Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Sonoma County wineries

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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. ···日本穣? · Talk to Nihonjoe 21:52, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Sonoma County wineries

Sonoma County wineries (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs) – (View log)

Listcruft. Better served by a category. Blueboy96 19:23, 9 July 2007 (UTC)

  • Delete. Listcruft for people with extremely good vision! Wikipedia is not a directory. --Charlene 19:39, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep, I see no reason to get rid of it. It is more then just a list of wineries and has a very good list of references. Callelinea 19:42, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
Comment: Translation: WP:ILIKEIT. Not a valid argument for keeping an article. Blueboy96 19:50, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
Comment If that translates to ILIKEIT, then your reason translates to WP:IDONTLIKEIT. Not a valid argument for deleting an article. DHowell 03:22, 14 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep, Compared to some of the lists I've run across, that one is downright pretty. I think it works as a list for now, but once the number of wineries with articles gets higher, half the list maybe, then turn it into a category. Burzmali 19:51, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep Well sourced article on legit topic perhaps a little short right now. If the list of wineries is a problem it can be removed, but the info on the wine region is totally appropriate. --Daniel J. Leivick 19:53, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Merge intro and the 4 links to wineries with current articles with Sonoma Valley. "Sonoma County is home to more than 250 wineries" Do we need a list of all of them? WP:NOT a directory. Canuckle 20:43, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Merge as above. Those wineries that are sufficiently notable already have their own articles, those that do not are just receiving free advertising. People seem to forget that wineries are for-profit business enterprises too. Just making wine doesn't make a business notable. VanTucky (talk) 21:06, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
There's plenty of history in the wineries of Sonoma valley, such that any of the wineries started before 1940 are likely notable. The question is where to draw the line. If you start adding links to the individual wineries in the "root" article, it's going to force the move to a category when this list would suffice. I doubt many people browse Wikipedia to fine a winery. Burzmali 23:26, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
I'm not sure if you're talking about a linking problem with just the wineries with articles, but linking only those ones (if they're not notable/don't have their own article, it's spam) shouldn't cause a problem. At least not one as bad as a directory of spam links. VanTucky (talk) 23:37, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
I mean that there is a lot of potential articles to be written on the older Sonoma Valley wineries. If we just keep adding them to Sonoma Valley as they are created, it will get ugly quickly. How about an article on the History of wine making in Sonoma Valley? That would satisfy the need to prevent the individual winery articles with some historical significance from becoming orphaned, and it keeps Sonoma Valley from getting crowded. Burzmali 00:42, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
That seems to be what we have here. If you want to say this article's title can be improved upon, I wouldn't argue with you. I definitely think an article like this on a specific notable wine-making region should be kept. AllGloryToTheHypnotoad 18:09, 15 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Merge to either Sonoma Valley aor Sonoma County, CA per above.--JForget 22:45, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep if there were no list at the bottom of the article would we be really discussing this? Don't like the list, be WP:BOLD and edit the article. The subject is certainly notable, Sonoma County is a government-approved appellation for wine in the US, 27 Code of Federal Regulations 9.29, and appellations with their incident agribusiness are notable. Pleny of WP:RSes exist about Sonoma County's wine business. Carlossuarez46 23:39, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Delete. Sonoma County as a region is very notable for its wines, but not very many of the wineries are really all that notable. Under the circumstances, I would opine that this list is better served by a category. --Dennis The Tiger (Rawr and stuff) 00:02, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep I cannot follow the logic just above: it is precisely because most of them would not be notable enough for separate articles that a combination article like this is appropriate. The list portion can and should be expanded to provide more information than just the names. DGG (talk) 00:39, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep The article serves a definite purpose as stated just above. --Stormbay 01:17, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep. The article is specific and useful. --upzon 01:34, 10 July 2007 (UTC)— Upzon (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
NOTE Account created yesterday, only three edits. Blueboy96 18:33, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Delete just delete it. The article is just an exact c&p of the section in Sonoma County article, bar the laundry list, which fails WP:NOT#DIRECTORY miserably, so there is no reason to keep it until the Sonoma County, California article is considerably expanded. Ohconfucius 08:15, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Keep: This is not just a list, it is an article with a list of items that are "associated with" the topic of the article. It is not a directory because the list does not provide information about how to find the wineries or contact the wineries (and is thus, not spam). The article itself could be expanded to include other information about the wine industry in Sonoma (including the explosion in the number of wineries in the last few years), but why would you move links to winery articles into the Sonoma County, California article? If this could/should be merged, perhaps it could go to Wine Country (California).--Tinned Elk 01:03, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Also, just checked the history of this article. It was recently broken out of the Sonoma County, California to allow an article that would focus on the wineries of the county. I think it is unnecessary to delete it at this stage. Lots of work went into the list, formatting it this way to take up less room and leave a wealth of information for future development. I can see lots of work that could be done and the list is a good starting point. Certainly merging it back into the main article would be ridiculous. --Tinned Elk 02:02, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
  • no vote but comment - This article should be kept if someone can tie in some text about some award winning wines. I am sure that there are some good ones from the county. The others in the list can serve as a list of potential articles. Either that or form a winery board, like they have in wikiproject -- where the names are red linked. Someone went through a lot of hard work typing the names, I think. Fineday 01:50, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Note: This debate has been included in the list of California-related deletions. -- John Vandenberg 04:46, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Strong keep, several published books ought to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that this is a notable encyclopedic topic. Whether the list itself belongs in the article is an editorial decision outside the scope of AfD, but the article clearly should not be deleted. DHowell 03:22, 14 July 2007 (UTC)
  • keep - I think the list section could be pared down to notable wineries, preferably by an expert. However, the article above the list seems like a good first try at beginning a proper article on a specific and notable wine-producing region; I'd say the article is worthy of keeping, as it'll provide useful information once it's been improved upon. I think it also deserves to stay forked from the main Sonoma county article. AllGloryToTheHypnotoad 18:07, 15 July 2007 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.