Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Middle Eastern American

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. - Mailer Diablo 09:50, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Middle Eastern American

Middle Eastern American (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs) – (View log)

• "Middle Eastern American" is not an ethnic group. Just because one author (Joe Feagin) claims it is, does not make it so!
• "Middle Eastern American" is not an official classification in the US, the US census doesn't use it, and vast majority of publications in the US do not use it.
• No sources have been provided here that show Iranians, Turks, and other non-Arabs of the region identify overwhelmingly as "Middle Eastern American". That is because most Iranians, Turks, other non-Arabs do not identify with this British invention of a term.
• No sources have been provided which show that "Middle Eastern" refers to anything except a geographic territory. In fact, almost all legitimate sources use "Middle East" purely as geographic marker, thats all! Its not the same as "European" or "Iranian" (which includes peoples who speak Iranian languages in Afghanistan, Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, etc!)
• Iranian is not an ethnic group but a nationality and linguistic umbrella!
• Only the southwestern portion of Iran is in the geography of the Middle East. The north is in the Caucasus and the east is in Central Asia.
• Half of Turkey is in Europe! Turkey is looking to joining the European Union!
• The article excludes Armenians, Azeris, Afghans, who are all culturally and historically related to Persians and Iran! They should not be included for the same reasons here, but also Iranians and Turks should not be included for the same reasons.
• It goes without saying that there is no evidence whatsoever, none, to show that Iranians, Turks, Arabs, and whoever else some bigoted author wants to throw in, all share a common identity and culture! I mean, what the hell?! That is insane. Not even Arabs share the same culture or identity - they only share the same language.

There are many other reasons that I can list, but overall it is purely WP:OR and borderline racism by the focus on racial classification. We are not in Nazi Germany and this is not the 1930s. And I stress again and again that the American government does not use this classication and does not lump all people from "Middle Eastern" countries into one category! Khorshid 03:04, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

• Delete Middle Eastern is not an ethnicity.--Mardavich 03:09, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
• Delete per nom. This was discussed before, and there has been disputes in the article because of this: The concept is vague, and since Middle East is a vague geographical marker nobody has been able to produce a clear-cut definition of "Middle Eastern". Continents and nationalities (European-American, German-American etc) are clearly defined and depend on solid academic concensus. Even if we reduced the content of the article to this debate over its definition, than it is better off being transferred to Wikitionary. Baristarim 03:47, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
• Delete - I would have said keep but considering the article is written in a horribly fashion so its definite no. Lakers 04:45, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
• Delete per a very well-argued nomination. BigHaz - Schreit mich an 08:49, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
• Delete even with the nom's breaking of Godwin's Law right out of the gate. NeoFreak 16:11, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
  • Actually, Neutral until I can finish looking into this a little more. I don't think the problem is having an article with this term but is instead a problem with how this article is shaped right now. NeoFreak 16:19, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
    • I personally know some people of Middle Eastern descent who chafe at having to check the Caucasian box on US government forms. And the presence of various "Middle Eastern Student Associations" indicates that it's not an overtly problematic label. But, that said, while I think the concept of the Middle Eastern experience in the US might warrant some sort of article, probably with a different title, there's just no salvaging what's currently here. --JayHenry 00:20, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
      • One cannot be of "Middle Eastern descent" since there is no Middle Eastern "race". There are tens of dozens of ethnic groups in the Middle East: many are White/Caucasian, many are not (in Iran for example we have people - the Turkmen - who are of Turkic-Mongol descent and thus look completely Asian), many are somewhere in-between. Many people in the West make the mistake of thinking that there is some kind of Middle Eastern "race" but its nonsense. Whatever "shared experience" there is, as you put it, is due to such prejudices, but even then you have a problem. For instance, after 9/11, many Hindus and Sikhs and Pakistanis were attacked and harassed, even though people descended from India and Pakistan cannot be considered "Middle Eastern" because of the geography. I have heard some Greeks and Greek Cypriots describe themselves as "Middle Eastern", but again this is due to prejudice at people scoffing at the notion that Greece is a truly European country. In the end it's nonsense and WP:OR to entertain such ideas here at Wikipedia, which is an encyclopedia, not a soapbox. Khorshid 15:44, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
• Delete - Not an ethnicity. I was blown away and amazed by the nomination to come to this decision... Tohru Honda13 19:55, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
• Delete per nom, and what a nom it is! Realkyhick 17:21, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
• Delete per all of the above. Khoikhoi 09:01, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.