Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Moondance magazine

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus, allowing for improvement of the article that currently has borderline evidence of notability. —Centrx→talk • 00:33, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Moondance magazine

Moondance magazine (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs)

This article looks like an advert, does not look like it meets WP:WEB. This article was deleted by Radiant!, and is now recreated. Ideas? —— Eagle 101 ^{(Need help?)} 18:57, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

• Speedy Delete as recreation of a deleted page. --Wildnox(talk) 19:53, 24 December 2006 (UTC)
• Delete Don't think 'speedy as recreation' applies, since it was speedied before, not AfDed, but sources look slim, and it seems a fairly obvious ad (written in first-person, soliciting submissions, the usual) and might be speediable on those grounds. Biggest claim to fame seems to be an honorable mention (for which I note a quote is presented and not sourced). Can't see how this could meet WP:WEB. Shimeru 20:00, 24 December 2006 (UTC)
• Please be patient. Currently reformatting article. All first person references have (hopefully) been completely deleted. I will source the UNESCO award quote and give more detailed information on as soon as possible. Do have the 1999 committee head (UNESCO) name. ---Lysanzia 22:28, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

Just worked on article again to comply with article format policies - please review - Happy Holidays - All thanks. --Lysanzia 22:28, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

Comment The tone is better now, but the other problems still remain. Has this magazine been mentioned by any independent, third-party sources? The information about the award itself (as opposed to the magazine's receipt of it) doesn't belong -- it would on the UNESCO Prize for the Promotion of the Arts article, though (addition: if we had one...). And I remain unconvinced that an honorary mention makes this magazine noteworthy -- a reference to the award in an independent source (not UNESCO or Moondance, and not a reprint of a UNESCO or Moondance press release) would go a long way toward addressing this issue. Thank you for your efforts to address the issue, though; you've made a good start. Shimeru 01:42, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

More information (again) for article has just been added. Still working to improve entirety. Please check newest version. In reference to noteworthiness of publication. The start date for the mag (1996) places it as one of the earliest serial online mag/journals. 187,000 readers per issue may have some merit also for this case. UNESCO gave web awards up to the year 2003... so current pages showing the award for 1999 (which applies here) are much harder to produce but might be found. I'm looking now. It is possible for me to contact UNESCO directly to get an email letter issued on this for your validation needs. Thanks for all your suggestions. --Lysanzia 06:33, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Much more info on magazine history etc has just been added. All admin and eds.. please help review. Hope to have the "deletion" banner on this article lifted soon. All thanks.--Lysanzia 07:46, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

• Changing to Weak Delete -- it's a much better article, but I still see no independent sources. All of the links provided are to Moondance's site, except for one to UNESCO (referencing an UNESCO award -- so not independent for that purpose) and one to the IMDB (referencing the magazine's creator's former career, which doesn't seem relevant to the article -- and IMDB certainly doesn't mention the magazine). I would support relisting to allow extra time to find sources, because I see a good-faith effort is being made and I don't think a firm consensus has yet been reached, but without at least one independent source confirming the information, I'm afraid I can't !vote keep. Shimeru 07:55, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Oops, I missed a couple of the links at the bottom. There are, in fact, a few more that are not to Moondance's site. However, none of them seem to actually mention Moondance. Shimeru 09:27, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
• A recreation should only be speedily deleted if it's substantially similar. That is not the case here; the page I deleted was very short and lacked sources, the page as it is now has neither of those problems. I'm not entirely happy with its layout (e.g. the list under 'readership' should be prose instead), but that's a matter of cleanup, not deletion. However, the weird thing is that I can't find mention of Moondance in any of the sources mentioned, except for the Unesco one ([1], [2], [3]). >Radiant< 09:22, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

• Moondance magazine Article Deletion -Revision

Hi Radiant! Just added many external links to many university (collage level) sites that have this magazine listed in their cirriculum (most are Women's Studies Depts, some English Depts and a Political Science Consortium of 80 universities). I am pleasantly surprised so many universities are using this magazine in their classes.You can link over to review this at Moondance magazine. I'm cleaning up and trying to improve all other aspects. All thanks for your continued help. --Lysanzia 10:29, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

• Weak Delete I'm impressed that it has been around for so long, but its Alexa ranking is over 2 million; I have a hard time believing it has the readership that it claims. Maybe it has that many "hits" per month, which could translate into maybe a tenth that many actual readers? Still reads like an advertisement. --Brianyoumans 10:45, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

Hi Brianyoumans... Trying very hard not to include "pitch" language in this article. Will check on readership claim numbers and correct. Perhaps this number is page views? Thanks for your help and assistance. --Lysanzia 11:11, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

• Weak keep. List of "Academic Cirriculum[sic] Inclusions" appears to establish notability, even if it's in a small sphere. Argyriou (talk) 21:02, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
• Delete reluctantly, subject evidently has merit but lack of sources is a real issue here. Guy (Help!) 21:07, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

• Hi Guy, Thanks for taking a look at the article for Moondance magazine. I have just added a large number of sources (embedded citations [4]) for the magazine and its use in the public eye(spec. w/academia). The info added is a list of universities inside the U.S. and one in Spain that currently does use the quarterly in their their class cirriculum(s). When you said the article needed more "sources" not sure you had a chance to see this. If it's alright could you detail more comment info (in the AfD discussion [5]) about your needs that makes you want to delete this article? After I know more I can then adjust the material accordingly. Working now to closely meet all Wik standards. Thanks.--Lysanzia 23:29, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

• Changing (again) to Weak Keep. I'm concerned that a lot of the new links look less like curriculum usage than like pages of links to websites vaguely related to women's studies. I'm not fully convinced that these pages are substantially significant. However, I'm willing to accept them for now -- as an indication of notability, all those listings do put it at least marginally above a random website. Would still very much like to see a solid secondary source, but I'm willing to err on the side of caution for now and revisit the matter in a couple of months if necessary. Shimeru 04:00, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

• Weak delete. This looks like something that should be notable, because of the UNESCO honorable mention and the fact that a few university departments link to the magazine, but I'm not sure how we're supposed to write a verifiable article without reliable, independent sources that have more than one line about this organization. The result is the article is based solely on the organization's website, and that isn't encyclopediadic. I mean, for all the Gender Studies departments listed that are linking to this page, no one has written anything about this?? Find one or two, and the case for keeping this gets stronger. - Aagtbdfoua 04:46, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

• Footnote Reference Links are coming for this article. All thanks on the guidance everybody. --Lysanzia 00:18, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.