Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Perins Community School

This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record.
The result of the debate was keep, no consensus. Mindspillage (spill yours?) 15:09, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Perins Community School

This article makes no attempt at establishing notability, the entire text is:

Perins Community School is a secondary school in Alresford, Hants, England.

and an external link that I can't get to work at the moment (although this internet connection has been intermittently flakey today). The BEEFSTEW score is 0. Also note that "Organic growth" has not worked for this article as it has not received any expansion since it was created on 2 December 2004. Those not familar with the UK education system should note that being a community school is not in itself notable - there are hundreds if not thousands accross the country. Thryduulf 13:49, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I note that now it has been expanded very slightly but it still scores 0 on BEEFSTEW. Being a "specialist sports college" isn't notable, as many (most?) successful state secondary schools have become specialist x colleges recently. As I understand it, you just have to show that you're a little above average in the local area in a particular field, and you get this status which is just a mechanism for gaining more funding for that particular subject. Thryduulf 18:22, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Delete. Substub, may as well add a list of schools in Alresford to that place's article (since that is also a stub).
  • Average Earthman forgot to sign at 16:57, Apr 20, 2005 (UTC) [1] —Korath (Talk) 18:11, Apr 20, 2005 (UTC)
    • D'oh. I've added education to the Alresford article. And some history of the town as well. Average Earthman 21:32, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
      • And I still can't type properly. Spelling of Alresford corrected in entry above. Average Earthman 21:57, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Delete. Since it's apparently the fashion to appeal to authority for school vfds these days, even Jimbo thinks it should be zotzed. —Korath (Talk) 18:09, Apr 20, 2005 (UTC)
• Delete. Non-notable- virtually every school which isn't a faith school or a city academy is called a comunity school. --G Rutter 18:25, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Delete, as per Wikipedia policy and Jimbo's recommendation. Jayjg ^(talk) 18:26, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Hmmm we seem to be making some progress on the reasons for deletion. Actually I dispute Korath's interpretation of the Jimbo thing, but I don't particularly mind deleting substubs if they've had a chance. I will still vote Keep and give it more time, because even average secondary school have important and interesting things to be said about them, like how they raised the sponsorship needed to become a specialist college, why they specialized in that field, if that choice was influenced by the sponsors, and how the specialization changed the nature and level of examination achievements. We should be able to keep quality articles on average schools, because they are quality articles on verifiable subjects which significant numbers of people might want to read about. It doesn't mean we have to accept permanent substubs on every school. Kappa 18:36, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Specialist x colleges have nothing to do with sponsorship, all the extra money comes from the Government. There are a few UK schools that have been taken over by private organsiations, but that is completely different, and they have all been failing schools - which this clearly isn't.

Any information on whether the specialist x status has had any effect on examination results would be apropriate at Education in the United Kingdom or Education in England if its not a UK-wide policy (I don't know off the top of my head) where it can be contrasted with those schools that aren't specialist x colleges, but at the level of a single school it isn't anywhere near statistically significant. The only way that it being a specialist sports college could have any impact on its notability is if it was the first or last (and it certainly isn't the latter) to become one. Thryduulf 19:38, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• "Schools are required to raise £50,000 private sponsorship, in support of their application. This proves to be difficult for some. Schools which can demonstrate they have been fund raising for at least a year can apply to the Specialist Schools Trust for a top up grant from centrally held funds" [2] The story of their specialization might not be "statistically significant", but it's interesting and informative. Kappa 19:55, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• I was apparently misinformed about the sponsorship. Thryduulf 21:02, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Keep and continue to expand. The school was cited by Tony Blair as one of the 16 most-improved seconday schools in England a few years ago. Last year it became specialized in sports, making it unique and interesting. The article is much more than one sentence now. Secondary schools should not need to prove notability. --BaronLarf 20:04, Apr 20, 2005 (UTC)

• As I have mentioned above, specialising in sports does not make it unique. Google returns ~8,400 results for "Specialist sports college", 8 of the first ten results are for different schools, those that aren't are from the BBC and are about two different schools. Thryduulf 21:02, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• Thryduulf is correct, specializing in sports does not make it unique, there are growing numbers of schools with specialized status. Kappa 21:37, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Okay, so I take it back about the sports college designation making it unique. There are 231 in the UK [3]. Even so, it should be kept. It was one of 16 schools named by Blair to be the most improved a few years ago. [4] Secondary schools should not have to prove notability. --BaronLarf 21:46, Apr 20, 2005 (UTC)

All that may mean is it used to be crap and now isn't. It doesn't feature in the BBC website's top 195 schools for GCSE results, or top 199 for 'added value'. Average Earthman 21:56, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• keep this please it looks like a notable sports college Yuckfoo 21:17, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Keep. All public institutions belong in Wikipedia.--Gene_poole 22:55, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Delete. Article has become somewhat extensive and still fails to say how this school is exceptionally notable. Deleting all non-notable school articles, whether public or private, is a long-established precedent. Changing it would be a serious mistake. -Casito⇝Talk 23:20, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Keep, deleting school articles because they don't meet the definition of notability according to a few geeks like us would be a serious mistake. This article has been expanded from nanostub to informative article since it was posted to VfD, and now establishes notability (even though it's not a requirement for inclusion). Relax and accomodate. —RaD Man (talk) 01:54, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Keep All public institutions belong in Wikipedia. Especially school's and libraries. Klonimus 03:26, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Keep. Good article as is establishes notability. Capitalistroadster 05:05, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Delete Notability is subjective. If there is any notability in the article it is not very noticable. Vegaswikian 05:58, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Delete, notability not established. "Almost all students have English as their first language." for a school in England is extremely trivial. Radiant_* 07:33, Apr 21, 2005 (UTC)
• Merge into Alresford and delete - Skysmith 09:36, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Keep - As Per all schools, I vote to keep. --Irishpunktom\^talk 11:52, Apr 21, 2005 (UTC)
• Keep It's grown to a size and level of detail that makes it worthwhile Fg2 01:57, Apr 22, 2005 (UTC)
• Delete More interesting than most, I guess, but who cares when the head took up her position? The amount of league tables and other stats would mean setting a dangerous precedent (not GWB) by keeping this. The JPS 00:30, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Keep Wikipedia isn't working to a deadline and schools are important. Oliver Chettle 02:29, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Delete. Non-notable. Noisy | Talk 11:10, Apr 23, 2005 (UTC)
• Delete Mcfly85 04:49, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Keep clearly improving Houshuang 01:08, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Delete. Notability not established. This is an encyclopedia not a directory. Master Thief Garrett 01:40, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)
  • Comment: The account User:Master Thief Garrett was created 2 weeks ago. Welcome. —RaD Man (talk) 06:48, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Keep. Wikipedia is not improved by the removal of school articles. ~leif ☺ _(talk) 20:17, Apr 27, 2005 (UTC)
• Keep. Agree with leif --Zantastik 03:07, 2 May 2005 (UTC)
• Delete. Useless collection of generic facts about an insignificant school. This is not an encyclopedia article. Individual schools are not inherently encyclopedic and there is nothing to distinguish insignificant schools like this one from thousands of nearly identical schools around the world. Gamaliel 03:11, 2 May 2005 (UTC)
• Keep. Wikipedia is not paper and schools are notable. Regardless, this article is now a bit more than a stub and is much more encyclopedic now than it was when it was listed here. - Jersyko 18:04, May 2, 2005 (UTC)
• Keep looks like a very valid School stub to me.  ALKIVAR™ 19:21, 2 May 2005 (UTC)
• Keep, it has greatly improved since it was first listed. [5] Tallyman 22:53, 2 May 2005 (UTC)

This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like some other VfD subpages, is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion, or the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.