Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mike Gregoire

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was delete. Sango123 18:54, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Mike Gregoire

Subject is the spouse of Christine Gregoire, governor of Washington State. While his wife may have achieved high office, this gentleman himself is not individually notable. The page has been sitting under a redirect to Mrs Gregoire for a couple of months before being reinstated with a plea for "consensus" on its future. Deizio talk 23:09, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for the civilized discussion, Deizzio. I have a number of observations to make in regard to this AfD request:

1. What? Are we running out of disk space? <wink>

2. Let us concede that the number of minutes a page has stood unedited is no factor in its future editing.

3. Note that no concern has been expressed over the following, whose notabililty is entirely reliant on familial relationships to the powerful and famous: a) US First Ladies; b) Other US gubanatorial spouses, many of whom are first ladies/gentlemen of populations larger than several European nations; c) the spouses and offspring of any of the various European royalty; d) Shiloh Nouvel Jolie. Certainly, marriage to famous people does, in many cases, confer notability. Or shall we AfD Mrs. Clinton?

4. It is difficult to understand why Mr. Gregoire, more than any other gubantorial spouse, is the focus of concern. Surely he's at least as notable as 2/3 of the other folks on in the Spouse of Governors category.

5. Inasmuch as Governor Gregoire's politics have -- allegedly -- been intertwined with her husband's business, it seems to me that Mr. Gregoire, perhaps more than any other gubanatorial spouse, is in need of a stand-alone page.

6. Let it be known, I couldn't give a mouse's backside about Mr. Gregoire. But the same is true of my interest in Dolly Madison, Nicole Brown Simpson and Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh. We could AfD 'em all, for all I care. But Mr. Gregoire is neither more nor less notable than any of the others. --The Editrix 23:48, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

• Delete. Relationship with a notable person does guarentee notablity. In this case, Mr. Gregoire is not notable. --Danielrocks123 00:37, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete. The Jolie kid (after more than one AfD under different names) is a redirect to her mom, as are her siblings. Nicole Simpson never would have merited an article alive. I don't see an article for Patty Blagojevich. US First Lady is a very high-profile position. US state governor's spouses generally aren't. Fan1967 00:45, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete NN. -- Vary | Talk 01:10, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete. WP:BIO applies, and this person doesn't satisfy the requirements. Marriage to a person who does meet the WP:BIO test does not satisfy the test. If one's notability is entirely dependent on that of another, then that person is not notable. The examples given by The Editrix do not support the thesis that marriage to a "notable" person conveys notability. They are people who have notability in their own right, who have managed to parlay the advantages of being married to a notable person into achieving their own personal notability, or have played a significant role in the reason for their spouse's notability. The interesting trivia that this person is the first "first gentleman" of Washington can be included in Ms. Gregoire's article. Agent 86 01:12, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete although I appreciate the quite civilized defense above. Danny Lilithborne 01:16, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete as per nom. cøøkiə Ξ _(talk) 01:27, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete per Agent 86. Aplomado ^talk 01:31, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete. Notability by marriage and nothing else isn't notability: even Prince Philip's notability is from being a quoteworthy idiot. And to respond to the numbered comments above: irrelevant; irrelevant to point of being insulting; First Ladies are in the news a LOT, prove it, see first subsection answer, wrong -- try clicking that link, and Hilary Rodham Clinton is an elected US Senator -- asking rhetorical question is bad enough but asking stupid rhetorical questions is far worse; your difficulty in understanding is not our problem; there's not a shred of a breath of a mention of that in the article -- source?; and for someone who doesn't care at all, you've spent a fair number of words ladling out the smokescreen. --Calton | Talk 02:12, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
  • Comment - Could we be a little more civil please? You could easily have made the point that Mr. Gregoire is not as notable as Senator Clinton without being insulting. Also, princes and dukes (both of which describe Prince Philip) are generally considered notable per se without being quoteworthy, idiots or not. -- Jonel | Speak 02:41, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
    • More civil than what? That gaseous snow-job by User:TheEditrix? It seems to me that smarmily insulting people's intelligence is decidely uncivil, no matter how few curse words appear in it. --Calton | Talk 04:57, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
      • Comment. While I agree with every point Calton makes, I also agree with Jonel that the points could have been made more kindly. Agent 86, above, managed to make most of the same points without insulting anyone. AnonEMouse ^(squeak) 14:04, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Merge and/or redirect to Christine Gregoire--TBCTaLk?!? 02:44, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete per nom. The subject is not notable on his own merit. —C.Fred (talk) 02:59, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Keep I'd say being married to a governor is notable, even if the info is a bit sparse. --Transfinite 03:10, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Comment To be consistent, if this is deleted, I think the other gubernatorial spouses in the category of Spouses of U.S. State Governors should be looked at. Out of 50 states, only 14 other spouses are listed and one, Maria Shriver, is clearly genuinely notable in her own right. The remaining 13 look no more notable than Mr. Gregoire. It seems that people in the other 35 states have not felt the need to create an article for their state's first spouse. Fan1967 03:22, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

• Comment, Have no fear, out of fairness to The Editrix and her "why Mike?" ponderings, I intend to bring our other gubernatorial companions to the dancefloor if this is deleted and no-one beats me to it. Deizio talk 03:36, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

• The other first gentleman doesn't look notable either. Mrs. Taft is barely a stub. A few are judges. Mrs. Bush is the only decent sized article, mainly due to an embarassing incident. Fan1967 03:41, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

• Delete Being married to a governor on its own is not notable. The idea of notability by marriage or relation is a bad one.--Prosfilaes 03:59, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete and redirect to Christine Gregoire, this guy is certainly not notable on his own merits. --Deville (Talk) 04:04, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete NN. ILovePlankton 04:07, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete, fails WP:BIO. --Coredesat 05:10, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete No need for a standalone page Artw 05:32, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete If we needed to list the spouse of every politician, WP would be twice as big. WP:BIO --Alphachimp ^talk 06:03, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Redirect to the wife as per Jolie concensus). He did nothing of note himself. Mrs. Clinton was a First Lady (high position) and even if she wasn't I think she was notable on other grounds than marrying Bill (either authorship or charity work). - Mgm|^(talk) 09:08, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Redirect to wife per MacGyverMagic (or, second choice, Delete per Agent 86, Calton, et al). AnonEMouse ^(squeak) 14:04, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete NN Brookie :) - a will o' the wisp ! ^(Whisper...) 15:08, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete as subject does not meet WP:BIO criteria, but no predjudice against a redirect to Christine Gregoire if that is consensus.--Isotope23 19:31, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete not notable -->|Newyorktimescrossword 20:43, 21 June 2006 (UTC)|
• Delete appears to fail WP:BIO.--Andeh 21:34, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
• Keephe's the first person to be married to a female governor in the state. keep it.---User:Jwinter2006 23 June 2006 (UTC)

<fireworks>*Hi there! Enjoying your first day on Wikipedia?</fireworks> Deizio talk 11:38, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

• Merge and Redirect. No importance to him personally. Juansmith 23:47, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete not notable. I wouldn't merge it. He is not notable himself and there should be some privacy for non-notable pepople. --MarkS (talk) 19:19, 26 June 2006 (UTC)
• Delete. Sorry, but it does not pass WP:BIO.--Tdxiang 08:38, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.