Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/George Alexander Arbuthnot

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Neil (►) 09:49, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] George Alexander Arbuthnot

George Alexander Arbuthnot (edit|talk|history|links|watch|logs) – (View log)

This biography says he was a Major General. I see nothing further that tells me why he was a Major General or for what it was he was notable. I hope someone can come up with some further information and save this particular Arbuthnot - if not delete it. Vintagekits 01:02, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

• Comment I see from the article on Major General that this is the lowest of British General ranks. (In the US, it is second lowest: the US Brigadier General apparently corresponds to the UK Brigadier.) (I hope I've got this right :)DGG 01:21, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
  • Comment it's the same rank (at least under NATO), for what that's worth. Not much, in my book. --Dhartung | Talk 06:59, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Military-related deletions. -- Carom 03:42, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
• Delete Absolutely delete. We can't have a biographical mini-stub for every general officer in history. Elrith 04:01, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
• Delete The provided reference has been considered in other Arbuthnot afds and has been found to not be a reliable source. It's essentially a family history written by a family member, and published through the pay press. Furthermore, it's only to be expected that members of this family will hold some sort of titular honor or administrative position of influence. If it could be shown from reliable sources that this Arbuthnot was indeed a major general and had served in a notable engagement, that would be sufficient. Deranged bulbasaur 05:10, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
• Delete, as it stands he just held a commission, but there are countless officers who did the same. --Dhartung | Talk 06:59, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
• Keep and expand. By virtue of the number of men under his command. - Kittybrewster (talk) 08:48, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
  • How many people were under his command? To what ends did he command his men? Did he do anything other than have a rank because he was born an Arbuthnot? None of those questions are actually addressed in the article. Deranged bulbasaur 09:57, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
• Delete, perhaps an article on Genealogy.com (along with his relatives), not notbale enough for wikipedia. Tiocfaidh Ár Lá! 14:42, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

Comment asearch via www.nationalarchives.gov.uk suggests there are a number of papers relating to him held by the India Office collection of the British Library. From the catalogue alone it's impossible to determine if there's actually anything there which would confer notability however. David Underdown 16:03, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

• Delete I would not say that Mrs. Arbuthnot's family history book is unreliable, but it certainly is not independent. If the General has independent reliable sources with substantial coverage of his military exploits, then an article would be appropriate. The case has not been made so far. (Nothing against Arbuthnots; I see from Kittybrewster's website that one of them married my own distant relative). Edison 16:15, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
• Comment a general officer in a major world power's military is usually notable; however, (a) no independent RS shows that he held such a position, and (b) whether the position was more than purely honorary as were often conferred for non-military services rendered to the crown. Carlossuarez46 00:38, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
• Delete per nom Giano 17:13, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
• Delete - OMG - not another Arbuthnot major general in an Indian cavalry regiment :-/ Did this one actually serve as a major general, or was he promoted on his retirement like his father? (See the now-deleted George Bingham Arbuthnot, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/George Bingham Arbuthnot, who was the Lieutenant Colonel - and so presumably in command of - the 8th Madras Light Cavalry in 1857 at the same time as his son was apparently serving in it during the Indian Mutiny.) The regiment seems to have been somewhat of an Arbuthnot personal fief - another one (Archibald Ernest Arbuthnot - not yet created, but father of Ernest Kennaway Arbuthnot) seems to have become a Major in it a bit later.[1] According to this, the 8th Madras Light Cavalry was disbanded in 1857, although if that is right, it seems a bit odd that A.E.Arbuthnot could later become a Major in it (he was born in 1841), and that a Captain George King Newberry of that regiment could be killed in action at Lingasagoor, near Shorapur, on 8 February 1858.[2] -- ALoan (Talk) 17:52, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

• How many pages ALoan are you saying are possibly flawed and of how many of those references to which you refer has Kittybrewster been the sourceGiano 18:10, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

The web is far too tangled for me to unravel. -- ALoan (Talk) 20:17, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

• "acting Second Assistant Adjutant General" doesn't typically confer notability in and of itself. The article is thin. It does have some sources but they're not articles about this person, near as I can tell. Per the nom... weak delete ++Lar: t/c 18:27, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
• Comment Well in a reversal of previous experiences it appears this Arbuthnot was raised to Lieutenant General in retirement (to quote exactly, the undermentioned Major-Generals to be Lieutenant-Generals on the Unemployed Super-numerary List. Dated 1st January, 1893 (January 20, 1893 London Gazette). Gustav von Humpelschmumpel 18:37, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
  • Slightly confusingly, four years earlier we have: Madras Cavalry- to be Colonel, Lieutenant-Colonel and Colonel in the Army George Alexander Arbuthnot, Dated 16th July, 1888. Gustav von Humpelschmumpel 18:40, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
    • Then we have Indian Local Service- Colonel George Alexander Arbuthnot, Madras Cavalry has been removed to the unemployed Supernumerary List. Dated 16th July, 1888 AND Colonel George Alexander Arbuthnot, Madras Cavalry, to be Major-General on the unemployed Supernumerary List. Dated 19th July, 1888. Gustav von Humpelschmumpel 18:46, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.