Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Summerset Isles

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Delete per WP:FICT. Provides no real world context. Keep !votes had no basis in policy. Resolute 03:37, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Summerset Isles

Summerset Isles (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs) – (View log)

This article asserts no notability through reliable sources, and as such is just an in-universe repetition of plot elements from the Elder Scrolls games. As Wikipedia is not a gameguide, and this is all duplicative, this can be safely deleted. Judgesurreal777 (talk) 19:20, 27 November 2007 (UTC) Judgesurreal777 (talk) 19:20, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

• Delete fails WP:FICT. RMHED (talk) 19:26, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
• Keep: Other articles in the Elder Scrolls series have withstood AfD with shakier grounds and much less content. -Senori (talk) 01:43, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

That doesn't mean this article has any notability. Judgesurreal777 (talk) 01:48, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Mailer Diablo 13:11, 4 December 2007 (UTC)

• Delete. No out-of-universe perspective, no real-world notability. Does not meet the requirements of Wikipedia:Notability (fiction). Pagrashtak 15:58, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
• Keep What's with you (judge) and notability, the purpose of notability rules is so nobody starts up articles about their WoW guild (something I've seen before by the way), this is an article that has proven itself well known to thousands and relevant to millions (based on retail sales) so I'm gonna go with a keep, but again if someone puts up a giant TES locations page, this could get the axe, although expanding this article and putting up a summary and link on said TES locations page could work.TostitosAreGross (talk) 00:23, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

And what would doing any of that accomplish? If none of it is relevant to the wider world, and there is no evidence that it is (creator commentary, early designs, controversy among gamers), then it is as unnotable as all those guilds. Judgesurreal777 (talk) 01:58, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

• Keep The game is relevant to thewider world, and therefore the elements of it are also. As a major location its important within the game and so, if enough can be said, is appropriate for an article. DGG (talk) 08:50, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

....Yet it still have no references, so no confirmed notability. How does that make any sense? Judgesurreal777 (talk) 18:05, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

• Delete Ok, so it has 1 outside source, its been up fo AfD for at least 12 days, it is written in-universe and based on a gameguide, showing tendencies that lead me to believe it fails our notability guidlines.Mbisanz (talk) 17:55, 9 December 2007 (UTC)
• Keep Another target for destruction? Google Summerset Isles and this article is the first result. I think it's not only obvious that this article is helpful, but also it is very well written and frequently visited. Deletion would just be a waste of perfectly good information on a game universe. Granted perhaps this article should specify more on the fact that it is all part of a video game, so I will do a little bit of revision to make it demonstrate more non-fictional information and make more sense to the first time reader when I get home from work. Likewise I think Black Marsh, Morrowind, High Rock, etc... should be re-posted and minorly revised in the same mannner. In this method we all win, no vital information is deleted and wikipedia is better maintained for a little bit.

Good Day The Grey Wizard (talk) 15:02, 11 December 2007 (UTC) — The Grey Wizard (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

None of this addresses the notability of the topic. Pagrashtak 16:05, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

Grey Wizard, you have zero understanding of Wikipedia policies or how articles about fiction are supposed to be written; please see WP:RS, WP:FICTION, WP:WAF, because otherwise your not not making a coherent argument. Judgesurreal777 (talk) 18:55, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

You Know what I would like to see Judgesurreal? Hold all polices that you have cleverly manipulated to your will aside for one moment please. I would like to see more comprehension with these articles, the same thing I assume you should or do want to see. I would have not problem with this being merged with Tamriel, cleaned up a bit, revised, and ultimately more useful. I think if this was merged, it would be more tidy and comprehensive, so long as the links from Google, and wikipedia about Summerset Isles were linked to the actual information about Summerset. In that manner we both get what we want, wikipedia is more clean for you, and I still have the information I so "dramatically" value. I am an Elder Scrolls Modder, and I use these pages all the time, weather for a nice little reminder, or serious research. I, among other Beyond Cyrodiil Modders can and will use these pages, no matter if they are individual scattered articles or finely organized into one article. Agreed? Truce? No more war? The Grey Wizard (talk) 18:18, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Grey Wizard, this is an Encyclopedia, it is not supposed to be useful in terms of learning about all the details of a fictional world, or simply the repetition of plot points or geographic details from "The Elder Scrolls" or any other fictional world. You must understand that there is an Elder Scrolls wiki that has this type of information that you enjoy using and reading about the game, but Wikipedia structures this kind of information differently, and here we can discuss how the topic was developed, how the writers and developers created the world, and how their creation was reflected in the wider world. If we cant pull that off, then there is no need of an article on this topic. As I have mentioned in another AFD, I believe we will probably be able to put together a "Universe of the Elder Scrolls series", and if we are lucky, a "Characters of the Elder Scrolls series", but every detail of this universe would probably be a quixotic quest as we have yet to find one reference for most of these Elder Scrolls fiction articles. Judgesurreal777 (talk) 19:39, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

• Keep There is no reason to remove this. A lot of people i know use this article. I use this article. it got good information so i dont see why it should be removed. 16:20, 11 December 2007 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.247.57.218 (talk) — 83.247.57.218 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

"Useful" is not a keep criteria, and you have also ignored the nominating concerns. Judgesurreal777 (talk) 16:58, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

• Delete per above. SharkD (talk) 20:33, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.