Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Kuopion Lyseon lukio

This page is an archive of the proposed deletion of the article below. Further comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was Keep. This is the oldest unclosed VfD ever..... Redwolf24 (talk) 02:47, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Kuopion Lyseon lukio

Kuopia, Finland high school with 450 students. No notability other than an unsubstantiated claim that it is adademically the top high school in the region. --BM 16:56, 26 Dec 2004 (UTC)

NB: the claim has been substantiated.

That comment by the article author. Andrewa 18:02, 26 Dec 2004 (UTC)

• Keep It's an International Baccalaureate school - one of a relatively small number around the world. If it's an IB school it probably is the top school in the region. --LeeHunter 16:59, 26 Dec 2004 (UTC)
• Comment'. IB does not mean a school is academically the "top" school in a region. It just means that it has a significant number of students with international backgrounds: most likely it is a school that attracts the children of expatriates living in the region, since the IB will be more recognized by universities in other countries. IF a school has a distinguished history, is significant in terms of the history of education in its region, has many famous alumnae, etc, then it should be in, but not just because it awards the IB. --BM 17:41, 26 Dec 2004 (UTC)
• Delete: First, IB isn't that exclusive. Come on! In the UK, it's very common. In the US, you've still got scores and scores of them. If that's the only reason to keep this article, then delete it and mention the school on the article for International Baccalaureate Organization (the BPO is the parent of the program, with the IBPO being the international parent). Geogre 17:44, 26 Dec 2004 (UTC)
• Delete, though it is a lot nicer article than most school vanity. --fvw* 18:41, 2004 Dec 26 (UTC)
• Comment: heh, my high school had IB students too, and even though my shcool was a pretty good school I would never say that it's a top shcool (simply because it isn't, just proving that IB doesn't mean that it's a top school) or think of writing an article about it. - Jeltz talk 22:30, 2004 Dec 26 (UTC)
• Comment: There was an attempt at a redirect to this article at Kuopion lyseon lukio. I removed the speedy tag from it and made it a proper redirect. It should be deleted if this article is.-gadfium 01:33, 27 Dec 2004 (UTC)
• Delete no more notable than any other school. Though I have to say the school looks nicer than my school did. :) Rje 01:41, 27 Dec 2004 (UTC)
• Delete.Mikkalai 04:04, 27 Dec 2004 (UTC)
• Keep. --JuntungWu 08:19, 27 Dec 2004 (UTC)
• Merge and redirect with Kuopio. -- Jniemenmaa 09:37, 27 Dec 2004 (UTC)
• Merge into Kuopio and delete - Skysmith 10:10, 27 Dec 2004 (UTC)
• Merge with Kuopio. It seems worth mentioning of its existence, but I don't feel there is that much more worth adding to it. Average Earthman 17:24, 27 Dec 2004 (UTC)
• Keep - bogus nomination - this nomination shows that the nominator did not read the Wikipedia:deletion policy before nominating - David Gerard 23:06, 27 Dec 2004 (UTC)
• Extreme keep, agree with David Gerard. —RaD Man (talk) 02:06, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)
  • The nominator, namely me, has studied the Wikipedia:deletion policy in detail. I apparently have a different interpretation of it than the Messrs Gerard and Man, an interpretation which does not seem unique to me by any means. Perhaps the honored gentlemen would care to rewrite the policy in order to make it more clear, if they are so convinced that people are misinterpreting it. --BM 02:28, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)
    • Then quote the reason you're applying here - David Gerard 09:36, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)
  • I too have studied the Wikipedia deletion policy and nowhere could I find anything that stated a school should be deleted on grounds of something so subjective as notability. Aside from the fact that educational institutions are inherently noteworthy, perhaps you can direct me to the exact verbiage that states that noteworthiness is a reason for deletion? Its as clear as black and white and as far as I can see there isn't anything to interpret, so I'm not sure what it is you're referring to. Nothing needs rewriting; certain "groupthink" individuals here need rewiring. —RaD Man (talk) 09:31, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)
    • Is it incumbent for every VfD nomination to cite the Wikipedia case law and precedents? Articles on high schools deleted as non-encyclopedic is one of the more common VfD situations, and comes up practically every day. It is even one of the specific cases dealt with in Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Precedents. The discussion centers on whether the school is sufficiently notable to warrant an article, not on whether this is a valid grounds for deletion. If you are going to take people to task for not following Wikipedia policy, please familiarize yourself with that policy, and the existing documentation on the precedents. --BM 17:46, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)
      • Yes, actually it is to at least cite a reason that matches the policy! Surely that's not too much to ask. - David Gerard 22:18, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)
• Comment: A Finnish prime minister (Paavo Lipponen) graduated from this school, and as a centrally located secondary school in a regional capital, it is very likely one of the older schools in the area and probably has other famous alumni or former teachers. However, the author seems unaware of this in just stressing the IB-bit. I would vote to keep it if the article would actually show that the history of the school is interesting be more informative as to the historical significance of the school. but as it stands, I abstain. / up+land 10:56, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC) I have been eagerly waiting to be able to change my non-vote to a "keep", but it appears I will be disappointed. Thus I vote merge with Kuopio and redirect, hoping somebody will come back and improve our knowledge of the Kuopio Lyceum and make it worth breaking out as an article of its own again. / up+land 15:18, 30 Dec 2004 (UTC)
  • Comment: An article should be judged by the content or information inside, and not its amusement value. --Andylkl 10:51, Dec 29, 2004 (UTC)
    • Who said anything about "amusement value"? / up+land 08:24, 30 Dec 2004 (UTC)
      • You said: "I would vote to keep it if the article would actually show that the history of the school is interesting". Interesting = amusing. --Andylkl 12:49, Dec 30, 2004 (UTC)
        • I see no point in a flame war over a trivial matter like this, especially as I am leaning more towards keep than delete. I changed the wording above for increased clarity, but if you had actually read what I wrote in context, you would have understood what was meant, i.e. the school is probably important, but there isn't enough "content or information" to make the school worth an article of its own - yet. I think there may well be at some later point. / up+land 15:18, 30 Dec 2004 (UTC)
          • I have to note that I have no intention in starting a flame war, I just merely pointed out what I had felt was wrong with the earlier sentence. Thanks for the clarification. --Andylkl 18:05, Dec 30, 2004 (UTC)
• Delete. Elf-friend 12:29, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)
• Keep, a substantially noteworthy school; top ranked in its region. This article has already blossomed since it began, allow for additional organic growth and expansion. [[User:GRider|GRider\^talk]] 22:40, 28 Dec 2004 (UTC)
• Keep. Schools are inherently notable. Besides, it's sure to be notable if there was a notable alumni from the school. --Andylkl 10:47, Dec 29, 2004 (UTC)
• Weak keep. Borderline notable school in its region. Note however that almost every Finnish politician, scientist, author, sport star, etc. has graduated from *some* lukio, that alone does not make the school in question notable. jni 16:36, 30 Dec 2004 (UTC)
• Keep, salva veritate. --Ryan! | Talk 17:52, Dec 30, 2004 (UTC)
• Keep appears notable enough to me Jasoncart 20:23, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
• Keep The mission of Wikipedia is to amass "the sum of all human knowledge" here. I think schools have a place within that vision. --ShaunMacPherson 21:15, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)
• Keep, agree with ShaunMacPherson. Dbenbenn 07:53, 3 Jan 2005 (UTC)
• Keep. Factual, to the point. Includes reference. Not a vanity page. Salva veritate. arj 19:09, 4 Jan 2005 (UTC)

• Keep. --Easyas12c 12:23, 15 Feb 2005 (UTC)

• Keep. Notable alumni, substantial content. --cfp 00:15, 13 Mar 2005 (UTC)

• Keep An especially notable school Klonimus 11:51, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
• Comment: Wasn't this closed back in the beginning of January? Pcb21 removed the VfD notice on January 2 with the comment "kept as per vfd." --BaronLarf 15:29, Apr 7, 2005 (UTC)

• Keep An important Article Bradybd 2:40 PM, 22 June 2005 (UTC)
• Hmmm... let me think about this for a moment... an enduring institution documented as existing in the real world for over a century, and having direct and indirect relevance to tens of thousands of people over that period... that would be a delete... oh sorry, I mean keep. Always getting those 2 confused. --Centauri 06:13, 13 July 2005 (UTC)
• Keep -> David Gerard. -- иAIяBRIAN0918  00:19, 1 August 2005 (UTC)
• Strong keep I don't even begin to see the point of deleting this article. Themindset 03:06, 1 August 2005 (UTC)
• Strong keep A notable school if anyone has any notion of the league tables for the highest performance in baccalaureate schools. Piecraft 05:52, 24 August 2005 (UTC)
• keep please but why is this ongoing since 2004 that does not make sense Yuckfoo 06:30, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in an undeletion request). No further edits should be made to this page.