Talk:Bartcop

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This is the talk page for discussing changes to the Bartcop article
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Why was this article so dramatically cut down in the last 3 days? Was it vandalism or intentional? BSveen 18:46, Nov 14, 2004 (UTC)

It was anonymous edits, which I have reverted. Neither the long nor short version are great, but at least this one has more info. Tuf-Kat 19:43, Nov 14, 2004 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] VFD debate

This article has been kept following this VFD debate. Sjakkalle (Check!) 28 June 2005 11:15 (UTC)

[edit] Terry Coppage a.k.a. Bartcop

Removal of information from Wikipedia is vandalism and will be treated as such in the future. Hall Monitor 17:46, 29 September 2005 (UTC)

The consistent vandalism of this article is coming from "Lone Odessan." A review of the history reveals that for many weeks he removed the name stating that "the author wishes to remain ananomous". Only then, when that argument failed to catch wind does he now try to float the "You can't prove it's Terry Coppage" approach. His motivation is not about cause it's clearly about the result; he simply does not want Terry Coppage identified. One has to wonder why he is so motivated that he has removed information from this page over 20 times now. And how many more times before he is sanctioned? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.92.121.122 (talk • contribs) 22:25, 4 October 2005 (UTC)

www.perkel.com/politics/clinton/accomp.htm

Nephron 03:53, 3 October 2005 (UTC)
Is this a reliable source? Do we have a reliable source stating Terry is Bartcop? If not... it is not verifiable and should stay out of the article.... -- BMIComp

"Is this a reliable source?" Given that Marc Perkel (www.ctyme.com) is the hosting service for BartCop, it's probably as close to a reliable source as exists in the "net" world. Obviously the dude running the hosting server should know who he's hosting. Or at least, one would hope?


(talk, HOWS MY DRIVING) 06:38, 4 October 2005 (UTC)

Not necessarily, as long as it's a notable source (and given the controversy it's apparantly caused I'd guess it is), we can simply state that perkel.com makes those claims. --fvw* 06:41, 4 October 2005 (UTC)

In this case, what would constitute an irrefutable reliable source? There are a number of websites and directories which refer to bartcop.com as "BartCop - The Political Humor of Terry Coppage". If one person wishes to make a huge issue out of his, we can refactor the article to say that several websites refer to Bartcop as Terry Coppage, but that does not seem to be necessary (IMHO). Hall Monitor 16:29, 4 October 2005 (UTC)

I consider most published works to be somewhat reliable. I wasn't trying to be argumentative: it was a legitimate question; I've only seen one source cited here. A google search of the name Terry Coppage [1] yields only 78 results.... -- BMIComp (talk, HOWS MY DRIVING) 16:34, 4 October 2005 (UTC)
Granted, LexisNexis isn't acknowledging that Terry Coppage also goes by the name of Bartcop, but when reviewing the Google search for these two, I found this particular link to be worthy of note: [2] Hall Monitor 16:39, 4 October 2005 (UTC)
Right. I'm pretty sure that Terry Copage is Bartcop. However, I'm not sure we should leave such a detail in the article, at least in its present form, as it may constitute original research. I think that stating that this identity "is one terry coppage" may not be the best wording. Stating that that Bartcop has gone to some lengths to keep his identity secret (if this is indeed true) and that there has been speculation (by bloggers and the like) that Terry Coppage is Bartcop's real idenitity may be more appropriate... -- BMIComp (talk, HOWS MY DRIVING) 00:10, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
Bartcop was identified as Terry Coppage in a 2002 Salon report:
* http://www.salon.com/politics/letters/2002/06/06/mwo/
That's good enough for me, and unless we have external evidence that Barcop's identity is a subject of serious dispute (for instance, public denials issued in the name of either Bartcop or Coppage, or identifications of other people as Bartcop in prominent journals such as Salon) then I think we should probably run with that. The Salon article should be listed as a reference for Bartcop's identity. --Tony SidawayTalk 16:13, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
That's Salon Premium Content, available only to subscribers. Here's a copy of the text:
* http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa.exe?A2=ind0206a&L=wnn&F=&S=&P=1819
--Tony SidawayTalk 16:16, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
Wonderful, thank you Tony Sidaway (and everyone else) for your assistance in resolving this issue. Hall Monitor 17:34, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
Nice find Tony Sidaway. -- BMIComp (talk, HOWS MY DRIVING) 19:11, 5 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Reads like a fan-page

I like Bartcop's site, but this article is ridiculous and highly NPOV. I'll be editing it over the next couple days to conform with wikipedia's standards. If anyone would like to cooperate with me on this project, let me know. CentristDem 13:40, 10 September 2005 (UTC)

CentristDem: Go for it. I think the article is missing a section called 'criticisms of Bartcop'.
Also, I think several aspects are incomplete/over emphasized:
  • Middle east... he spends almost no time on it, yet it is a significant feature of the page.
  • He has cancer... that is totally missing from the page and something he himself described in the blog.
  • Relationship to Mark Perkel.
  • Bart has led credence to several conspiracy theories-- it would be fair to attack him on that.
Generally, I think the main part of the article needs to be split into sections. Perhaps: "Radio show", "Views on Iraq War", "Criticisms of the media" Nephron 21:02, 10 September 2005 (UTC)


[edit] Personal request from Bartcop

After reverting two back-to-back vandalisms of the Bartcop article today, I immediately received two email messages which requested that the name Terry Coppage be omitted from the Wikipedia article. One of those was from someone who claimed to be Bartcop himself, and I believe that claim to be authentic based upon the header contents within the message. In retrospect, this does raise my suspicions of another editor who gravitated almost exclusively to this one article, but rather than jump to conclusions I will assume good faith and get to the point; is there any valid reason that the name Terry Coppage should be removed from this article, and does any sort of precedent exist to remove someone's real name from an article upon that subjects request? Hall Monitor 20:11, 7 October 2005 (UTC)


I didn't see any precedent for "Identity removal per subject request". But it would seem to me that the "request" itself is appropriate subject matter for the article. That a political pundit wants to make commentary about other public figures while trying to remain anonymous him/herself presents as a bit strange. Rest of Odessa 11:15, 2 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Unnecessary political commentary

Someone had added a remark in the Bartspeak section that deficits under President Bush were the highest ever, in parenthenses next to the line on Reagan's deficits. It's easily confrimable that only FDR had higher deficist than Reagan, but the fact is neither comment is productive or meets Wikipedia standards. I removed it.

Formerly: Red-Ink = President Ronald Reagan, the name comes from Reagan's record deficits (which are surpassed only by G. W. Bush's deficits)

Nhertel 18:49, 31 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Slight new edit

I'm new to actually editing Wikimedia, but added the "Joey the Rat" nickname to Bartspeak about a week ago. I'm not entirely sure that's not bad etiquette, but I was almost certain it was OK even though I didn't have an account at the time. Anyway, it's verifiable if you look at today's page on his site. I'm a daily visitor to the site and can contribute more in the future. MycroftHolmes 18:12, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Added mention of Bart's moderate opposition to gun control. This is verifiable by looking at many of his pages in the past, though the Koresh statement comes from a Bartcop Radio segment. Please let me know if this is not sufficient grounds for such an edit. MycroftHolmes 16:43, 10 October 2006 (UTC)