Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/James Bradford (2nd nomination)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was DELETE. Can bits and pieces of subnotability in different areas add up to notability? Yes they can, but in this case the argument that they don't is not really refuted. Let me state this in a way that y'all will understand: if your Paladin of +1 NOTABILITY for MUSIC and +1 NOTABILITY for REALITY TV comes up against (say) another guy's Warrior of +2 NOTABILITY for WRITING, your guy's gonna get whacked. Herostratus 22:47, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] James Bradford

James Bradford (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs) – (View log)

Delete - article nominated once previously, closed keep. Unfortunately, in the intervening months there has been no improvement to the article. The subject does not as an actor pass WP:BIO, as he has not had significant roles in notable productions. He does not as a musician pass WP:MUSIC. The article is "sourced" by IMDB and various self-promotional music sites. The arguments advanced in the last AFD boiled down to "people edited his article so they're interested in him," not a valid argument, and "he's just notable enough," but his claims to notability are not supported by reliable sources. Otto4711 22:16, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

KEEP The consensus on Wikipedia is that reality television show subjects who have other accomplishments which are notable are notable enough for their own Wikipedia entry. James Bradford has no less than five songs on the soundtrack to a major television series and stars in a reality television show which has aired continuously on the LOGO network for almost a solid year. A link at http://artofbleeding.com/gorydetails.html shows that he particpated in a well known performance art project. I feel you are mis-stating the conclusion of the last VFD: it was not decided that he was "just notable enough" but instead that although he may not have been part of one LARGELY NOTABLE thing, he has been involved in numerous MODERATELY NOTABLE things. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 216.1.27.242 (talk) 22:34, 8 May 2007 (UTC). — 216.1.27.242 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.

• Comment - whatever the consensus of Wikipedia may be (and I agree that such consensus about reality contestants exists), the policy of Wikipedia is that such accomplishments must be reliably sourced. I don't see how I can be mis-stating the previous consensus when all but one of the ""keep" opinion were qualified with the word "weak" and when one of then was based on "cobbling together just enough little bits of notability" and another said in all capital letters that his opinion was that the guy was "JUST NOTABLE ENOUGH." He is not the "star" of a reality television program. He appeared in a single episode of a 12-episode series. His participation in the Art of Bleeding project does not appear to be the subject of any independent sources and from what I can tell from your link it appears that the extent of his involvement was that he was interviewed for it, one of dozens of people who were so interviewed. The point still stands that he does not pass WP:BIO, he does not pass WP:MUSIC and since he is not the subject of multiple independent reliable sources he does not pass WP:N. Otto4711 23:56, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

• Delete Firstly, I do think it's reasonable for stars of a reality TV series to have an article about them, like say contestants of a Big Brother show. However, having read WP:BIO and WP:MUSIC the only guideline I can see this guy passes is in WP:MUSIC. As it says in the relevant guideline thoug, "(But if this is the only claim, it is probably more appropriate to have a mention in the main article and redirect to that page.)" Mentality 18:52, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
• Delete If we are to accept the consenus that reality telly on its own doesn't dictate notability then this guy's primary claim to fame is as a music artist. However as a music artist his contributions are not sufficient to meet WP:Music. Would we consider keeping a page about someone with his musical achievements without the reality TV history? Of course not. A1octopus 12:44, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.