Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Vocelli Pizza

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Withdrawn by nominator. Non-admin close. ZZ ^Claims ~ Evidence 15:05, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Vocelli Pizza

• Withdrawn Rather than wait for an admin closure on this article (the outcome of which appears to be a foregone conclusion), anyone should feel free to perform a non-admin closure per WP:SNOW. I still don't believe that small restaurant chains such as Vocelli Pizza should be included, but the sources cited below and the opinions given support the idea that the article meets WP:N as it is currently written in the view of the community. At some point, I'll pursue the issue at the policy page. Avruch^Talk 22:12, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

Vocelli Pizza (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs) – (View log)

A small chain in Pennsylvania. In a worldwide encyclopedia, every small business/small franchise operation is not automatically notable in the absence of some other factor arguing for notability. Additionally, it is minimally referenced. A youtube video, a pizza franchise website, and one article in post-gazette.com (a local paper) regarding a name change. Avruch^Talk 00:10, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

Keep - Chain actually has locations in many other states besides Pennsylvania. Article has appropriate citations. The chain seems notable enough for an entry and holds with precedent. EDIT: OK...if you're going to pick part one part of my argument, I'll remove it and leave the rest. ++Arx Fortis (talk) 00:13, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Arguments_to_avoid_in_deletion_discussions#Individual_merit Avruch^Talk 00:16, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

OK - Appropriate citations:

• One article about the name change in a local PA newspaper
• Two citations to the corporate website
• One link to a YouTube video.

How does this establish notability, or provide RS citation for anything else in the article except the name change? Avruch^Talk 00:26, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

• Keep: Going though some of the G-Hits, the place appears to be well know. I do realize that a lot of those hits are from directory-type websites, so this Google News search helps out on the notability part. The article itself needs sources and expansion if possible. - Rjd0060 (talk) 00:27, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

Agreed. Also check G-news hits Oops..redundant link already posted by Rjd0060. ++Arx Fortis (talk) 00:29, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

Keep - Same arguments as Arx Fortis. There are so many less notable & smaller chains with pages. Plus, if we were to get rid of all of the regional or semi-national chains, that would basically leave us with McDumpster's and the Evil Empire, among others. To be honest, I thought there was already a Vocelli page until I was editing the Kurt Angle page and found out there wasn't. I think we've proven our points, and I'm not exactly a novice at Wikipedia.Jgera5 (talk) 00:32, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

To Rjd0060: I concur that more sources and expanding the article is needed, hence why I put in a stub tag whenever I created the page.Jgera5 (talk) 00:34, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

I understand that. I was just reiterating the point, as since the sources do exist (although are missing from the article), and the article needs expansion, no reason to delete it. - Rjd0060 (talk) 00:36, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

• Keep. We've got the Kurt Angle angle, plus we've now got the franchise being ranked in their industry's trade journal in the Top 100. (I just added that citation.) The Post-Gazette article (which is a major metro newspaper, btw) notes that the chain is multi-state. I'm seeing multiple sources stating that the chain is notable and verifiably so. —C.Fred (talk) 00:53, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
• Keep - Per comments above -- ¿Amar៛^{Talk to me/My edits} 04:20, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
• Keep. There are plenty of results on Google News Archive under both business names that could become citations, and there should be more sources than are there, but a regional chain of this size is certainly notable. --Dhartung | Talk 05:16, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
• Delete per nominator. A restraunt chain notable for a global encylopedia would be something like:
  • very large
  • very old
  • absolutely dominant in a given large area
  • with a unique and awarded cousine
  • notable in a historical or political sense --Futurano (talk) 12:55, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
• Keep see WP:PAPER. The article is clearly satisfies WP:V, and WP:N only requires that the business be cover in secondary sources. Local newspapers from Texas to Pennsylvania have run pieces about their expansion, and their choice to go to a single call center [1] warranted coverage in several papers. Burzmali (talk) 16:28, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

Vocelli's doesn't appear to be the subject of the above linked (pay only) article from LexisNexis. WP:N specifies direct "significant coverage" of the subject. Avruch^Talk 16:59, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

While I can't see the article to see if Vocelli's is in the content, it should be noted that LexisNexis didn't write the article. It originally appeared in The Washington Times. A search on the word Vocelli on this page results in this hit, so I would assume Vocelli's is mentioned in the article. I'm going to assume good faith that Burzmali read the full article. edit: You quote "significant coverage," from WP:N. Significant coverage is defined by WP:N as "sources address the subject directly in detail" and "Significant coverage is more than trivial but may be less than exclusive." To me, 282 Google news hits, most of which are exclusive coverage, show the subject meets WP:N. ++Arx Fortis (talk) 17:44, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

Actually, I had caught a similar article (or at least a better synopsis) on one of the other Google News hits, but I couldn't find it when I went to paste it into my response. It is more than trivial, and less than exclusive. Here is the article I originally found [2] —Preceding unsigned comment added by Burzmali (talk • contribs) 19:46, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

• Keep -- not just a mom and pop corner store or local chain. Locations in several states and the District of Columbia. -- Dougie WII (talk) 21:28, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.