Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Spunga

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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Comments by first-time contributors or single-purpose accounts have been given low weighting. A subsequent redirect to squeegee or mop might be appropriate, but as for which, I leave to editor discretion. A note that original research is not permitted on wiktionary, either. Neıl ☎ 15:18, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Spunga

Spunga (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs) – (View log)

Disputed PROD. Non-notable and unverified neologism. Only reference is a blog & suspect it is WP:MADEUP nancy (talk) 22:23, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

  • Delete Israeli neologism, looks like a squeegee on a stick to me. EDIT After reading the article again, I should add that Wikipedia is not a guide to washing floors. --NickPenguin(contribs) 00:31, 25 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep. Surprisingly enough, this one looks real. A Google search for "israel sponga" turns up a number of references to the term; a Google Groups search turned up a few hits from 1997, suggesting that it isn't a particularly new term. I don't know where to look for reliable sources documenting the practice, but I suspect that someone more familiar with the culture may have an easier time finding sources than I. Zetawoof(ζ) 00:57, 25 December 2007 (UTC)
    • Comment Although it is true that there are links, these are all blogs. I am uncertain if this demonstrated notability. --NickPenguin(contribs) 01:13, 25 December 2007 (UTC)
    • If nothing else, it suggests that this term is more than just a neologism. Do remember that Israel isn't an English-speaking country, so the hits we're seeing are mainly from English-speaking visitors to the country. Zetawoof(ζ) 04:59, 25 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Comment I did some more digging and have found that sponga is Esperanto for spongy[1] (and spongo is Esperanto for sponge) so there does seem to be a verifiable, if somewhat tenuous, link between the word and the act of cleaning however as Wikipedia is not a dictionary and as all other references are blogs, my inclination is still to delete. nancy (talk) 07:29, 25 December 2007 (UTC)
    • Remember that this is an Israeli cultural artifact - "spunga" or "sponga" is an approximate rendering of a Hebrew term into English. The Esperanto connection is probably irrelevant. Zetawoof(ζ) 07:41, 25 December 2007 (UTC)
      • Agreed, nothing to do with Esperanto. The word "sponge" is originally Greek and appears in numerous languages. --Dhartung | Talk 04:03, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
    • Nancy - if you ever traveled to Israel you would know that Spunga is a valid term for the special way Israelis clean/wash floors. Just because YOU never heard of it doesn't invalidate it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Poodwahr (talk • contribs) 14:07, 25 December 2007 (UTC)
      • There are many special and nonnotable things done in Israel. If you can provide a some sources and/or a good explination as to why this particular method of washing the floor is notable, then this article can be kept. --NickPenguin(contribs) 17:30, 25 December 2007 (UTC)
  • This is not a squeegee ----- the spunga actually employes a shmata (rag) which is cleverly wound around the bottom of the spunga in a figure 8 fashion. (A squeegee only employes the rubber end.) This shmata soaks up the soapy water that was flung on the floor and it both scrubs as well as absorbs the water. Very different from a squeegee.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.226.223.97 (talk • contribs) 17:51, 25 December 2007 — 99.226.223.97 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
    • Comment I do not think this description matches the object pictured in the image in the article, although perhaps my eyes are not so good. And regardless of how clever this may be, I still do not see how it is notable. --NickPenguin(contribs) 19:10, 25 December 2007 (UTC)
      • Why is it notable? Because it is the only way that all Israeli's wash floors. And it is unusual in that I'm reasonable certain that none of the people involved in this discussion have ever used a spunga, being that you have never cleaned a floor in Israel. It is a far more effective way to clean because the mop is not being reinserted in dirty water. The entry should certainly remain.Myteemouse (talk) 06:36, 26 December 2007 (UTC)
      • Unfortunately Nick does not comprehend the special way 6 million people wash the floors in their residences in Israel. This is unique in the world as far as I can tell having traveled to over 100 countries (how may have you been to?). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.226.223.97 (talk) 16:54, 26 December 2007 (UTC) — 99.226.223.97 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
        • My personal travel history is irrelevant to the points I have made in this discussion. I would politely request that you do not imply that I am ignorant just because you presume I haven't traveled to X number of countries and absorbed Y number of minor details about those cultures. Thanks, --NickPenguin(contribs) 17:41, 26 December 2007 (UTC)
        • Not ignorant Nick, just unfamiliar with the practices in foreign countries. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.226.223.97 (talk • contribs) 2007-12-26T19:32:23 — 99.226.223.97 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Keilanatalk(recall) 00:54, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Comment Would it be possible to source in Hebrew? At present I'm leaning either "weak delete" (no prejudice) or "wiktionary". --Dhartung | Talk 04:03, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Delete First, it looks like some sort of Swiffer to me; I'm not trying being ignorant when I say this, but the article consists of nothing more than a description of what a Spunga is. The rest is an unreferenced assertion of the item's popularity, and a how-to manual. I'd suggest recreating it if valid sources pop up. Master of Puppets Care to share? 05:04, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
    • Comment The photographs are just items used when you spunga, which is a cleaning method. Tile floors, furniture removed, splash a whole lot of water everywhere, squeegee/mop it outside. As noted, however, sources are a problem. --Dhartung | Talk 07:32, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Note: This debate has been included in the list of Israel-related deletion discussions. -- -- pb30<talk> 06:20, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Delete entirely non-notable, could perhaps be introduced into an article of Israeli interest, but even there as a very minor footnote of low interest. Certainly not worth an article in Mainspace. docboat (talk) 10:50, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
    • Comment I am confused; your vote says keep, but your reasoning says delete. --NickPenguin(contribs) 16:06, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
      • It was vandalized by 99.226.223.97 (talk · contribs). I've reverted the vandalism. Uncle G (talk) 18:51, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Merge to Mop. Colonel Warden (talk) 10:54, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Merge to Mop. No decent references available in Hebrew either. пﮟოьεԻ 57 11:15, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
  • KeepAll comment above are from contributors who really don't know anything about spunga and are postulating. Truth be known spunga is a very common term for anyone that has spent more than 1 week in Israel. I doubt the above contibutors have ever ventured to that part of the world. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.226.223.97 (talk) 12:43, 30 December 2007 (UTC) — 99.226.223.97 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
  • Keep This is a very important instrument for cleaning; if it is utilized by an entire country that certainly makes it more notable than a DustBuster which has its own page, without any sources, without any pictures. This is an item that can be purchased in most local convenience stores, while a mop cannot be found in any store in Israel (I've been living in Israel for 8 years). This item is so significant that houses and apartments are designed to facilitate its use. These arguments lead to the obvious conclusion that spunga is a necessity for Mainspace.17:33, 30 December 2007 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Myteemouse (talk • contribs)
  • Merge or Redirect to Squeegee (rather than Mop). The word may be genuine, but I don't think that one particular regional word for an everyday activity (cleaning the floor), or for the implement used for it, is notable in itself; especially when the implement is already covered in an existing article. We don't have an article on "hoovering" as distinct from Vacuum cleaner, after all. Tevildo (talk) 18:06, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep Hoovering is the same as vacuuming ... But SPUNGAING is very different from SQUEEGEEING. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Poodwahr (talk • contribs) 18:14, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Delete per nom. No decent sources available. Article is original research. Clearly a non-notable variation. --Evb-wiki (talk) 22:32, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep Everyone who is asking for the entry to be deleted is ignorant of the spunga. The reason the entry was made in the first place is because I couldn't find a reference for spunga on Wikipedia.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.129.97.254 (talk • contribs)
  • Redirect to Squeegee. No point in having articles about the exact same thing in another language.-h i s s p a c e r e s e a r c h 14:01, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep Spunga is NOT the same as squeegee!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.129.97.254 (talk) 15:29, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
    • Yeah. You've already said that . . . (and already !voted) . . . at least once. --Evb-wiki (talk) 15:33, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
    • Yeah. Sometimes one has repeat what they said (wrote) Because it falls on deaf ears. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.129.97.254 (talk) 17:33, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Comment - note that the only "source" provided specifically describes the item as "a big squeegee for doing 'sponga' or floor mopping." [2] --Evb-wiki (talk) 19:42, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Comment I find it amusing that you put some much of your energies battling against one little word!! You must be great in court - I'd want you to represent me any day! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.129.97.254 (talk) 20:06, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
  • Delete admitted OR, Israeli neologism per NickPenguin. No need to merge to mop or squeege and clutter up those articles with non-notable country-specific words. 'Sponga' is merely a rag wrapped around a squeegy - a cheap way to replicate a mop. --Shuki (talk) 08:59, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

Keep I think the article says that spunga is a method of cleaning and includes design of buildings etc. and the rag just seems to be used to dry the wet floor after the squeegee-like thing is used. This seems to be unique. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Myteemouse (talk • contribs)

  • Please stop making multiple !votes. --Evb-wiki (talk) 13:58, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

Keep Myteemouse is correct -- architectural schools in Israel have course that teaches one how to design a building or dwelling to accomodate the spunga hole so that the water pouring through the hole does not interfere with other residences. Additionally dwelling are designed to slope gently towards the spunga hole (know in hebrew as khor spunga). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.129.97.254 (talk) 15:16, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Comment There have been a lot of keep votes with claims similar to this one, mostly from anonymous users. If anyone has some sources to support these claims, then please provide them in a timely manner. --NickPenguin(contribs) 18:17, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Keep Note the rabbinic discourse related to spunga - especially this year of "shmita" Shut She'eilat Shlomo - Questions of Jewish Law

A talk given after lunch at the yeshiva -

"Sponga" during Shemitta

Q: Is it permissible to do "sponga" (cleaning the floor by pouring a bucket of water on the floor, swishing it around with a cloth on a squeegee and pushing the water into holes in the floor or outside. It is a popular way to clean one's home in Israel because most houses have stone floors) and push the water onto the ground outside during the Shemitta year?

A: It is permissible for various reasons:

1. The prohibition of watering the ground during the Shemitta year is a rabbinic prohibition. This is unlike watering the ground on Shabbat and Yom Tov which is a Torah prohibition (a sub-labor [toladah] of "Zore'a – seeding"). It is therefore forbidden on Shabbat and Yom Tov to wash one's hands over the ground. One must be especially careful on Sukkot. During the Shemittah year, however, watering is only a rabbinic prohibition.

2. According to the majority of Rishonim (early authorities), observing Shemittah nowadays is a rabbinic mitzvah.

3. Watering the ground by pushing the water from "sponga" is an "unintended act which is not beneficial to him," since one does not want to water the ground or violate Shemittah, but needs some place to put the water.

4. Some people have pipes on their porch which brings the water to the ground. If the water travels through the pipe onto the ground it is called a "grama" – an indirect act.

Since the act is far from a Torah prohibition and there are extenuating circumstances, it is permissible. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.129.97.254 (talk) 21:20, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

  • Please stop making multiple !votes. --Evb-wiki (talk) 00:55, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
Comment This is a link to the article the above excerpt came from: http://www.ou.org/shabbat_shalom/article/aviner_parashat_shemot_5768/#shutshlomo --NickPenguin(contribs) 21:28, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
  • Yes, nobody denies the term is _genuine_. The question is whether or not it's _notable_. See WP:DICT. Tevildo (talk) 00:00, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
  • Yes, Seems notable to a lot of people, and I'd hate to see the state of the country without it!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.226.223.97 (talk) 02:02, 3 January 2008 (UTC) — 99.226.223.97 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
  • It is so non-notable that, after 10 days of discussion, there is still not a single reliable source supporting this article. --Evb-wiki (talk) 02:06, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
  • It is so notable that the discussion here is significant. Unfortunately Evb must live in a gated community with little knowledge of the outside world. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.129.97.254 (talk) 13:38, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
First of all, Sponja (nut Spunga) is a very well known term in Hebrew. Google ספונג'ה and see how many hits you get. The term is used for the specific method of using a rag at the end of the squeegee. It also has a cultural connotation, as a "lowly" form of cleaning. Yet, the term does not even have an article on the Hebrew wikipedia, so I believe it should be moved to Wiktionary or deleted. 88.134.146.103 (talk) 20:58, 4 January 2008 (UTC)— 88.134.146.103 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
  • The anglicised spelling is indeed SPUNGA (not sponja). It may also belong in the Hebrew wiki, but given the the majority of people living in Israel speak English and many do not speak Hebrew, it should cetainly remain here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Poodwahr (talk • contribs) 21:20, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
Why do you say that? Google "sponja" together with "cleaning" and you'll find many results, for example this [3]; Google "spunga" with "cleaning" and you'll find only wikipedia. I'm an Israeli by birth, and for a while even I wasn't sure what you're talking about. 88.134.146.103 (talk) 13:18, 5 January 2008 (UTC)— 88.134.146.103 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
Now I see that 'sponga' is also a spelling that is used in english (though it's incorrect as far as pronunciation goes). Here's a few more refs: [4], [5].88.134.146.103 (talk) 13:24, 5 January 2008 (UTC)— 88.134.146.103 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
  • Merge and redirect. No sources cited to verify claimed notability. Kim Dent-Brown (Talk) 12:41, 5 January 2008 (UTC)

How many sources are needed - the article provides one external link and one reference, and looking here in the discussions there are countless sources.Gustoad (talk) 17:03, 5 January 2008 (UTC) — Gustoad (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

It is more a case of quality than quantity. The issue with the cited sources is that they do not meet Wikipedia's criteria of verifiability as they are blogs or other similar web-content. nancy (talk) 18:00, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
  • Merge to Mop. The object in question is clearly not a squeegee (a pusher of water) but a form of mop (an absorber of water). It also seems to have only modest notability, at best. The basic information about the device, though, certainly seems worthy of preservation within the discussion of mops, even with only modest sourcing. Tim Ross·talk 16:16, 6 January 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep Ask an Israeli where to buy a mop, and she'll tell you "In America". Ask her where to buy a spunga and she'll point you to the corner makolet (variety store). Spunga is not mop and mop is not spunga --- sorry - if the glove don't fit you must acquit. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.226.223.97 (talk) 18:23, 6 January 2008 (UTC) — 99.226.223.97 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
  • Again, please stop making multiple !votes. --Evb-wiki (talk) 18:52, 6 January 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep user Evb user nancy and other such uninformed users - stick to your areas of expertise please. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Leahmalkag (talk • contribs) — Leahmalkag (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
  • transwiki to http://www.wiktionary.org/, where original research is allowed. The content of the article appears to be original research, not derived from verifiable sources. --SmokeyJoe (talk) 11:40, 7 January 2008 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.