Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Paul Douglas (cameraman)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was no consensus (keep). Canderson7 ^(talk) 19:16, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Paul Douglas (cameraman)

This article (along with James Brolan) violates WP:NOT a memorial, and also not current events. As the article was not started until after Douglas' death was reported, and only contains his obituary, he is apparently notable only for having been killed. MSJapan 02:32, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

• I am also nominating the following related page for the same reason:

• James Brolan

• Delete per nom. It's an incredible tragedy when anyone dies in the midst of war, but WP is not a memorial, and these people are otherwise non-notable. -- Kicking222 02:46, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete Non-informative. A mention in some list would be enough. CP/M 02:48, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete per nom. --cholmes75 (chit chat) 03:06, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete per WP:NOT.--Peta 03:51, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete per WP:NOT Ydam 08:21, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete both as they fail WP:BIO. Kevin 10:15, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete, Wikipedia is not a memorial, nn-bio. --Terence Ong 14:33, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete as per nom, but I wonder if there might be a place to put together a list of some sort documenting journalists who have been killed in wartime, conflicts, etc. It's not a huge group, but it's a distinct group. Tony Fox 18:14, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
• Speedy delete nn-bio. Xyrael ^T 19:15, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete Though a page should be made with all the journalists who have been killed during war. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Rhelmerichs (talk • contribs) 20:08, June 2, 2006.
• Keep I've removed the obituary text; what remains is biographical and encyclopedic. Fg2 00:33, 3 June 2006 (UTC)
  • Which is to say the article is no longer a memorial and it is no longer about a current event. Fg2 00:55, 3 June 2006 (UTC)

    Comment That still doesn't address the non-notability issue, in that no one ever heard of him until he got killed. MSJapan 02:42, 3 June 2006 (UTC)

    • Comment I get 2.7 million hits for Paul Douglas CBS. That's a lot of hits for someone no one ever heard of until he got killed. For reference, Terri Schiavo gets 4.5 million hits. If you or I haven't heard of him, we've been listening in the wrong places. But if you can direct me to the notability criteria you're referring to, it might convince me to retract my vote. Fg2 03:49, 3 June 2006 (UTC)
    • Comment: The vast majority of those hits are death and memorial-related reports (even in foreign languages) or Paul Douglas the weatherman, or unrelated people named Paul or Douglas (because of the way Google works). If you take out all the death-related words, limit to English, and add quotes to the name, you go down to 30,000 hits here, most of which are still death and injury reports, or totally unrelated items. For policies, see WP:BIO and WP:NN.MSJapan 05:10, 3 June 2006 (UTC)
      • Comment WP:BIO includes the line "This guideline is not Wikipedia policy." WP:NN begins with the line "This is an essay. It is not a policy or guideline." Fg2 20:19, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
        • Comment Actually, WP:BIO says "this is a notability criteria guideline", and NN says "there are consensual guidelines for notability". Don't wikilawyer based on one line, especially since everybody else uses these exact same criteria for AFDs all the time. This isn't a unanimous vote requiring process either, so whether your vote stays or not doesn't concern me very much, but I did point you to the criteria you wanted. MSJapan 08:08, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
        • Thank you for doing that. Fg2 01:22, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
• Merge per User:Tony Fox into an article on journalists killed in Iraq or otherwise in the line of duty. -- Mwalcoff 04:23, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
• Strong Keep Maybe y'all believe he is not notable on the internet, or as some Wikinerds say, "NN, D", but he might actually be notable in real life. Tell the Wikitruth. Bubby the Tour G 03:24, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
• Keep. Granted, Wikipedia is not a memorial, but this person is exceptionally notable, with over 374,000 relevant Google hits. [1] Silensor 03:35, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

  Comment: As mentioned above, those aren't unique hits, nor are they, in the main, hits that do not say "was killed", "died" or the like. Try my search above, removing those words, and see what you get. MSJapan 10:26, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

• Keep while I understand the policy for deleting it this man has recieved enough media coverage where someone could research him and search information about him. In addition notable deaths, in my opinion, are notable. SorryGuy 05:02, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
• Keep, notable death, a massive amount of Google hits. bbx 13:35, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
• keep please these people and death are notable any way you want to search for it Yuckfoo 16:26, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.