Talk:Australian migration zone

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Portal	Australian migration zone is within the scope of WikiProject Australia, which aims to improve Wikipedia's coverage of Australia and Australia-related topics. If you would like to participate, visit the project page.
Start	This article has been rated as Start-class on the quality scale.
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the importance scale.
	This article is supported by WikiProject Australian law.
	This article is supported by WikiProject Australian politics.
Assessment comments This article has been rated for quality and/or importance but has no comments yet. If appropriate, please review the article and then leave comments here to identify the strengths and weaknesses of the article and what work it will need.

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Australian migration zone article.
Please sign and date your posts by typing four tildes (~~~~). Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic. New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Ask questions, get answers. This is not a forum for general discussion about the article's subject.	Be polite Assume good faith No personal attacks Be welcoming	Article policies No original research Neutral point of view Verifiability

[edit] non chronological talk items below

"There is also confusion over the effect on Australia's sovereignty over the excised area."

Really? I haven't heard anything about this... who has suggested that sovereignty is affected, and in what way? - Borofkin 02:40, 12 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Hey Borofkin, You asked about excision of territory from Australia's migration zone and confusion re sovereignty. When the Tiwi islands were retrospectively removed from the migration zone the Australian media reported Tiwi islanders becoming concerned that their islands were no longer part of Australia. In addition the issue has been raised on talk back radio, etc. For myself, I researched the topic to find out just what effects excision land from the migration zone might have other than the desired one. I wondered, for example, if a legal immigrant might not be able to start their permanent residency there. Various authorities have stated that there are no consequences to this except to stop illegal immigrants having recourse to the courts. Why not just remove all Australian territory from the migration zone then? Apparently there are 2 reason: 1) national pride, 2) the UN would get upset since it would amount to Australia excluding all illegals from the courts Robertbrockway 0300, 12 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Excision has no effect on the rights of Australian citizens or permanent residents (or anyone legally admitted to Australia. Some Australian territory - such as Norfolk Island - has not been part of the migration zone for a long time, if ever. If Australia really wanted to deny illegals access to the courts it would be simpler to legislate specifically to do that and not bother with any excision legislation. The reason for excision was that Australia wants to keep an onshore appeal process, but stop those arriving illegally in territories adjacent to neohbouring countries from taking advantage of that. JAJ 03:45, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

I'm wondering if the title of this article is right? I certainly always thought the process was one of excision from the migration zone but then I see this: http://www.immi.gov.au/legislation/refugee/02.htm where it is clearly stated that "An excised offshore place is a part of Australia's territory. It remains part of Australia's migration zone." Hmm. Robertbrockway 0303, 12 Nov 2004 (UTC)

So, contrast that quote with this one: "The purpose of the legislation is to identify and define those parts of Australian territory which can be excised from the migration zone for the purposes of limiting the ability of persons who arrive in Australia unlawfully by boat to make a valid visa application." So, um, what they're saying is that Australia's "migration zone" still represents the same geographic area as Australias soverign territory, it's just that certain rights don't exist in certain parts (the excised bits) of that territory. Which means that there is no single name for the bulk of Australian territory where asylum application rights are unaffected. Gotta do some more research into wha is the general usage of the term "migration zone". - Borofkin 22:52, 14 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Hmm. The other page referenced in the External links section ( http://www.immi.gov.au/facts/71border.htm ), states "The migration zone is the area of Australia where a non-citizen must hold a visa in order to legally enter and remain in Australia." It then goes on to say "The territories excised from the migration zone are: .....". So, the devil is not in the term "migration zone", but in the term "excised". I had thought that it just meant "removed from", but clearly it has a deeper meaning. - Borofkin 23:09, 14 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Okay, I've reworded the article to reflect this new understanding. Let me know if you think it's closer to reality. - Borofkin 23:28, 14 Nov 2004 (UTC)

I'm happy with the new wording. I think we are being more accurate than most of the Australian media ;) Robertbrockway 08:34, Nov 15 2994 (UTC)

It's asking a lot for the media to understand a concept as complex as this. Effectively Australian sovereign territory divides into three:

• outside the migration zone entirely, eg Norfolk Island
• "excised offshore places" that are in the migration zone for most purposes except where people arrive unlawfully, eg Christmas Island
• the rest of Australia

No passport is needed to travel between an excised offshore place and mainland Australia. This is different to Norfolk Island, for example. JAJ 03:48, 19 February 2006 (UTC)