Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Uys family

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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Delete. CitiCat ♫ 03:07, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Uys family

Uys_family (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs) - (View log)

Not notable, contrary to false claims of being one of "South Africa's foremost families.". No verifiable sources. NPOV violations. Non-verifiable and uses original research. ProudlySA 09:30, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

  • This AfD nomination was incomplete. It is listed now. DumbBOT 10:29, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
  • CommentIt all depends on you you define "foremost". A term like "foremost" is a relative term after all. I am not aware of any other white family that has contributed more consistently to South Africa's history. Certainly anyone who even visits South Africa briefly, knows the Uys family is one of the country's leading white families. They have been prominent both in the past as well as the 20th Century. For example, Jamie Uys, the film producer and Pieter Dirk Uys the left wing political activist are cousins, and they are related to the Uyses of history.
By the way, the article is too long, and a lot of the military stuff should be trimmed back. Some of it would be good in a book on South African military history, but it is information-overload for an encyclopedia. Also, I suspect some of it is incorrect. Certainly in the last hundred years Pieter-Dirk Uys and Jamie Uys have been a lot more significant than a lot of soldiers from centuries past.
There are other issues with the article too. For example describing the Uyses as Afrikaaners or Boers is often incorrect. Some are Afrikaaners, and some are English. Furthermore some regard themselves as Dutch rather than Afrikaans. The only thing you can say with certainty is that their ancestors originally lived in Leyden and Amsterdam and came to South Africa as Dutch colonists. Hence you can say they are of Dutch origin. All this may be confusing to an outsider, but it is all the result of the incredible and sometimes confusing diversity that is South Africa. South Africans have been marrying across ethnic group boundaries for centuries which contributes to the complexity.
While we are on the subject, the article misrepresents the Uyses. As a group they are known best for their conciliatory behaviour. The most prominent Uyses were consistently leaders in reconciling the Dutch and the English after the British takeover of the Cape Colony. Where they engaged in military activity, it was often to assist the British. For example the assistance they gave the British in the Anglo- Zulu wars. In the 20th century they have been leaders in reconciling white and black South Africans. For example, Pieter-Dirk Uys, was one of the leading opponents of racial discrimination, and Jamie Uys, whose most succesful film featured a black leading man. The military and bellicose emphasis of the article misrepresents South Africa and the family. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cholmondeley-Smythe (talk • contribs)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Kurykh 17:47, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
  • Delete, we generally reserve Lastname family articles for those families which already have at least two (or better, three) notable members. Not just families that have a lot of members who are almost notable if you're generous. --Dhartung | Talk 23:14, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
  • Delete - Wikipedia articles are not Genealogical entries.
  • Keep these are not genealogy; they are combination articles. Dhartung's proposed criterion makes no sense at all to me--we write these articles because the individuals do not yt have enough information for articles of their own . Every encyclopedia does that, Britanicca, Oxford DNB. DGG (talk) 10:04, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.