Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Rajkumar Kanagasingam/Archive

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was KEEP. -Doc^g 01:24, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Rajkumar Kanagasingam

Rajkumar Kanagasingam (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs)

Looks like advertising for his upcoming book. I cannot verify that the book has been published. Without that, I believe the artcile fails WP:BIO -Nv8200p talk 04:27, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

• Delete - vanispamcruftisement. "Looks like advertising" - it is advertising. Look at the history, the majority was written by Rajsingam (talk · contribs). MER-C 05:11, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
• Keep - sources in external links section assert notability. "I cannot verify" != "I am too lazy to look". After Raj was made aware of WP:AUTO he asked myself and RaveenS (talk · contribs) to write it for him.Bakaman 05:46, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

• Note: This debate has been included in the list of India-related deletions. Bakaman 05:54, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
• Keep - Biography of a notable person deserves to be met with a "This article needs expansion" tag not and AfD. _{Freedom skies| talk}  06:13, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
• Delete selfaggrandizement written by subject of article. Boo. Chris 06:20, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
• Delete - Looks like Rajsingam violating the WP:NOT#SOAPBOX for find the market for his book. --♪♫ ĽąĦĩŘǔ ♫♪ ^{Walkie-talkie} 07:09, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
• No Comment - It is because of the request of the German students who are volunteering in Asia only I posted my bio Rajkumar Kanagasingam to the wikipedia originally but wrongly, but it was actually created by Wackymacs[1] and subsequently shaped by others User:Pearle, User:Bluebot, User:RaveenS, User:ProveIt and User:Bakasuprman. After they all have given notability only, I added photos and few more details. Rajsingam 07:24, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

I kindly request here Jimmy Wales and the Administrators to verify the good faith of the User:Nv8200p for placing AfD tag than "This article needs expansion" just two days after my controversial discussion for my community in the discussion page of Anton Balasingham. Rajsingam 08:47, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

References (off-line media archives) Rajsingam 16:17, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

• I think you should climb the Reichstag dressed as Spider-Man while you are at it. Tarinth 18:31, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

• Tarinth, I think you should open your eyes and take a look at all those printed reliable sources Rajsingam has provided (plenty of newspaper scans!). — Wackymacs 19:00, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

• My comment was purely in response to the absurd call for Jimmy Wales to give attention to this matter.Tarinth 19:01, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

Comment- User:Wackymacs has actually copied whole-sale from your profile[2]and there is not much that he has done on his own. If you are saying that you have added some pictures and done a FEW more edits, how come the maximum number of edits (69 edits)are done from your account excluding your IP edits. If you count the number of IP edits as well it will surely exceed 85.[3]. If you don't mind could you explain what you mean by I posted my bio Rajkumar Kanagasingam to the wikipedia originally but wrongly, but it was actually created by Wackymacs. --♪♫ ĽąĦĩŘǔ ♫♪ ^{Walkie-talkie} 08:29, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Reply I posted the information blanking the entire lists. But it was User:Wackymacs who fixed it properly (I mean created). Yes I did hundreds of edits as a newbie on my Bio but that didn't significantly expand it, but that made me afterwards to create nearly 10 new wikipedia entries such as Dominic Jeeva, Pandara Vannian, Arumaipperumal, Asian-German Sports Exchange Program, Rosy Senanayake, James W. Spain, Gamani Corea, Asian Legal Resource Centre, Kandyan Kingdom and more with expanding other existing wikipedia entries. Rajsingam 12:23, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

• Delete. Notability not established. The links provided are ezines or press-release sits where anybody can submit a "press release" (such as openpr.com, 1888pressrelease etc.) utcursch | talk 08:02, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
• Keep: Expansion, not delete. If no significant expansion after some time then put AfD again.Rumpelstiltskin223 11:21, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
• Keep. This should be expanded, not deleted. The person is notable. Passes WP:BIO. Verifiable and reliable sources are given in the article. — Wackymacs 11:49, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
• Week keep: the subject of the article barely seems to meet the requirements regarding notability as a columnist and author. There also seems to be a problem finding reliable source, however one must bear in mind that many developing countries (like Sri Lanka) are technologically under-developed and that a web-search cannot be considered a exhaustive method for establishing notability in such cases. Furthermore English is not the primary language in this country (compare with Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Dominic Jeeva). I'm really on the fence here, because it is a conflict of interest if the subject of the article is doing most of the editing. --Oden 12:42, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
• Keep- expand.--D-Boy 19:19, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
• Keep. The references cited above by Rajsingam clearly meet the primary criterion of WP:N; multiple and non-trivial published reports. The article should stay despite WP:AUTO concerns. Ccscott 22:31, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
• Keep. One can point to COI here, and while it's bad for to edit your own article, I think that Raj has made it a point - he is entirely notable. Now if it hasn't been done so, can somebody please make sure those links that Raj provided are in the article? --Dennisthe2 01:28, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
• Delete NN, agree with MER-C it looks like advertising. Davidpdx 11:23, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
• Keep- expand with available published off-line press reports. DoDoBirds 12:14, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
• Keep - Well known and notable person. Just because a famous personality contributes a photo or few minor details to an article about himself, it does not become Soapbox or Vanity. By the way, is it a rule that the moment one becomes a wikipedia editor his article should be deleted.  Doctor Bruno  19:21, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
• Delete So User:Rajsingam created his own article here..And after realising there is WP:BIO he kindly asked his friends to write this for him !!! So his friends did the rest, I would say, for him !! is anyone missing the comical part here ?? See this Diff to realise, how hard he tries to use wikipedia to boast about himself![4]. This person is absolutely not notable in Sri Lanka . He is definitely unheard in the academic field..I am still unable to verify his book.. I am yet to meet any one who has even heard of this book !! I am yet to see the importance of this and this other than editor wants to say He has more German friends !!! The whole article doesn't make any sense, and its not even worth having a debate on this--Iwazaki 19:24, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

• My comment This editorUser:Iwazaki is trying hard to defame me; it is because of my controversial argument with the editor over the funeral of Anton Balasingham in the discussion page Talk:Anton Balasingham and the massacres of my community and their persecution in the same page. My article was created by User:Wackymacs, I didn't know anything about Wikipedia at that time, though I referred for my book a lot from wikipedia. I posted my initial information only blanking many pages. After the Google search only, I found my name on wikipedia. After that only I started to edit. But when you compare my other contributions, you will come to know the amount, I have spent for my Bio is not so much. There were many things, I might have added from the off-line media archives about my activities, but I didn't attempt. The editor is criticizing me, she/he hasn't heard of me in the academic world, but two of my public lectures were presided by Dr. Gamani Corea, a former Secretary-General of UNCTAD, so what the editor is going to tell for that. I have placed those events in the newspaper archives in Talk:Rajkumar Kanagasingam. Why the editor is hell-bent to defame me could be well judged by the language the editor used to criticize a highly respected Bishop as boot-licker on Talk:Anton Balasingham. Rajsingam 01:13, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

• REPLY The above reply itself,qualify,perfectly for the deletion of the article.The user Rajasingham has shown that he is not afraid to accuse anyone given the opportunity.He is here, engage in baseless accusation for me without even trying to address the issues I've raised here.I've no desire to defame him,, but that doesn't mean I'm going to endorse what ever he says here. For what I have read from other users, It became evident that this user had violated WP:BIO miserably.And when he realised this, he had asked his friends "to do edits for him",and I found this "comical"(read user Bakamans comments).BUT, I want this article to be deleted not only for this,for me violation of rules is not the main issue here.I care more about the "importance of this person " and "Does he deserve to have an article of him in wikipedia" ?? Sadly, I don't see a single notability in this person which justify having his article here.He claims to have done public lectures ??!! IS this notable ?? Millions of people doing public lectures all over the world ,and do wikipedia need articles for every public lecturer ?? He has hilariously put some pictures of him giving a lecture (??) to some German students at a beer table, is this notable ?? I went though the articles he wrote in the Daily News, other than cow-towing the ex PM Ranil Wikramasinghe, he has done nothing special at all !! And please remember this person , is not even a journalist, he just had a couple random articles,which is possible for anyone !!

This user is just an NGO worker,working in Sri Lanka..His name is unheard in the academic fields, His name is unheard among the local writers , His name is unheard in the field of politics, His book is virtually non existence in Sri Lanka, and I am still trying to verify it !! I have nothing personal against him, BUT I really don't see why we should even have his BIO ,in here,in the first place.And for the off-topic comment, I am still waiting his reply at the relevant talk page..Care to answer over their ?? --Iwazaki 09:06, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Iwazaki, his book doesn't seem to be on sale or even published yet. From a PR... "The book will be released by the US publisher AuthorHouse in the coming months and will be available worldwide and could be ordered at over 30,000 retail outlets and will be listed with AuthorHouse.com, Amazon.com, Barnesandnoble.com, Borders.com, Abesbooks.com, Booksamillion.com, Target.com and more!". This is probably why you can't verify it yet. — Wackymacs 09:56, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

The very first sentence of the article is "Rajkumar Kanagasingam is the author of the book German Memories in Asia"..This person is claiming to be an author of a book which has not been published yet !! The book is not even out yet,it wont be out soon either,not a date for publishing is disclosed, and I don't know why anything of this book is even mention in this article !! --Iwazaki 15:42, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

• She/He blamed the Bishop as a LTTE's boot-licker and now she/he is finding various accusations against me. I don't feel even answer to the reply, but I am compelled to do so. My activities are multi-faceted not within one area. I never claimed I am a sole columnist or lecturer or an NGO worker. My attempts started from the beginning something extra ordinarily whether it is my peace initiative from my school days or my other activities in a more innovative ways. If the editor is accusing me that I have given a lecture at the dinner table then what about my lecture on Global Role of the US Economy in the Year 2000 and Beyond at the US Fulbright Commission, Colombo which was presided by Dr. Gamani Corea with the presence of Dr. James W. Spain, a former US Ambassador for Sri Lanka and the UN which was organized by the UN Association of Sri Lanka with other distinguished participants. Are they all fools to preside and come for my lecture? Then what about my lecture program on Globalization and Future of the Sri Lanka Trade and Industry which too was presided by Dr. Gamani Corea and it was organised by the National Chambers of Exporters of Sri Lanka. Not only I was a NGO worker, thereafter I founded a think-tank PDIP and I did my best for a lasting solution in the war-torn country while Mr. Ranil Wickremesighe was prime minister openly and silently. That doesn't mean that I belong to his party or his supporter, but for a lasting solution to the ethnic crisis. Clearly I am not a politician or in my life time never joined in a single political party and never want to be a politician as well.

You should verify me from the articles and media releases I have submitted here, don't go for any original research about me. I kindly request, you should keep your limit.

Really I am not worried my Bio is there in the wikipedia or not.

I feel the world is so large, but some or other way my Bio has happened to be in the wikipedia and subsequently I have become an editor as well, so now I am forced to defend me.Rajsingam 10:11, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

• REPLY Please stop telling stories..I have accused you for nothing.If you have anything say of my contributions,please do so at the relevant pages. What I question here is the validity of the article and whether it should have a space in wikipedia..But so far ,I have failed to see anything other than your personal boastings..I really don't think wikipedia should be a place for you to boast of your self..While other users have warned you to not to edit your own article, you didn't listen to them,did you? Well, even if we forget all these "abuses"of wiki rules regarding editing, you still fail to justify your inclusion here.People do a lot of things in their school days, and it seems only you are boasting of them..You may have given a lecture in front of some famous people, but does that alone qualify you as a notable person ?? NOPE. You may have given a lot of dinner table lectures,does that qualify you as a notable person???NOPE. Do you know that there are tons of international seminars and conferences going on every day around the world ?? Do wikipedia need articles for every lecturer ?? You may have met US ambassador , but frankly who cares ?? You may have more German friends, that's good for you,but sorry, you can't use wikipedia to boast about it.And You can cow tow as much as you want ,but that doesn't make you a journalist..I went through almost all the article and photos ,and sorry, I don't see any notability there.Those are pretty ordinary stuff, nothing else. --Iwazaki 15:42, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

• REPLY I understand everything, but still what I don't understand is, so far other editors were trying to help in "Expanding the article", suddenly after my discussion on Talk:Anton Balasingham, an AFD tag on my article is. Rajsingam 16:05, 2 January 2007 (UTC)
• REPLY So you understand my points.Good. But You still haven't understand one thing..Your discussion at Anton Balasinghams page has nothing to do with this AFD. I really don't understand why keep playing this music from the beginning..Why don't you scroll up and see who had asked for a vote in the first place ?? Did you debate with him at that talk page ?? If not don't you think its the time to stop telling stories ?? further, You are kind of contradicting your self here.While stating "Really I am not worried my Bio is there in the wikipedia or not" , you are vigorously campaigning here to keep your article.In fact its only you who are fighting for your course here..Also stop using the articles you've created in wikipedia to defend your course.There are tons of NGO's in Sri Lanka..And you wont become notable just because you found one..Sadly, to my knowledge,You have used wikipedia for excessive advertising for your upcoming(?) book and your NGO work. You have used wikipedia to promote your self and your NGO and hopefully administrators will take necessary action regarding this.--Iwazaki 13:03, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

• Delete The only major contributors to this article are Wikimacs who creted the article which in itself was a direct copyvio from here [5], and the actual subject of the article Rajkumar Kanagasingam editing under the username Rajsingam and annonymously (note that all the IPs that have edited this page are dynamic IPs of Sri Lanka Telecom). A few newspaper articles do not constitute notability and as per WP:BIO to constitute notability

The person has been the primary subject of multiple non-trivial published works whose source is independent of the person.

This criterion includes published works in all forms, such as newspaper articles, magazine articles, books, scholarly papers, and television documentaries except for the following:

Media reprints of the person's autobiography or self-promotional works.

Works carrying merely trivial coverage, such as newspaper articles that just mention the person in passing, telephone directory listings, or simple records of births and deaths.

No proof has been given to constitute this. Thus the article is an attempt of self-promotion, and promotion of his book.

Also note the reason we have AFDs and not VFDs is is clearly justified here. By listing this as a "India related deletion" a clear attempt has been made to canvas votes for keep. --snowolfD4^{( talk / @ )} 23:21, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

The scanned newspaper articles on Wikipedia talk:Articles for deletion/Rajkumar Kanagasingam have been offered as proof the subject meets WP:BIO. There are multiple, independent and non-trivial newspaper articles on the subject. Notability is not subjective. Ccscott 01:25, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

• My comment If those explanations are coming from some other editors, I might have given thought for, but this editorUser:Snowolfd4, initially showed some resistance when I was trying to edit my native and birth place Jaffna which was just dumped with false historical information from medieval times, showing Jaffna rulers were Sinhalese and the details of the early tribes Nagas were completely left out, until I did a complete historical updates with reference. Why I also feel my Bio work is entitled for Indian deletion category is I have done my best for the Gujarat earth quake victims at a time they needed attention for their relief, by giving a lecture program Rebuilding the Indian Economy beyond natural disaster, mostly a fund raising campaign than merely a lecture, with the help of Exnora International, India and The Hindu newspaper(I have submitted reference on Wikipedia talk:Articles for deletion/Rajkumar Kanagasingam). The right tag for my Bio, I feel, should be placed "This article needs expansion" and not the AFDs or VFDs. Rajsingam 02:40, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Expand if possible'If there is appropriate content to expand it with, then it should be expanded. I ask the editor/subject why it hasnt been done already--what other notable columns have been written?DGG 07:22, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

There are a few more columns on politics and related issues I wrote, but are mostly off-line. I stopped after some time being a columnist for various reasons. I don't like to get involved expanding the article. Rajsingam 14:55, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

I thank you for your candid statement. I change my opinion to weak delete'DGG' 05:25, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Dear DGG, Thanks. As I have mentioned already about the off-line columns, I have added the following three;

* Rebuilding the Indian economy beyond natural disasters

* The challenge ahead for Sri Lanka

* How can Sri Lanka be transformed into Malaysia and Singapore? Rajsingam 09:30, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

• Keep:Seems notable enough needs to be expanded. ThanksRaveenS 16:11, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Comment- Actually he didn't released his sole book yet, so how he become notable for you? From Google hits, Eh Raveen? --♪♫ ĽąĦĩŘǔ ♫♪ ^{Walkie-talkie} 16:21, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Reply He is notable EVEN without his books.  Doctor Bruno  11:38, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Reply There are no book(s).He is definitely not notable in Sri Lanka .Is he notable in India ?? if so, could you please tell us why ?--Iwazaki 13:03, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

As per the Guidelines, Subjective evaluations are not relevant for determining whether a topic warrants inclusion in Wikipedia. Notability criteria do not equate to personal or biased considerations, such as: "never heard of this", "an interesting article", "topic deserves attention", "not famous enough", "very important issue", "popular", "I like it", "only of interest to [some group]", etc. Notability is not judged by Wikipedia editors directly. The inclusion of topics on Wikipedia is a reflection of whether those topics have been included in reliable published works. Other authors, scholars, or journalists have decided whether to give attention to a topic, and in their expertise have researched and checked the information about it. Thus, the primary notability criterion is a way to determine whether "the world" has judged a topic to be notable. This is unrelated to whether a Wikipedia editor personally finds the subject remarkable or worthy.  Doctor Bruno  13:42, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

*reply It was you who said he's notable..And I guess, I haven't received an answer to that,have I ?? Once again,why did you say he's notable ??

--Iwazaki 14:39, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

His columns in several high-profile newspapers seem to make him notable. — Wackymacs 13:38, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

*reply I had a look at what he wrote at Daily News.. Those are cow towing !! He wrote some articles praising then Government and none of them don't even deserved to be called paper articles.Further he is definitely not a journalist in SL. If he's notable just because he had some paper articles, how about all the journalist who write to papers everyday?? how many News Papers exist in the world ?? how many people write to them ?? IS everyone notable enough to have articles here?? --Iwazaki 14:39, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Reply He has written some articles, but many articles are written about him and that is what makes him notable. By the way, I don't think you have any right or credentials to determine what is a "paper articles". In my opinion, you are crossing the bounds and seem to have only one motive of getting this article deleted and you don't seem to act in the interest of Wikipedia  Doctor Bruno  15:38, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Reply can you show me those many articles written about him ??

I have no personal motives to delete this article,but it seems you have personal motives to keep it in wikipedia.I have made my self clear, a few news paper articles doesnt make him suitable to be on wikipedia. HE is not a columnist nor a journalist, Not famous in the academic field, his name is unheard in Sri Lanka.. He is just an ordinary NGO worker,just like millions of others..--Iwazaki 16:26, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Iwazaki, this is obviously all your own opinion and you seem to have something against Rajkumar Kanagasingam. He is obviously notable in his own niche field of work -- as evidenced by the newspapers, his columns and his upcoming book. — Wackymacs 14:51, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

I have nothing personal against any one.The fact that so far no one has given any reason to justify this article is astonishing.I went through the daily news articles and SORRY those are ordinary cow towing of politicians. he doesn't have his own column in any Local news papers.And , please tell me, what is his field of work ?? You mean NGO's ?? Wikipedia has been used as a propaganda tool for his book..The article starts with Rajkumar Kanagasingam is the author of the book German Memories in Asia, but the book doesn't even exist yet..The book might take months to be published, but wikipdia already says he is the author ..Amazing ,isn't it ??

Reply I think that not every journalist can give a speech on SAARC or meet two presidents. Such a person is definitely notable. If I say that "I don't know" Shakespeare and hence he is not notable, that means I am a fool.  Doctor Bruno  15:41, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

• Reply Did he give a speech at the main SAARC meeting?? Nope ! There are other meeting which goes parallel to the main SAARC meeting, and making a speech there is not an achievement at all !!Certainly it's not a thing to boast about.

Also, News papers have a column named "people" ,where anyone can published their photos even they are not that notable..Not only me, none of the Sri Lankans here don't know him !! None of the Sri Lankans I talked to don't know him !! His name is basically unheard in Sri Lanka !!--Iwazaki 16:26, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

none of the Sri Lankans here don't know him... That makes perfect sense. Thanks  Doctor Bruno  16:46, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

• Reply I made a mistake..It should be "None of them know him"..So please tell us, why is he notable in India ?? --Iwazaki 17:42, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Reply I think RaveenS might have found notable by the same Google search about the think-tank PDIP which I founded in the Daily News feature article German hamlet of Asia and also he might have found some more notability for the search (PDIP + US + state + department), the PDIP's joint activity was featured in the US State Department' Newsletter SAFE PASSAGERajsingam 02:18, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

• Keep It seems fairly obvious that he's been noted by the media enough to be considered notable. For the record, I don't know anything about the person or his work, so this is merely an observation based on the evidence. Tarinth 18:12, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.