Talk:Bahá'í Faith and gender equality

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Contents

[edit] Real work needs to be done

I'm really quite disapointed with this page, it really needs some work:

After all there is to actually be said about gender equality all there is in the table of contents is "criticism". Shockingly unacademic if nothing else.

  • For instance: the Baha'i Faith gave women the right to vote long before it was made a reality in 1893 (A year after the passing of Baha'u'llah) in New Zealand.
  • Baha'u'llah defines gender equality as a prerequisite to peace.
  • The whole concept of education of girls is now widely accepted in Socio-Economic Development, but originated in the Baha'i teachings.
  • Tahirih. One of the first, if not the first, to work and die for gender rights. Removed her veil in IRAN of all places.
  • Bahiyyih Khanum. First women in religious history who was responsible for an entire religious community, and not as a figure head but in an official, powerful and strongly binding way.
  • 'Abdu'l-Baha was speaking publically in America in 1911 about the equality of the sexes. In 1920 Fadil Mazandarani was also speaking about it.

In short, there are so many positive things to be said, but instead all we have is "criticisms". How incredibly cynical. I'll be back I guess. :D

Matarael 2:50pm, 12 December 2005.

You are right Matareal. If you can fix all those things I would be most appreciative. The reason why the page is set up as it is right now is because the content was copied from the Baha'i criticisms page which was broken up. If you do not have time to do it in the near future, I'll work on it during the holiday season. -- Jeff3000 14:05, 12 December 2005 (UTC)


[edit] name

Can we think of another name for this? Feminism is just one of the issues addressed. It should be something more along the lines of "Equality of Men and Women". maybe...

  • Baha'i Faith and Equality of the Sexes
  • Baha'i Faith and Gender Equality
  • Baha'i Faith and Equality of Men and Women
  • Women in the Baha'i Faith
  • Women are great

Well I'm spent on ideas. Cunado19 12:24, 13 August 2005 (UTC)


Also about the name, feminism should not be capitalized, I am not sure about faith. However, if you change the name this will not matter. gren グレン 03:13, 20 October 2005 (UTC)


I changed the name Cuñado - Talk 07:13, 20 October 2005 (UTC)


[edit] feminism

This quote strikes me as a bit lacking in the NPOV department:

The Bahá'í Faith's emphasis on male-female equality reflects an older feminist paradigm. Feminism has moved beyond that, to a female superiority.

First of all, 'feminism' isn't a unified movement and second of all, it never was. It seems to me the second sentence should simply be removed completely. At best it needs a drastic reconsideration. If someone more familiar with Baha'i gender politics wants to revise it so it says something meaningful about Baha'i and its relationship to contemporary schools of feminism, fine, but as it is, it's a meaningless blanket statement regarding a subject over which this article asserts no authority. --Yst 01:59, 22 October 2005 (UTC)

I agree. I don't think it's necessary to discuss details, just delete it. If someone has a problem with it they will revert or change it. Cuñado - Talk 09:15, 8 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Bahiyyih Khanum

It was the first time in religious history that a women was a leader, and not as a figure head but in an official, powerful and strongly binding way.

Really? What about Mary Baker Eddy, the founder of the Church of Christ, Scientist in 1879?

I've reworded this text as it's patently false. AndrewRT 16:15, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

Yes, quite hyperbolic. MARussellPESE 17:37, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
Agreed. Cuñado - Talk 18:00, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
I didn't have anything to do with the original edit under question, but I think there is some truth in it that has since been omitted. Although she was not the first female religious leader, she may have been (I don't know this for sure either) the first female in charge of the global affairs of an independent religion (or maybe the first explicitly so, if you will believe the disputed Pope Joan theory--I add this in contrast to Mary Baker Eddy, who I don't think was claiming to be the rightful successor to Christ as do the Popes; granted Catholicism is only one denomination, but obviously a very large one)... Brettz9 13:23, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
Hyperbolics seem to attract fact checkers. I didn't know about Mary Baker Eddy - she seems have done quiet a bit by 1921 but it was still basically an American movement with a couple publications and centers but when Bahiyyih Khanum was in charge the Baha'i Faith was of an international and complex community founded 35 years before Christian Science - it already had organized communities and layers of administration and buildings in many countries - Iran, Iraq, Egypt, Palestine (then), India, Russia, United States, Britain, France, Germany - I'm fairly sure all had significant communities and various assemblies - here's some historyand details:

[edit] stats of women on nsa's

I beleive the stats on http://www.bahai.com/thebahais/pg27.htm deserve some mention here - the fact that while the rules allow women in most roles in fact women have been serving in significant numbers for decades would be worth presenting. I have had an extension of this data to 1997 in the past but cannot find it now - I am pursuing leads on the data in citable form. I beleive longer or shorter summaries of this could be on several pages once the main entry here is ready.--Smkolins 12:07, 20 November 2006 (UTC)