,1933)

Teorideki esas fikir bizzat Atatürk tarafından geliştirilmiş ve teori olarak sunulmuştur. Türk Dili Tetkik Cemiyeti 12 Temmuz 1932'deki Tarih Kongresi'nin hemen ardından, Atatürk, 'Türk Dili Tetkik Cemiyeti'ni kurdurmuş, dilde de birlik sağlanması için adım atılmasını sağlamıştır. I.Türk Dil Kurultayı, 26 Eylül 1932 tarihinde Dolmabahçe Sarayı'nda toplanmıştır. Türk Dili Tetkik Cemiyeti kurulduğu zaman Atatürk’ün önünde yakın geçmişin iki dosyası duruyor. Bir tanesi 1928 yılında yapmış olduğu Yazı Devrimi. Bir tanesi de Kubilay olayı, yani gerici ayaklanması. Dolayısıyla Atatürk yazı devriminin güçlenmesi ve köklenmesi için belirli bir kültür hareketinin olmasını istemekteydi. Dil bir iletişim aracıdır ve her dil, kendisini oluşturan topluluğun iletmek ihtiyacında olduğu anlamları iletmeye yeter. Iletilecek yeni anlamlar belirirse, dil de, kendi bünyesi içinde, bu anlamları taşıyacak yeni biçimler bulabilmektedir. Bu kongrede, dildeki Arapça ve Farsça kelimelerin yanı sıra bölgeler arasındaki lehçe farklılıklarının da ortadan kaldırılması için İstanbul Türkçesi örnek alınarak çalışmalara başlanmıştır. Yapılan çalışmalar Belleten adlı dergide yayımlanmıştır. Güneş-Dil Teorisi - Amaç Güneş-Dil Teorisi, adından da anlaşılacağı gibi bir teoridir ve hangi şartlarda ortaya atıldığına bakmak gereklidir.Bugünden Güneş-Dil Teorisi’ne bakarsak, birtakım yanlış değerlendirmelere sapılabilir. Bu tür çalışmalar aslında Osmanlı döneminde başlamıştır. Mustafa Celalettin Paşa’nın , Samih Rifat’ın, TDK’nin kurucu başkanının da, böyle çalışmaları olmuştu. Hermann Kvergitsch’in teorisinin ana fikri Türk dilinin dünyada esas bir dil olduğu ve dünya dillerindeki birçok kelimenin de Türkçeden türediği şeklindedir.Çok iyi Fransızca bilen Atatürk Bu teoriyi okuduğu zaman tamam aradığımı buldum madem ki Türk dili dünyanın temel dillerinden birisidir, ki gerçek de budur. Dünya dilllerindeki birçok kelime bu teoriye göre Türkçeden çıkmıştır. O hâlde bizim dilimizin içerisinde kullanılan ve yabancı asıllı olduğu iddia edilen kelimeleri atmamıza gerek var mı? Yok. Onlar da dilde kullanılsın düşüncesine hasıl olmuştur. Dil, bir halkın veya ulusun sahip olduğu yaşam tarzını ve kültürünü tanımak için önemli bir etmendir. Güneş Dil Teorisinin tarih içerisinde oynadığı rol ve anlam Atatürk Devrimleri'nin ideolojik hattını anlamak açısından çok önemlidir. Türk Tarih Tezi'ni ve Güneş Dil Teorisi'ni basit bir milliyetçi hezeyan olarak değil Atatürk Devrimleri'nin yıktığı düzenle ve Avrupa merkezci tarih teorileriyle hesaplaşma çabaları olarak değerlendirmek gerekiyor. Böylelikle hem ümmetten millete geçilmek hem de Batı karşısında kendisini ezik hisseden mazlum bir millete özgüven aşılanmak istenmiştir. Güneş Dil Teorisi-Süreç Türkçenin diğer dillere kaynaklık ettiği düşüncesi 1932’deki Birinci Türk Dil Kurultayı’nda adı konmadan bazı bildirilerde ortaya atılmıştı. Dil devrimi başladığında, önce dildeki bütün yabancı sözcüklerin atılması gerektiği gibi bir düşünce hâkimdi. Dilin söz varlığına girmiş, anlamını herkesin bildiği ve kullandığı, ama kökenini bilmediği, günümüzde de kullandığımız pek çok sözcüğün atılması gerektiği dile getirilmiştir. 1935 yılına gelindiğinde, yine herkesin anlayamadığı bir dil ortaya çıktı. Zaten Osmanlı Türkçesinden şikayet şuydu: Yazılıp da konuşulamayan bir edebi Türkçe, bir de konuşulup yazılmayan halk dili vardı. Bunun birleştirilmesi gerekiyordu. Dil devriminde de amaç buydu zaten. Bunda da büyük ölçüde başarı sağlandı. III. Türk Dil Kurultayı 24-31 Ağustos 1936 tarihleri arasında yapılmıştır. Yurtdışından gelen 13 dil bilgininin de katılımıyla gerçekleşen kurultayda, cemiyetin adı Türk Dil Kurumu olarak değiştirilmiştir. Bu kurultayda, çalışma esasları, diğer iki kurultaydakinden farklı olmuştur: Artık Güneş Dil Teorisi (özleştirmeye ret, yaşayan dile dönüş) üzerinde durulmaya başlanmış, yabancı kelimelere Türkçe karşılık aranmasına son verilerek yaşayan dil kabul edilmiştir.

Güneşdil ile ilgili komisyon raporu: http://tdkkitaplık.org.tr/gdtr/gdtraporu.pdf (türkçe ve fransızca)

Güneşdil ile ilgili komisyon üyeleri: http://tdkkitaplık.org.tr/gdtr/gdtuyeler.pdf (türkçe ve fransızca)

saygılar Mustafa Akalp 16:02, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

buyukanit

I removed all the newpaper content and added the biography from the official site. Remember the wikipedia policy on the biographies of living persons. The controversial statements should be based on reliable sources, not the opinions of some editors (including the news staff). You reverted the article but also removed the additions to the biography section. E104421 19:18, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

I see, i just started editing the article, seaching for more sources, then i would check the article and add all the wikifications. I also read your comment before doing the edit, my point is the controversial material presented there is potentially libelous. You reacted so fast. Anyway, i'll do it, if i had enough time today. E104421 19:33, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

For the see also section, i agree, but co-related articles (the articles as a whole) can be added there. The wikifications not all the time suggest the link is direcly related with the subject of the article. For this reason, sometimes, it's better to keep them in the see also section. Cheers! E104421 19:43, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

One more note, sorry for removing your wikifications. E104421 19:58, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Hi Barış! I saw the article you started Turkish-Azeri relations, but I think les freres like the term Azerbaijani better, and that's what is more frequently used, at least in an English language environment. Also, I see that Yaşar Büyükanıt article is gradually turning into a blog site. I am surprised that the above user affirms having removed the newspaper content. What do I see then? :)

How about including the criticisms he expressed vis-a-vis TESEV on 2 October. Since even Sabbatai Zevi is there (dig the quality of the sources for that part!), we could include George Soros as well. Cretanforever

Turkish source

Hi, I saw from your babel box that you are a native Turkish speaker. I was hoping you could look for me at this article [1] and confirm that Majid Musisi died of AIDS. I think it says so, but I am not sure. Also, from looking at the internet site, could it be considered a reliable source? (not a gossip magazine/article for instance). Thanks, Garion96 (talk) 21:28, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

That was a good thing I asked. So much for my Turkish language skills. :) Thanks a lot, Garion96 (talk) 21:45, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Turkey-related topics

Thank you for your changes in the National Security Council Turkey page. The council also has the president, the prime minister and some other ministers as the members. If you felt it would be pertinent to add them in your nice opening statement, could you help with it? Please see a very interesting reversal match at the National Security Council page for an essay article it is pointing. It is amazing how good of a negative support the wicked always gets with the loathing at the Turks and their country .

You got to change your edits. Please do not put the navigational box in the middle of an article, or in the "see also" section. Just pick a country and you will see all the nav boxes are at the bottom.--ChoChoPK (球球PK) (talk | contrib) 05:55, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

No, not at all - please see Featured articles Canada, India and Australia - in fact they ALWAYS go at the see also section, that's what it is for see also box.. please dont undo all my edits, it is already taking me a lot of time trying to put them there, i dont want to undo your undos :)) Baristarim 05:59, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Very well. I will revert the only 2 changes I made. --ChoChoPK (球球PK) (talk | contrib) 06:01, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for pointing out. I'm learning new things everyday. --ChoChoPK (球球PK) (talk | contrib) 06:10, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Hey, I do not like the way you appended the new Template:Turkey topics to the middle of several articles. Common practice and the good looking way is to have all the navigation templates at the very end of an article. The featured articles you mentioned are all articles about a country , and for those, the entire "see also" section consists of the template and it doesn't look bad that way. I think you could do this for the Turkey article, provided that there are no other single line entries in the "see also" section, but the practice of adding the template at the end of the "see also" sections of other articles does not look good to me. I will help the design of the template when I have the time (later today, I guess). Regards, Atilim Gunes Baydin 09:55, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Ok, as u wish.. I was just trying to create a template to link all the turkey articles together since we still dont have seperate templates for different subjects except politics and foreign relations (since yesterday).. I think that more templates are needed, so I thought that this was the best solution until a better review later.. I also think there shouldn't be other articles listed under see also, but I didn't have the time to design all the subtemplates that we need (arts in turkey, religion in turkey, demographics of tr, military of tr etc) in order for those other articles listed under see also to be removed, so I put them there as a temporary solution without removing other entries (i was aware of that, but i cannot do everything :))), at least this way it will be easier to keep track of articles until everything can be updated to a satisfactory status since they will be all interlinked.. The template looks to be in the middle, since most of the articles are gravely too short!! :)) u r right about other country articles that i mentioned, but dont forget that all those articles have many subtemplates that we dont have, so therefore they dont have the same problem of interlinking - we are still trying to get the basics sorted out :))) We still dont have articles art in turkey, religion in turkey etc. :)) What i did is not the ideal, i know, but I will try to keep on updating as we go along.. We should also try to get Wiki Project Turkey back on, nearly all turkey related articles dont seem to be satisfactorily interlinked and therefore it is hard to work on improving them coz they are not organized under one heading.. cheers! Baristarim 15:00, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

You are probably right; I was aware that there existed a previous, perfectly acceptable format. But in wikipedia, things come and go and we loose track of who did what, when and why. People come to an agreement, keep off the site for a while and then, bang, a new set of users goes back to square one (this is no reference to you or me). Perhaps we should all go off and write a book or something ;-) Hope you understand my point. We will probably disagree again in the future, but I do appreciate your comments and all of this is never personal. Politis 16:05, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Hi buddy Thanks so much for your hard work in all pertinent pages. I appreciate the time and effort you are putting in this media for all of us. Take care. C* (incidentally, did you see the columnist's article in Milliyet today saying Ataturk later realized how nonsense Gunes Dili concept was and , therefore, abandoned it? what do you think?)

Civility

I've warned him, but you need to look at your own behavior as well. Comments such as this are WAY out of line. There is nothing wrong with posting a disputed page to a wikiproject noticeboard, so long as no specific course of action is encouraged, which he is not doing. That is what the noticeboards are for. Either way, you need to cool down, be more respectful with your language, and not try to administer vigilante justice. I am an admin, and I am looking at the situation. But you need to be civil just as much as he does. --InShaneee 01:31, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm not going to warn you again: comments such as this edit summary are not acceptable and if you continue this, you will be blocked. --InShaneee 01:38, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Again, you see what I mean? EVERY single time I make a change he uses the word pan-turkist, this is really getting old.. I see your point, I will try to take it easy, but you must understand how nerving it is to be called a vandal and pan-turkist and eg You continuously make baseless and ridiculous assertions without facts, other pan Turkists that you muster up.. I hadn't see your post when I wrote that edit summary.. Sorry about that.. But surely you must see that it is not easy to take it easy when even legitimate edits are reversed - an hour before this episode, i made this edit to calm a revert war [2] and right after I was reverted like this [3] !! How would you feel if that edit summary was directed at you? honestly? I am really trying to take it easy, but it is really NOT easy like this, I hope that you understand that.. Regards.. Baristarim 01:48, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Inshanee, please see this [4].. You are giving me a warning because of my edit summary, but it is ok for him to say things like other pan-turkists that you muster up??.. I never claimed in my above edit in question that Persian and Arabic cultures had no influences, before my involvement there was an edit war because there were many nations that were mentioned, so I replaced them with Byzantine culture and cultures of Islam, that way noone would have reason to start an edit war again.. I fail to see how that is propaganda.. There is absolutely no assumption of good faith, seriously.. I reported this user for 3RR a week ago, I think this is the only reason why he is making this fuss.. In any case, please do something Inshanee, I also dont think it is right that he calls me pan-turkist EVERY single time, I hope that u understand, if my edit summary is unconstructive, which I accept, than this must also be considered as such.. Baristarim 02:08, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Number one, I've already warned him, and number two, his actions do not excuse yours. Responding to incivility with further incivility is as bad as starting the situation in the first place, and is dealt with as such. And for the record, trying to end an edit war with further edits is never a good idea. --InShaneee 02:13, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Ok I understand what you are saying, but the number of my inflammatory edit summaries dont come as near as his, in EVERY single edit summary he uses the term pan-turkist or vandal, not that it makes me angry coz I can shake it off, but it is still not cool.. You warned him, but even after your warning, in every single one of his edits he is still speaking with the same tone - see this [5], this was some time after your warning.. What happened to comment on content and not the user?? I got angry for a moment, I also said sorry for my edit summary that intervened after your warning that I hadnt seen at the moment, but please take a look at his edits, every single time he says vandal, pan-turkist etc.. What is going on?? I also have a right to not be insulted.. Please do something about this.. As for my edit to the OE article you mentioned, I was really trying to find a solution, I was never claiming that COE didnt have this or that influence, what I wrote was much more encyclopedic, what happened to the assumption of good faith? regards Baristarim 02:23, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

You don't have a 'right' to anything at all on Wikipedia, and no, what he did is not worse than what you did by a longshot, nor does it matter. Every disrespectful user is treated equally by being blocked should they not be able to follow policy. --InShaneee 02:44, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

? I told you I agree with what u said earlier.. What do you expect me to do? And I don't understand why u say i dont have a right to anything at all on wiki, thats way too much wikilawyering, you missed the spirit of what I was trying to say: I am subjected to repeated insults and degradation, that is not cool either.. I hope that u understand this.. All the users have/dont have the same rights, so you could have phrased your last post in a better way.. So after all this, u r telling me that it is basically ok for him to keep on repeatedly calling me pan-turkist or vandal since he has done so after your warnings? In any case, it is still wikilawyering to say that anyone can put any post on a WP page as long as no specific course of action is encouraged: what counts is the spirit of the rule: i dont have to write a specific course of action to be taken as long as there is one implied eg full of POV and propaganda, attacked by pan-turkists or attacked by russians, instead of simply writing POV issues, surely as an admin you can see that? In any case, I am not interested in continuing this any furher, I have wasted enough time already.. Baristarim 03:09, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Firstly, Wikilawyering doesn't mean what you think it means. Secondly, this is a private website, not a country; you don't have any rights, period. It's not ok for him to be incivil, this is true; but it's not ok for you to do it either. "Policy" is not 'wikilawyering'; the Noticeboard is there to be used, get used to it. I'm going to keep an eye on the both of you, and I assure you, one way or another, this will be resolved. --InShaneee 04:25, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

I am aware that this is a private website :).. Please be my guest and keep an eye on me, I would like that, I have nothing to hide. All I am trying to do is contribute to Wiki, I am not here to only push agendas, I am actively creating and rewriting articles in the fields of my specialisation.. If u r not happy with that, u have a right to have that opinion. I know what the noticeboards r for, I wasnt complaining about anyone putting any messages, I only said that the way certain posts are put also push people to act in a certain way, thus violating that policy.. On the other hand, pls see my point about Khosrow having a bone with me, I reported him for 3RR a week ago, he did the same just twenty mins ago for me, in a case where my last edit was a correction of the edit directly three mintues before, which was also mine. I was honestly trying to revert my last edit and unfortunately I was looking at a wrong version when I did my last edit. See what I mean? I sense a lot of bad faith there bordering on harassment. He even replied to my explanation on the 3RR page, so what can I say? Baristarim 05:02, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Turkish Armed Forces Medal of Honor

Don't revert anymore on that article, I'll take care of things. —Khoikhoi 08:51, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Megali Idea

Hi, do you think you could give a translation of what is said here (just curious). Thanks.--Tekleni 11:54, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Hey

Hey Baristarim, how are you doing bro, could you perhaps send me mail on wikipedia with your personal e-mail address in it, there are several things we need to discuss. Baku87 12:56, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

EU Turkey template

Some deleted our template about Turkey's joining to the EU. Bölücü bulmuş, ama en kısa zamanda tekrar hazırlıyacağım. Sende lütfen diğer Türk userlarla iletişime girersen eklemelerini teklif et. Herkese yayılsın! CrashMex 20:45, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Guys, please have a look at WP:GUS. The idea is that political userboxes should be kept out of the main Wikipedia space. If you must have one (which is nevertheless sort of discouraged), you can create and store it in your own userspace. If you re-create it in [Template:....] space, it will almost certainly be deleted again. HTH, Fut.Perf. ☼ 22:56, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Constitution of Turkey

Dear Barış. The article is on my watchlist, I shall keep an eye on it. I guess the user removing stuff is the same who yesterday got blocked from several IP's for heavy vandalism the MGK page and my userpage. I am afraid that being subject to all kind of insults is a part of the game here. However, when they are so contradictory (I am myself used to labelled both pro-Turk and anti-Turk) we should take it as a sign that we actually manage to contribute in a balanced way. I have no doubt in your sincerity. Kolay gelsin Bertilvidet 07:44, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

revert

3RV kuralının bu şekilde çalıştığından eminmisin. 3 kez revert yapınca ceza alıyor diye anladım. Gurup halinde çalışanlar için ne yapılabilir. Bazı maddelerde savaşın yaşanıyor. TRNC maddesini koruma altına aldırdım ama benim editlerimin bazılarını da daha sonra "horrible "ingilizce nedeni ile kapattılar. Ne yapılabilir. senin katkılarını izliyorum. benimkileride izlemene almanı rica. Selam. Mustafa Akalp 19:16, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

5xRV

Please check releted page(report 3RV).Put your oppinions if you wish. Mustafa Akalp 19:50, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

selam. Burasi (en azindan ermeni sayfalari) tam timarhane yav. Akli basinda tek bir insan yok isin kötüsü herkesi inandirmislar. Tümüyle organize olmazsak bu sayfalarda en ufak degisiklik yapamayiz.neurobio 22:09, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Turkey-related topics güzel oldu Barış. Tebrikler. Hay, o bols nöbetçi kulübesinden yürütülen bayrağımızı da geri aldın! :) Ciddi ciddi! İlker Başbuğ'un maddesini kaldıralım istersen. Genelkurmay Başkanı'nın maddesi var. Meselâ, Yaşar Büyükanıt maddesine bir paragrafta kuvvet komutanlarının isimlerini koyabiliriz. Maddeyi sen açtın, karar senin. Öneri olarak dile getiriyorum. Türkçe vikide KKK maddesine bakarsan, çok sadedir bilgiler:) Cretanforever

Silelim Barış, ben sayfayı bir word dosyasına kaydettim. Türkçesi yazıldığında biz de herhangi bir yeniden uğraşma olmaksızın İngilizcesini koyarız. Şimdilik Türkçesi yok. Selam. Cretanforever

Sen Türkçe viki'de madde görüyor musun? Ben görmüyorum. Ya da hayal görüyorum, daha doğrusu görmüyorum, ama görmediğim birşeyin hayalini nasıl görmeyebilirim? Neyse boşver! Saçmalıyorum. Fikir olarak söyledim. Cretanforever

POV-pushing

Salut Barış. J'ai remarqué que nous avons plusieurs langues en commun. Bu gerçekten bir zenginliktir. J'apprécie sincèrement tes efforts d'améliorer les articles concernant la Turquie - mais d'après tout je dois dire que je suis un sceptique envers tes derniers changement au page sur la situation des droits d'hommes en Turquie. De mon avis l'article devient un peu trop juridique trop focalisé aux paragraphes de la constitution plutôt que des problèmes réels. Mais, d'après tout, que puis-je attendre d'un hukukçu ;-) J'espère de pouvoir trouver du temps pour y rédiger. Bon, la raison pour laquelle que je m'adresse a toi est que j'ai recu un mail que je pense va t'intéresser; une pétition aux élus. Bertilvidet 10:21, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

"Civil penal code" in Gay rights in Turkey

Hi, I did not write that phrase but I kept it during the time I rewrote that article. I think it was meant to distinguish the penal code applied to regular citizens from the penal code applied to the members of the military ("Military law", the following section). I have the impression that these two are different, right? I mean there are different sets of courts and laws for each. Regards, Atilim Gunes Baydin 10:31, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

Hey Baris

I want to come to a level of polite discussion with you. I know I've been picky, but so have you. Truce? •NikoSilver• 10:34, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

In the end we may find that we agree more than we disagree. I'm glad you accept, and I'll try more to be commenting on our positions, rather on the reasons behind them. If I use humor every now and then, please just take it as such, and not as irony (e.g. Genocidisput-itis which was misunderstood by somebody, while I am sure you smiled when you read it). It breaks the ice, I think. •NikoSilver• 14:02, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

Turkic languages template

My reverts on the Turkic language template are not simply made to aggrevate editors. I just want the Turkic template to be uniform with the one on Iranian peoples and the one on Slavic peoples. -- Clevelander 20:50, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

Azerbaijan Democratic Republic

I think it should be okay to use a report by Kaveh Farrokh as a source. Sarah Ewart (Talk) 04:04, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Are you saying Dr Farrokh is not a reliable source or you don't believe he actually wrote that article? Sorry, but I don't understand what you're suggesting with the comment about AOL etc. Sarah Ewart (Talk) 04:22, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Re

Sorry for undoing your edits in Hamshenis...:). I had not checked what the external links were about, and by reading your edit summary, i tought they were about 'ethnicity'... Just a typical misunderstanding:). About the template, i think there should be only sovereign states were a turkic language is official. Listing 'regions where a turkic language is spoken' is problematic... A similar possible template for the Greek language would include even Australia!:). and also, Turkish is official in Cyprus, and TRNC is internationally unrecognised. so, listing TRNC (as u did) and excluding Cyprus is like legitimizing the division (and it is not something up to us to do...). If u list both in the same format, it is the same as above, since it appears that there are 2 sovereign states in the island (again, untrue). I would propose having only Cyprus listed, with a note that TRNC is a breakaway region. Hectorian 16:55, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

see also

[6] regards. Mustafa Akalp 17:40, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Identity of the guy on the left

Merhaba Can you identify the guy on the left on this picture[7]? --69.86.16.239 19:35, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

He is Muhsin Yazicioglu, he is the president of BBP, a political party in Turkey.. I had seen this picture before in an article where it was claimed that he was a minister of some sorts, but he was never in the government.. Why? Baristarim 20:27, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

What are you talking about

No one understand what your talking about? Im so confused. E-mail doesnt matter, like I told you, I use my Yahoo e-mail more than my university e-mail. And universities dont hire people who dont want to be hired. Not all historians are professors, infact, most arent! Read this: [8] Its not up to you to judge who is who, leave that to the professionals. LOL.Khosrow II 21:18, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

'lut

Hi Bari, I've finally got round to replying on the talk page. I'm sorry we got off to a bad start, but we were both (a bit too?) wary of each other right from the word go, what we me having just dealt with NetzGirl and you constantly having to revert "Turkey SUX!" type comments from the pages. I read the article you gave me: very interesting, even though his english is a bit shaky (or maybe it's a translation). Bon, en fait je voulais te demander une question (innocente), vu que tu m'as l'air calée en droit: de ce que j'ai compris en lisant les articles sur vos lois, si jamais un Turk met des trucs critiques dans les articles sur la Turquie il pourrais se faire condamner pour atteinte à la Turkitude? Mais bon t'es en france alors tu t'en fous un peu, mais les autres? Est ce que ca c'est déja passé (pour un éditeur sur Wikipedia)? Have a nice day, yandman 14:04, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

Hemşinli

Barış, quand on parle des Hemşinli en turc, on se limite pas seulement aux habitants de la ville de Hemşin, on amalgame un peu, mais on se refere, avec la meme terme (desole, avec mon clavier les accents sont trop compliques sur wiki), soit, avec la meme terme, on se refere, et aux habitants de Hemşin, et au groupe ethno-culturel avec ses specificites qui s'etend sur une geographie plus large. A l'heure qu'il est, il doit y avoir plus de Hemşinli (dans le sens ethno-culturel) a Hopa qu'a Hemşin. Ils se bagarrent periodiquement avec les Laz d'ailleurs, des bagarres du genre Asterix. Mais les deux sites d'internet que tu as enleve sont tout aussi valables sur le plan de la culture que de la localite concernee.

It will look odd if we take out web sites that have thousands of visitors from among them and leave a yahoo discussion group with 50 members since 2004 and apparently no active ones. It reminds of John Lennon who sang,

Father MacKenzie, writing the words of a sermon that no one will hear, no one comes near:)

There's much to write on Hemşinli, mais je prefere que ce soit quelqu'un de la region qui ecrit tout ça. I mean, I visited the place as a tourist. But for the moment, we have no locals, no tourists, just the recuperateurs:)

Karar senin. Ben Ege'den çıkmıycam zaten, burası da işgal altında gerçi amma...:) See Occupation of İzmir, especially the talk page. (şaka yapıyorum) Cretanforever